Author Topic: Apophenia's Offerings  (Read 459787 times)

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #675 on: December 18, 2012, 01:37:26 PM »
Cheers arc'.  No background story on this one ... I didn't even come up with a decent name. Any suggestions?
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline Logan Hartke

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #676 on: December 18, 2012, 02:07:07 PM »
How about "Blixten"?  It means "lightning bolt" in Swedish, I believe.

Cheers,

Logan

Offline raafif

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #677 on: December 18, 2012, 02:48:12 PM »
the I.Ae.27 jet looks great !  I think that partial drawing with frontal intake would be the one for the Argies to use on a production aircraft -- that seems to be the way they think :)  Of course a bit more sheet-metal around that engine wouldn't go astray either ;)

Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #678 on: December 18, 2012, 09:29:14 PM »
EH: Absolutely! As soon as that 1984-era  Tornado F2 had a lock on with its top-shelf Blue Circle radar, that poor Sleipnir would be toast  ;D

You are right. I suppose I'll just have to leave it to the Nimrods to 9Lima their arses after they've nuclear depth bombed iceland's rubber dingy collection! Mwuhahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PS The Argentine Dewoitine is rather nice!
« Last Edit: December 18, 2012, 09:31:47 PM by Empty Handed »

Offline upnorth

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #679 on: December 18, 2012, 10:36:13 PM »
That Argentine Dewotine  is gorgeous! kind of looks more Italian than French in origin though, Looks like something that might have come off the Fiat line.

It also gives me a bit of inspiration for a new fighter I'm trying to cook up for my "Stealing the Stuka" story.
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Offline Tophe

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #680 on: December 19, 2012, 07:58:19 AM »
The prototype I.Ae.26, combining French-made and Argentine parts, flew in December 1945.
:-* I love this one. Belated congratulations!

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #681 on: December 19, 2012, 12:05:18 PM »
Thanks folks!

Logan: I'm liking Blixten ... it fits but, also, it's just a cool looking word  :D

raafif: Agreed on the snub-nosed version for the Argies. I was aimed at a halfway house between the long-nosed original and the RW I.Ae.27 Pulqui I.

EH: "Hard a-starboard, hard a-starboard! Icelandic rubber dingy collection trying to ram!"  ;D

upnorth: Spot on! The Tifone is in a slightly modified Fiat G.55 cowling ;)  Looking forward to seeing what you cook up for a "Stealing the Stuka" fighter.

Tophe: Thanks, I enjoyed that one too. I've got a few more Dewoitine evolution ideas but they will be French scenarios.
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #682 on: December 20, 2012, 08:28:05 AM »
http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=351.msg33985#msg33985
I forgot to mention in my D.520-based Pülü entry, that there was a Real World Dewoitine-related I.Ae.26. The Proyecto I.AE. 26 has a convoluted parentage. In 1944, Émile Dewoitine went to Spain with his D.550 project (a 1,300 hp D.520 derivative). Hispano Suiza built a mockup as their HS-50. When the Buchon was chosen instead, Dewoitine took a development (the D.600) to Argentina. The D.600 because the RW I.Ae.26 which was to be powered by a DB601A.

Here's an oldie to illustrate the real I.Ae.26 proposal:
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline Logan Hartke

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #683 on: December 20, 2012, 08:38:59 AM »
That's pretty interesting.  I like it.

Cheers,

Logan

Offline Tophe

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #684 on: December 20, 2012, 08:46:49 AM »
Great! :-*

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #685 on: December 20, 2012, 01:35:11 PM »
Thanks lads. These unbuilt projects are sort of like whifs ... or that's what I tell myself  ;)

Shipboard Dewoitine D.520 Derivatives for the Aéronautique Navale

The Dewoitine D.780 (another real project) was intended to provide a modern naval fighter for PA-16 carriers, the Joffre and Painlevé. In reality, the Aéronautique Navale received only standard D.520s. But this is whifland ... so, here is  the prototype Dewoitine D.780. After its sea trials aboard the Béarn, the D.780 was transferred to Esq AC3 at BAN Cuers-Pierrefeu in SE France.

Later, AC3's D.520s and the D.780 were joined by the first 2-seater, the prototype D.782 (a whif). Intended as a light attack fighter for the Joffre, the D.782 lacked the manoeuvrability of the single-seaters. To acheive a better balance, the ventral radiator bath was to be moved to the nose. The prototype was returned to Toulouse but the conversion work had just began when France fell to the Wehrmacht.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2013, 07:14:33 AM by apophenia »
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline Tophe

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #686 on: December 21, 2012, 12:44:12 AM »
I like this 2-seater added to the family, thanks!
(Could you maybe make from it a training version without machine gun?)

Offline Cliffy B

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #687 on: December 21, 2012, 03:17:06 AM »
Love the naval version!!!  That two seater needs some ordnance  8)
"Radials growl, inlines purr, jets blow!"  -Anonymous

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Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #688 on: December 21, 2012, 01:36:24 PM »
Tophe: There was no trainer version of the D.792. Perhaps you were thinking of the D.580 two-seat trainer?

The Dewoitine D.580 began as a 1939 study but, due to pressures to produced D.520s, the trainer was not built until after WWII. The production D.580, powered by a 572 hp Renault (SNECMA) 12S, served with the Escadrons d'Instruction en Vol at EPAA (École de pilotage de l'armée de l'air), BA Cognac Châteaubernard. The armed D.591 served as colonial aircraft and armaments trainers.

The pre-war D.590 avion de course followed on from the D.550 racer but was a slightly larger to accommodate more fuel. Power was a specially boosted Hispano-Suiza 12Y-61AC, producing  1800 hp at low altitude. Evaporative cooling was used. The D.590, F-ADEW, flew briefly in early 1940 before being grounded for the duration of the war.

[BTW, both the D.580 and D.590 were real projects ... but I have absolutely no idea what they woiuld have really looked like!]
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline Tophe

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #689 on: December 21, 2012, 01:53:27 PM »
[BTW, both the D.580 and D.590 were real projects ... but I have absolutely no idea what they woiuld have really looked like!]
Do you want me to check my Trait d'Union magazines collection? Maybe they're illustrated inside.

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #690 on: December 24, 2012, 01:19:45 PM »
Do you want me to check my Trait d'Union magazines collection? Maybe they're illustrated inside.

That would be much appreciated Tophe ... I'd love to know what they actually looked like. With any luck, mine will look nothing like them  ;D
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline Tophe

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #691 on: December 24, 2012, 02:52:16 PM »
I have checked the index and, sorry, D.580 & D.590 are just mentionned without picture, in issues 190, 191, 192 of Trait d'Union... Maybe your drawings will be used by future historians...

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #692 on: December 26, 2012, 11:01:29 AM »
Thanks for checking Trait d'Union Tophe! If future historians use my images, I'll be persona non grata over on Secret Projects  :o

Does anyone remember the Dewoitine D.527 C1, a 1/48 resin kit whif by Pend Oreille Models (PR4835)? I was intrigued  by the concept but wondered whether they got the wing placement. Pend Oreille moved the P-51A's laminar flow wing aft on the D.520. Based on the Spiteful, I'd have thought the wing should be moved forward (can any of the
engineers confirm which is right?)

Anyway, I decided to have a whack at the D.527 myself. My version (based on a pair of D.520s by Georges Olivereau)  has the Mustang wing pushed forward. For fun, I also decided to adapt the P-51A radiator bath and retractable tail  wheel.

The second aircraft I've called the SNCAM M.521M. Here I'm imagining that Midi was not absorbed by SNCASE and that, desparate for a postwar product, the firm attempted an update of the Merlin-engined D.521. The M.521M has a Packard  V-1650-7 in a P-51D derived cowling and radiator bath matched with a P-47D bubble canopy.
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."

Offline Tophe

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #693 on: December 26, 2012, 11:15:15 AM »
I love your new ones, both, while my favourite is the 521M :-*

Offline ChernayaAkula

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #694 on: December 26, 2012, 11:32:55 AM »
I love your new ones, both, while my favourite is the 521M :-*

My thoughts as well. Simply gorgeous!  :-*
Cheers,
Moritz

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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #695 on: December 26, 2012, 11:40:36 AM »
I'd have to view comparative details on the aircraft involved (cg location, quarter-chord line intersection with aircraft centerline, etc.) to give an intelligent answer.  As a rough quesstimation, if the new engine weighs close to what the old one did, then as long as the new wing's quarter chord line crosses the aircraft centerline at the same location that the line for the old wing did, I'd call it "good".  Now if the new engine shifts the cg, then you have to start moving things around.

Offline raafif

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #696 on: December 26, 2012, 12:58:34 PM »
I like both the D.527 & M.521M :-*   The 521 fuselage looks a bit wrinkled tho - did it have a crash  ??? ;D

Offline dy031101

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #697 on: December 26, 2012, 01:10:55 PM »
Putting that M.521M side-by-side with a P-51D and a P-40Q...... um......

It's like joining a club!  :-*
« Last Edit: December 27, 2012, 12:08:29 PM by dy031101 »
Forget about his bow and arrows- why wait until that sparrow has done his deed when I can just bury him right now 'cause I'm sick and tired of hearing why he wants to have his way with the cock robin!?

Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #698 on: December 27, 2012, 12:51:57 AM »
The M.521 is nice! I love the idea of SNCAM remaining a separate entity!
« Last Edit: December 27, 2012, 12:53:35 AM by Empty Handed »

Offline apophenia

  • Patterns? What patterns?
Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #699 on: December 27, 2012, 09:32:05 AM »
I like both the D.527 & M.521M :-*   The 521 fuselage looks a bit wrinkled tho - did it have a crash  ??? ;D

Yes, the M.521M was a rebuilt 520 with a healthy parts injection from the local USAAF scrapyard. Rejected for postwar French service, SNCAM rebuilt her once more as a test article for V tail. SNCAM referred to this conversion as the AE-EFV (l'avion expérimental - empennage en forme de V).

The AE-EFV didn't last long but donated its tailplane to a D.520 for modified for prone-pilot trials. The latter received no designation but was referred to as the AE-PCV (l'avion expérimental - pilotage couché, sur le ventre) or simply the  «baignoire».  More to come ...
"Like a hog dance; Like a pig dare; Mind warp deceptor wan ..."