Author Topic: Apophenia's Offerings  (Read 456711 times)

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1000 on: March 01, 2014, 12:05:22 PM »
Thanks Logan!
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline Silver Fox

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1001 on: March 05, 2014, 06:22:57 AM »
Very nice!

The Schneider goes to war feel comes across very strong.

Offline Tophe

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1002 on: March 05, 2014, 08:23:49 AM »
Yes, belated congratulations for the beautiful idro with in line engine, so beautiful... :-*

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1003 on: March 15, 2014, 10:38:34 AM »
A Mini-Skycrane -- the Kelowna Flightcraft KF-61 Krane

Anticipating the retirement of US Navy SH-3A ASW helicopters, Kelowna Flightcraft began detail design of civilianized Sea King variants in 1983. The KF Fire King was a dedicated fire fighting conversion while the KF-61 was a passenger or utility transport.

In 1985, work began on a more radical rebuild of surplus Sea Kings. In effect, this was to be a reduced-scale version of Sikorsky's S-64 Skycrane. Emerging in 1987 as the KF-61 Krane, this heavy-lifter was seen as a natural for heli-logging and construction work.

Kelowna Flightcraft partnered with Fleet Aerospace of Fort Erie, ON which provided the new fuselage 'plank' to which KF attached a suitably modified SH-3A nose section and drivetrain. Fleet also began work on a new all-composite nose section for the KF-61C, a proposed Krane development with uprated Rolls Royce Gnome H.1400-2 turbines.

Something Old, Something New, Something Borrowed, and Something Composite

Fleet became convinced that aged S-61 airframes were not that popular in the civilian market. However, a healthy supply of surplus Sea King parts existed (and would grow as more SH-3s were replaced by new SH-60s). The answer, it was decided, was to marry those parts to a new, composite airframe as the FA.161 Fulmar.

Although aimed primarily at offshore platform work, Fleet elected to eliminate the S-61 'boat hull'. Instead, a more conventional tricycle landing gear was adopted. Above the roofline, the FA.161CU (Civil Utility) was identical to the S.61 and Series I aircraft re-used Sea King tail structures as well. The concept was a success and orders from civilian operators began to flow in.

For the FA.161, Fleet re-partnered with Kelowna Flightcraft and, to gain Sea King expertise, allied itself with Westland Helicopters of Weston-super-Mare, UK. KF did much of the surplus 'parts sourcing' at its Kelowna facility and rebuilt S-61 tail units at its Hamilton, ON, facility. Westland would handle FA.161 exports outside North America and supply parts -- most particularly, composite main and tail rotor assemblies.

[To be continued ...]
-----------------------------------
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline kerick

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1004 on: March 15, 2014, 10:59:02 AM »
Interesting idea. I like the look of the Sea King crane. It's so ugly, you just have to love it!

Offline Tophe

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1005 on: March 15, 2014, 12:26:20 PM »
I love those two, nicely completing the S-61 family... :-* :-*

Offline finsrin

  • The Dr Frankenstein of the modelling world...when not hiding from SBA
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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1006 on: March 15, 2014, 12:26:59 PM »
Sea King crane --- really clever concept :)
Like how it looks for what it is.  Ya got the grey cells working on that one.

Offline jcf

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1007 on: March 15, 2014, 01:23:21 PM »
Nice stuff Apo, one note though, the reason Helipro, and others, were doing the shortening
of L and N model airliners for the logging market (I worked on the Helipro project in the mid-90s)
is because Transport Canada would not allow ex US military SH-3As to operate in Canada. The
military paperwork wasn't up to snuff, in their opinion, and that model had never received a civil certification, unlike the airliner variants.



“Conspiracy theory’s got to be simple.
Sense doesn’t come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated shit
actually is than they ever are about
whatever’s supposed to be behind the
conspiracy.”
-The Peripheral, William Gibson 2014

Offline PR19_Kit

  • Likes to brag about how long his...wings are.
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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1008 on: March 15, 2014, 03:26:03 PM »
Nice stuff Apo, one note though, the reason Helipro, and others, were doing the shortening
of L and N model airliners for the logging market (I worked on the Helipro project in the mid-90s)
is because Transport Canada would not allow ex US military SH-3As to operate in Canada. The
military paperwork wasn't up to snuff, in their opinion, and that model had never received a civil certification, unlike the airliner variants.

Luckily in WhiffWorld all such paperwork is consinged to the waste bin IMMEDIATELY on printing and is ignored.  :) ;) :D
Regards
Kit

--------------------------
Any aircraft can be improved by fitting longer wings

Offline kerick

  • Responsible for all surrendered booty....Arrrr!!!!
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1009 on: March 16, 2014, 12:17:19 AM »
Here is a story about converting a Cobra to a civilian heavy lift helicopter.
http://www.helis.com/stories/mil2civ.php

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1010 on: March 16, 2014, 10:56:35 AM »
Thanks folks!

Jon: Interesting detail, thanks for that! For the sake of the backstory, would that TC ban apply only to complete ex-SH-3 airframes or to their components as well?

kerick: Wow! Thanks for the link. Converting Cobras to heavy-lift. Now why didn't I think of that ...
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1011 on: March 16, 2014, 11:00:30 AM »
Military Service for 'Canadianized' Sea King Derivatives

In 1993 the Government of Canada cancelled its CH-124 Sea King replacement orders for military EH101s -- CH-148 Petrel shipboard ASW aircraft and CH-149 Chimo search-and-rescue helicopters. It was then suggested that the Sea King-derived KF-61 Krane might suit as a shipboard VertRep aircraft to take some of the strain off of the aging CH-124B fleet.

To test this proposal, Kelowna Flightcraft loaned its demonstrator KF-61 to DND. Initially designated CH-148, the heavy-lift helicopter was assigned to HOTEF at CFB Shearwater for testing. Although the 'Sea Krane' could hoist a heavier load than the standard CH-124B, the lifter would not easily fit into existing shipboard hangars. For a production type (by now redesignated CH-161K), KF proposed a folding tailboom to shorten length and a 'kneeling' undercarriage to reduce height.

"bid most fairly for utility, honour, and happiness"

Politically, the most pressing problem was the need for a new SAR helicopter. To fill this role, the GoC adopted the Fleet FA.161 Series I aircraft as the CSR-149 Guillemot.  As with the Krane, the Guillemot designation was quickly changed, in this case to CH-161S (although the 9' series aircraft serials stuck). Other than military avionics and SAR equipment, the CH-161S was essentially the same as the civil FA.161CU.

The Canadian Forces saw the CH-161S as a limited success. It was familiar to mechanics but rather short on range compared with the retiring CH-113 Labradors. This would be alleviated somewhat with the introduction of the CH-161S-2 upgrades which included sponson pylons for new long-range fuel tanks.

[To be continued ...]
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1012 on: March 17, 2014, 04:28:23 AM »
'Canadianized' Sea King Derivatives - Utility Fulmars in Camouflage

While the CH-161S Guillemot SAR helicopter was entering Canadian Forces service, Fleet Aerospace was preparing the aerodynamically improved FA.161 Series II. The Government of Canada saw further military potential for the Fulmar but production at Fleet's modest Fort Erie facility was too slow. Accordingly, the GoC swung a deal with Bell Textron Canada.

In compensation for reduced orders of CH-146 Griffons, Bell would perform final assembly of military FA.161 helicopters.*  The first Mirabel-assembled FA.161 variants were 10 CH-161A Fulmar shipboard utility aircraft (known to Fleet as the FA.161MU Seafarer, the Navy prefered the original, bilingual name).

The CH-161As were followed by 10 essentially similar CH-161B-1 Falcons, the first order for Canadian Army FA.161UHs to complement the smaller CH-146 Griffons. Both CH-161A and CH-161B could be fitted with door-mounted C6 GPMG machineguns. The naval Fulmar carried a Wescam MX-10 electro-optical turret as standard. This E/O was an optional fit for the Army's Falcon utility helicopters.

------------

* Bell would also see some CH-146 orders shifted to B412s for the Canadian Coast Guard.

"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline jcf

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1013 on: March 17, 2014, 06:02:28 AM »
It depends on the component, but, yes it does for some. Not that the law has stopped some
Canadian firms from using Bell and Sikorsky parts of questionable origin.
 :-\



“Conspiracy theory’s got to be simple.
Sense doesn’t come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated shit
actually is than they ever are about
whatever’s supposed to be behind the
conspiracy.”
-The Peripheral, William Gibson 2014

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1014 on: March 17, 2014, 02:18:03 PM »
Interesting versions, thanks!

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1015 on: March 19, 2014, 05:16:29 AM »
Thanks folks!

Son of Sea King gains his Sea Legs -- the CH-161C Neptune

Ironically, the most challenging Canadian Forces role to fill was that of shipboard helicopter. There was no difficulty in shipboard operations -- these were already being performed by the CH-161 Fulmar Maritime Utility helicopters. Instead, the problem was an overly ambitious approach to ASW mission systems.

After considerable delays with purpose-designed mission kit, Fleet was instructed to bypass Maritime Helicopter Project sub-contractors and install refurbished HELTAS ASW gear from retiring CH-124B-2 Sea Kings. This compromise shipboard helicopter entered service as the 'Interim Maritime Helicopter' or CH-161C-1 Neptune (another bilingual name to distinguish 'C models from the utility 'As).

A modest tweek to electronics was performed under NAUP, the Neptune Avionics Upgrade Program. However, operational experience was showing that Neptune weight-gain needed to be countered with greater power. Unfortunately, General Electric had ceased production of the T58 engines in 1984. A new powerplant was needed to realize the full potential of the CH-161C.

A mid-life program -- NIMP, the Neptune Incremental Modernization Project -- introduced 1,660 shp Rolls-Royce Gnome H.1400-2 turbines as recommended by Westlands. This increase in power was absorbed by broader composite main rotor blades and a new, 6-bladed tail rotor. The most noticeable airframe changes under NIMP were the introduction of twin sponson pylons. The result was the CH-161C-2.

The final phase of NIMP introduced entirely new mission electronics, dramatically changing the profile of the Neptune's nose. The final phase NIMP upgrade also introduced an FA.161 Series III-style sliding door on the portside. Fully NIMP upgraded Neptunes were redesignated CH-161C-3.
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline Talos

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1016 on: March 19, 2014, 10:08:20 AM »
I really like that Neptune. Surprisingly nice-looking, very balanced design. The nose addition is perfect and really changes the whole feel of the chopper right there. Superb!

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1017 on: March 19, 2014, 10:35:33 AM »
Cheers Talos!

Rotory-Wing Support for the 'Men in Black' -- FA.161 SOAH/CH-161D

The FA.161 Series III portside sliding door had been introduced on the handful of CH-161Ds created for CF SOF. Technically Series IIAs, these mystery aircraft were hand-assembled at Fleet and seem never to have been assigned serials. As delivered, the CH-161D-1 (aka CH-161 SOA) was powered by 1,535 shp R-R Gnome H.1400-1s (and could be readily distinguished by their 6-bladed tail rotors).

Assigned to 427 Special Operations Aviation Squadron at CFB Petawawa, the details behind the SOA Falcons are a little sketchy. The CH-161D-2 appears to denote a defensive aids suite upgrade. The CH-161D-3 conversion involved the installation of more powerful Gnome H.1400-2 turbines and some additional optional equipment (including, as shown, an inflight refuelling probe and DIRCM pods).

The first actual Series IIIs into Canadian Forces service were CH-161B-3s for TacHel Aviation. These aircraft also had Gnome H.1400-1s and could be fitted with an optional second door C6 GPMG. Pylons and exhaust signation suppressors were also options (though rarely fitted). Half of the second Falcon order was filled with CH-161B-3 and the entire third order was comprised of Series III aircraft.
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline elmayerle

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1018 on: March 19, 2014, 08:26:08 PM »
Beautiful!!  Perhaps a re-engining at some point.  I believe the CT7/T700 would be adequate as would the equivalent engine from PWAC; the latter might also be an easier sell.

Offline jcf

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1019 on: March 20, 2014, 12:15:01 AM »
Cool stuff.

For reference here is a Sikorsky GA of the S-61N, note the different tail pylon of the L and N,
the shortened models flying around, VHI, HeliJet, Hayes etc., have that pylon:



I also have a stations/waterlines drawing along with details of the pylon, L model fixed gear,
bulkheads,etc., all copied from the structural repair manual.

Another drawing I need to scan is a GA of the Shortsky conversion I made with
old school cut-n-paste + Xerox methods.
 ;D

A couple technical things, from sta.32 to sta.110 under the cockpit floor is the E & E bay, which
is stuffed full of avionics. Behind the flight deck, on the right side, is the control closet with the
rotor control servos and AFCS electronics.

And some trivia on the logging machines, the cockpit side windows are bulged out so the pilot
can look down at the ground and some machines have a small auxiliary instrument panel mounted
on the left side in the pilot's line of vision so the engines can be monitored while looking at the
ground. They are also primarily flown from the left seat, rather than the right, when logging.

« Last Edit: March 20, 2014, 12:27:03 AM by jcf »
“Conspiracy theory’s got to be simple.
Sense doesn’t come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated shit
actually is than they ever are about
whatever’s supposed to be behind the
conspiracy.”
-The Peripheral, William Gibson 2014

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1020 on: March 20, 2014, 04:18:58 AM »
Beautiful!!  Perhaps a re-engining at some point.  I believe the CT7/T700 would be adequate as would the equivalent engine from PWAC; the latter might also be an easier sell.

Evan: You have anticipated me :)

Jon: Great stuff! And I'd love to see that S-61 station drawing.

You've answered one of my questions -- can the starboard sliding door be placed directly aft of the flight deck. Answer: not if that control closet stays in situ.

For my next incarnation, I wanted to have sliding doors on both sides. I guess they'll have to be at least slightly staggered (maybe a good thing?).
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1021 on: March 20, 2014, 04:22:19 AM »
Step-Son of Sea King -- Fleet Aerospace's FA.261 Super Fulmar

The FA.161 had local military success but civil sales were modest. Competition came from Aérospatiale's AS 332L Super Puma and Fleet Aerospace has hard pressed to escape trade show jibes about recycling 'ancient technologies'.  Another problem originated with the Goverment of Canada which was resistant to funding further development of an airframe relying on imported engines.

The initial appeal of the FA.161 had been its proven drivetrain and rotors. Now those very features had become a liability. Fleet Aerospace's solution was to find a new, Canadian-made engine for its now-proven Fulmar airframe. The initial choice was a turboshaft version of the 1,590 shp PW115. But Pratt & Whitney Canada's elected to shelf that engine in favour of more powerful variants. So, a turboshaft PW120 derated to 1,650 shp was settled upon for the FA.261 Super Fulmar.*

To prototype its new concept, Fleet Aerospace began conversion of an FA.161MU airframe that had been returned to the OEM after suffering a major engine fire. CH-161A serial 161912 was fitted with twin, rear-mounted PW120TS turbines and a new transmission. To balance this new powerplant arrangement, the forward fuselage was extended (and an enlarged sliding door installed). Thus modified, the redubbed FA.161PW flew to test the engine installation.

After concluding its test period, the FA.161PW was shipped to Yeovil where Westland re-engined it with twin 1,500 shp Rolls-Royce Turbomeca RTM322 engines. This engine was to be the European standard for FA.261s (although the type was offered assembled with PW120TS powerplants as an option for the European market).
________________________________

* The PW120 was chosen as the basis for a turboshaft variant for its wider use in Canada (compared with the PW118).
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1022 on: March 27, 2014, 09:55:53 AM »
Got inspired by Jon's coverage of the unbuilt Harry Miller/Keith Rider V16-powered racer.
http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=3909.0

Harry Miller also built V16s for Ford's 1935 Indy 500 submission. So, I decided to 'Fordify' the Rider-Miller design as a sportster/fighter aircraft...

Top - A sportster with an IV-1200, evaporation cooling, conventional open cockpit, longer undercarriage legs, and Ford Flivver-style rudder-steered tailwheel.

Bottom - The revised Ford F1600 fighter, a bid for a USAAC light fighter. Upright V-1200 engine, Prestone cooler, larger tailplane, and a more conventional tailwheel.

Scrap view - Ford F1600 fighter as revised with a collector tube replacing individual exhaust stubs.
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline jcf

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1023 on: March 27, 2014, 12:57:48 PM »
Very nice stuff.  :)

One little note, the 1935 Miller-Fords were powered by Ford V-8s, pretty much
standard flatties turned back-to-front driving the front wheels. Miller and his
crew designed the cars, but not the engines.
 :)

“Conspiracy theory’s got to be simple.
Sense doesn’t come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated shit
actually is than they ever are about
whatever’s supposed to be behind the
conspiracy.”
-The Peripheral, William Gibson 2014

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #1024 on: March 27, 2014, 03:25:38 PM »