Modelling > Scenarios
M.A.D's 'Alternative Australian Defence Force Order of Battle' Questions please
M.A.D:
G'day gents
I don't know if this is the right/best place to have this topic (apologies to admin, if it isn't!), but I've made a start on my 'Alternative Australian Defence Force Order of Battle' (henceforth denoted as 'Alternative ADF ORBAT')
I don't claim to be an expert by any stretch of the imagination, but its my hope to make this as realistic as possible (in terms of monetary and capability, as far as Australia is concerned!). So if the forum would allow me, I will be leaning on the knowledge, experience, and expertise of forum members for they're inputs please.
The compilation of my our work will be compiled and put up in a chronological dated order in a stand alone post titled 'Alternative ADF ORBAT'!
A few guiding points that I have enshrined in my 'Alternative ADF ORBAT', is the ADF/Governments adherence to a non-risk approach to the selection and acquisition of weapons/weapons systems/weapons platforms (My continuous frustration and anger at the 'real world ADF/Governments unabated pathetic Post-WWII history of acquiring/committing to 'off the drawing board' weapons/weapons systems/weapons platforms... M60 GPMG, F-111, Collins Class sub, F-35 JSF...., I think Ive made quite clear and obvious!). So as much as I am happy to have a reasonable hybrid arrangement, I'd prefer my 'Alternative ADF ORBAT' not employing fictitious or drawing-board design proposals.
Geo-politically, I'll keep Australia in the Western sphere of influence (but not as in the pocket of Britain or America, as is the real-world case). So as much as I love Soviet/Russian weapons/weapons systems/weapons platforms, I'll have to forego big-ticket items like MBT, Kirov class battlecruisers and Typhoon SSBN's ;)
If I can I would like to start by asking the following first couple of questions:
Armoured Car
Im looking for advice ‘re an armoured car design of the early 1950’s era, for my ‘Alternative ADF ORBAT.’
Its principle role/mission being that of reconnaissance by force, direct fire support, and an anti-armour capability.
I perceive it needing to be wheeled for both endurance and cost effectiveness (both in terms of unit and running costs).
I perceive it having the minimum of a 75-76mm high-medium velocity gun, to perform all three of its principle combat roles/missions effectively, with equal emphasis on its HE and AT capability/performance!
Its armour needs only to resistant to 7.62mm – 12.7mm at best
It needs to have a realistic/sensible operational weight, as it will be the main component of the ADF’s RRF for the following two decades.
It will need good cross-country mobility, and be able to endure the hardships of the Australian outback, jungle/tropics environments.
Its not a necessity to be amphibious, although it would be advantageous.
Im locking forward to your input, suggestion and input.
Diesel Engine
Gents, I'm after a couple good, reliable and proven diesel engines immediately after the Second World War (excluding Soviet designs). Predominantly, I'll need one for tanks, SPH ..... and another smaller/less powerful diesel for the likes of APC's ...... (In particular something to power a tank the size and weight of say...a Centurion and one to power a vehicle the size and weight of say...a M3 Half track ;D)
M.A.D
Rickshaw:
Armoured Car
Basically you have a choice of either ex-WWII stock such as the US M8 or Staghound armoured cars. Alternatively, you have the British/South African Marmon-Harrington series. Then you have the Australian Rhino armoured car.
From post-war developments you're faced with a choice of the following:
British - Saladin with 76mm gun.
French - Panhard (various models, mounting guns from 20mm up to 75mm)
There are no post-war WWII armoured cars (as in turreted vehicles) from the US.
GTX_Admin:
I wonder how you would go having a developed version of the Sd.Kfz. 234 series?
apophenia:
The V-8 Meteorite was offered as a diesel. Why not just say that Rolls-Royce created a similar V-12 Meteor diesel adapation?
The only other British V-12 diesel I can think of was the 600 hp Paxman 12TPM ... but its a 58 litre brute! http://www.paxmanhistory.org.uk/paxeng34.htm#12tp
Greg's mention of the Sd.Kfz. 234 got me thinking German. How about the Daimler-Benz MB507 of 720-850 hp? I don't think DB ever restarted MB507 production but what if captured Schnellboote engines were reverse-engineering in postwar Australia? The MB507 is a little bigger than the Meteor but the Daimler's aluminum block would save weight.
During the war, the US used twinned Detroit Diesel 6-71s - the Model 6046 - in tanks and tank destroyers. Not enough power for the Centurion but would suit your SPH. Then you could use single 7.0L Detroit Diesel 6-71 engines in your APCs, etc. (and possibly 4.7L 4-71s in support vehicles).
Weaver:
--- Quote from: Rickshaw on April 30, 2016, 06:27:35 PM ---Armoured Car
Basically you have a choice of either ex-WWII stock such as the US M8 or Staghound armoured cars. Alternatively, you have the British/South African Marmon-Harrington desires. Then you have the Australian Rhino armoured car.
From post-war developments you're faced with a choice of the following:
British - Saladin with 76mm gun.
French - Panhard (various models, mounting guns from 20mm up to 75mm)
There are no post-war WWII armoured cars (as in turreted vehicles) from the US.
--- End quote ---
For an early 1950s service entry, you're looking at the Panhard EBR-75 (available 1951) as the French choice (the lighter AML series didn't come in until 1960 for export):
Available: 1951
Weight: 13 tonnes (14 short tons; 13 long tons)
Length: 6.15 m (20 ft 2 in)
Width: 2.42 m (7 ft 11 in)
Height: 2.24 m (7 ft 4 in)
Crew: 4
Range: 630 km (390 mi)
Speed 100 km/h (62 mph)
Suspension : 8x8 wheel
Armament: 75 mm high velocity gun (90mm option from 1963), plus 3 or 4 rifle-calibre MGs
Engine: 12-cylinder engine 200 hp
(engine position is unusual: possible cooling issues in Aus? They were used in N.Africa though)
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