Modelling > Scenarios
Realistic alternative RAN FAA options
Volkodav:
Part 1, options for the initial acquisition of the capability
1. Jellicoe recommended the Australia procure a number of carriers to support the two proposed Fleet units
2. Australia builds a small carrier instead of the Seaplane Carrier HMAS Albatross
3. Australia obtains or orders a carrier as part of a pre-war rearmament program
4. The UK loans or transfers one or more carriers to the RAN during the war
5. The RAN provides the personnel to crew one or more UK carriers during the war
6. The UK transfers a surplus carrier or two to the RAN post war
7. Australia buys a still in build carrier or two from the UK post war (as actually happened)
Part 2, options for the retention of the capability through the Cold War
1. Modernise existing carrier(s) to operate modern aircraft (planned, did not happen)
2. Modify carrier(s) still in build (as actually happened)
3. Order new build carrier(s) incorporating improvements (proposed)
4. Purchase already modernised / modified carrier(s) (proposed and preferred option)
Part 3, retention of or replacement of the capability late / post Cold War to present day
1. Decide CTOL or STO/VL
2. Modify existing carrier(s)
3. Purchase existing suitable / modernised ship
4. Build suitable design
Over arching requirement is for Australia to develop a grand strategy and stick to it. Assume carriers are determined as required to fore fill the objectives of the strategy.
Bits and pieces I have picked up over the years (some read some heard and unconfirmed)
1. UK intended to transfer HMS Hermes to the RAN during WWII prior to her loss to the Japanese
2. UK considered transferring or at least employing Australian crews on Implacable and Indefatigable
3. UK considered transferring a Colossus Class CVL (as part of a balanced squadron) to Australia
4. Australia initially planned to upgrade HMAS Sydney upon the delivery of HMAS Melbourne
5. The UK offered HMS Hermes (in her CTOL configuration) to Australia in the mid 60s :)
6. The RAN wanted the F-4J Phantom and lobbied for the acquisition of a modernised Essex to operate them. :o
7. Options besides a modernised Essex considered included a new build Essex or CV01 ???
8. Australia was postulating a two ocean navy in the late 1960s and would require three carriers as part of this plan ;D
9. HMS Hermes, Victorious and Eagle were all available at various points from the mid 1960s to the mid 1970s 8)
10. Following the Falklands the UK proposed that Australia would build two replacement LSL for them following on from Tobruk and they would build us a modified Invincible in a barter deal
11. The cost of a replacement carrier (or, depending on the option selected, two) to operate the RANs existing Sea King and Wessex helicopters was less than the cost of buying the Seahawks and modifying the first three FFGs to operate them
12. Hermes / Viraat will likely remain in service in India until the mid 2020s
13. The RN determined that HMS Hermes could operate 20 Skyhawks in addition to AEW/COD Gannets, ASW Sea Kings and SAR Wessex.
As an aside, had Australia bought Hermes in 1968 how would the RN have faired in the South Atlantic in 1982 without her? Could Ark Royal have been retained longer to cover the gap?
PR19_Kit:
--- Quote from: Volkodav on November 23, 2013, 07:46:54 PM ---As an aside, had Australia bought Hermes in 1968 how would the RN have faired in the South Atlantic in 1982 without her? Could Ark Royal have been retained longer to cover the gap?
--- End quote ---
I doubt the Task Force would have sailed with only one deck to fly from. The Hermes carried a lot more aircraft than the Invincibles did, and even if they'd rushed the Illustrious through to an operational state there wouldn't have been a lot of Harrier capacity down South with just the two of them.
If the Ark was still in service in 1982, doubtful but possible with a LOT money being spent on her, I doubt Argentina would have even thought about invading the Falklands. With the Ark's air group of Phantom FG1s, Buccaneer S2s and Gannet AEW3s their Air Force and Navy wouldn't have stood a chance. Buccaneer strikes against the mainland would have been a strong possibility I'd have thought too.
Volkodav:
Pretty much what I was thinking too.
I read an account that mentioned that Bulwark was surveyed with the intent of reactivating her for the Falklands but she was in too poor a condition.
My ideal would be that the RAN transitions from Melbourne and an upgraded Sydney to Hermes and Victorious with the earlier CVLs being retained as training and commando carriers. As much as I would have loved to see Sea Vixens, Bucks and AEW Gannets in the RAN FAA I think Australia would have been better served with Skyhawks, Trackers and maybe Tracers, especially if the Skyhawks received a suitable upgrade incorporating a radar.
The other thought I had was that instead of ordering the second batch of Skyhawks in 1970 Australia ordered a batch of AV-8A to serve on Melbourne and possibly Sydney as well as with the RAAF. Another story I heard was that Australia came close to ordering a mix of F-15s and Harriers to replace the Mirage and the Skyhawk.
Old Wombat:
I could see your starting point being a RAN purchase of 2 Hermes class carriers in the mid-1920's as part of the 2 ocean navy concept, with the option to build a 3rd (not taken up due to the Depression) & the construction of dry-dock & repair facilities in Port Adelaide, chosen because it is roughly midway between Sydney & Perth, & is relatively stratigically secure from both directions (not completed due to the Depression).
In the late-1930's construction of the dry-dock & repair facilities is completed, & construction begins on a more modern carrier of either Australian design (based on experience with the Hermes class ships) or of a simplified Illustrious class.
Just an idea. ;)
:)
Guy
Volkodav:
--- Quote from: Old Wombat on November 23, 2013, 11:01:11 PM ---I could see your starting point being a RAN purchase of 2 Hermes class carriers in the mid-1920's as part of the 2 ocean navy concept, with the option to build a 3rd (not taken up due to the Depression) & the construction of dry-dock & repair facilities in Port Adelaide, chosen because it is roughly midway between Sydney & Perth, & is relatively stratigically secure from both directions (not completed due to the Depression).
In the late-1930's construction of the dry-dock & repair facilities is completed, & construction begins on a more modern carrier of either Australian design (based on experience with the Hermes class ships) or of a simplified Illustrious class.
Just an idea. ;)
:)
A modified Ark Royal with a single instead of double hanger?
Guy
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