Author Topic: MiG-3Y Utka  (Read 2050 times)

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
MiG-3Y Utka
« on: January 13, 2018, 11:14:29 PM »
I got from Unicraft a Mig-3 model, that I plan to build in a canard layout (YTKA in Russian, pronounced Utka). ;)
I thought it was a Novo injection kit but it is a vacform... ???

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2018, 11:16:34 PM »
Here is the project, but what glue to use? how cutting, how holding? solid?

Offline Frank3k

  • Excession
  • Formerly Frank2056. New upgrade!
    • My webpage
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2018, 04:28:14 AM »
Tophe, vacuforms are usually made from styrene or (less likely) ABS so your average model glue will work. Clear parts for vauform kits are usually made of Buterate; you can us PVA  (polyvinyl acetate) to hold it in place.

Here's a good primer (there is no part 2): http://www.clubhyper.com/reference/vacformbg_1.htm

 

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2018, 12:50:45 PM »
Thanks a lot for these directions, very helpful! :smiley:

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2018, 05:14:36 PM »
Of course I may imagine a Zwilling version, I may draw it, but I will not build it.

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2018, 07:30:59 PM »
I have started separating parts. I love the presence of 4 (half) tailplanes. As I am never building a perfect model for every side including from below, just acceptable on some photographs from precise angles, I consider this model will have 2 set of tailplanes: foreplanes and T-tail planes.

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2018, 10:49:47 PM »
I consider this model will have 2 set of tailplanes: foreplanes and T-tail planes.
Like this (and I think I will not use the fragile propeller):

Offline Brian da Basher

  • He has an unnatural attraction to Spats...and a growing fascination with airships!
  • Global Moderator
  • Hulk smash, Brian bash
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2018, 02:32:36 AM »
I really like that last concept, mon ami!

I can imagine it in WW II 1940 Armée de l'Air camouflage.

Frank has given you some rock-solid advice on glues. One thing I usually do with vacforms is insert a bit of sprue running through the fuselage wing root to hold the wings on. This will give you a stronger attachment than just butt joining them.

Best of luck and I know I'll enjoy watching this one come together!

Brian da Basher

Offline elmayerle

  • Its about time there was an Avatar shown here...
  • Über Engineer...at least that is what he tells us.
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2018, 01:24:51 PM »
Going for a second-stage experimental to follow the MiG-8?

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2018, 11:38:54 PM »
Yes, maybe this is the Historical/technical explanation (in our dreams) ;)

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2018, 06:09:50 PM »
Even cutting the parts separate is not easy... The best tool I have found is scissors...

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2018, 08:55:38 PM »

vacform is not easy, but with patience you can do it  ;)

Offline Frank3k

  • Excession
  • Formerly Frank2056. New upgrade!
    • My webpage
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2018, 02:00:22 AM »
If you can build - and finish a Unicraft kit, then a vacuform should be easy. Just think of it as a plastic model with far too much flash on the parts.

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2018, 11:06:15 AM »
(With my poor standards in quality) I love Unicraft kits, yes I do.
Simply, vacform seems a new learning for me and I fear I may fail, I will see.

One of my major failures in the past was the handling of thermoformed clear canopies, and I keep that strongly in my mind. Even if the white thermorformed parts here may be a success at last, I will not use the thermoformed canopy of the MiG-3, just painting black the "canopy", and this is a reason to invent further, like this:

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2018, 02:40:46 AM »
One thing I usually do with vacforms is insert a bit of sprue running through the fuselage wing root to hold the wings on. This will give you a stronger attachment than just butt joining them.
Do you mean a vacform model is intermediate between an injected plastic model and a paper model?

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2018, 05:24:23 PM »
The parts are now separated/cut, ready to build, but I fear this will not be easy, maybe with adhesive tape holding parts during glue drying?

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2018, 11:07:45 PM »
My adhesive tape try is not very good but it shows the project:

Offline perttime

  • The man has produced a Finnish Napier Heston Fighter...need we say more?
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2018, 12:15:02 AM »
I recall some articles mention reinforcing fuselage and/or wings. I've been wondering if polyurethane glue and water can be used to fill a vacform component.... I think it takes just a little water to start it foaming.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOB87l-r6Io

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #18 on: February 04, 2018, 05:08:12 PM »
I have not this product. I just started to glue, holding it with tape while drying, solidifying... (I hope):

Offline Brian da Basher

  • He has an unnatural attraction to Spats...and a growing fascination with airships!
  • Global Moderator
  • Hulk smash, Brian bash
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #19 on: February 06, 2018, 10:52:47 PM »
One thing I usually do with vacforms is insert a bit of sprue running through the fuselage wing root to hold the wings on. This will give you a stronger attachment than just butt joining them.
Do you mean a vacform model is intermediate between an injected plastic model and a paper model?

I'm sorry I missed this, Tophe. I've been ill with flu which is less fun than PSR.

I didn't mean to suggest that but now that you mention it, one could think of vacforms as intermediate in structural strength when compared to paper and plastic models. Whether or not you want to reinforce the wing joint might depend on the plastic. I've had some vacs where the sheet was so thick it didn't need any reinforcement. I often use scissors myself on these kinds of kits. The ones from the former Eastern Bloc countries are especially tough.

I really like where you're going with this model and I think you will soon have us delighting in your latest marvel, mon ami!

Brian da Basher

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #20 on: February 07, 2018, 12:57:35 AM »
Thanks for these details!
I have used your sprues recipe, thanks for that too!
And I have put a thin layer of putty, not to dissolve the fragile plastic. There will be more and more later. :smiley:
Good recovery from the flue, Brian.

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #21 on: February 08, 2018, 02:34:47 AM »
And, as well, a first little layer of putty on the underside, reinforcing the spars:

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2018, 07:07:09 PM »
The silhouette is more attractive with the spinner glued in place. I will have putty work to operate there also.

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #23 on: February 11, 2018, 06:41:36 PM »
4 half wings will be biplane or tandem wings

Offline Brian da Basher

  • He has an unnatural attraction to Spats...and a growing fascination with airships!
  • Global Moderator
  • Hulk smash, Brian bash
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2018, 04:00:48 AM »
That's coming along quite nicely, mon ami!

You have some serious vac skills!

Glad I could help a little, Tophe.

Brian da Basher

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #25 on: February 25, 2018, 01:29:35 PM »
Thanks again.

Well, I went on a little, sanding the propeller basis bulbs on the spinner, alas that produced holes (see below, left), thus more and more putty (below, right):

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #26 on: March 02, 2018, 01:07:51 AM »
After the first sanding, it takes shape, but lot remains to be done...

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #27 on: March 11, 2018, 01:53:10 AM »
Now that the paint work of the other model (Gee-Bee Zwilling) is finished, I have been authorised (by myself) to continue the sanding of the MiG-3, then starting to glue the lifting areas...

Offline Brian da Basher

  • He has an unnatural attraction to Spats...and a growing fascination with airships!
  • Global Moderator
  • Hulk smash, Brian bash
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #28 on: March 11, 2018, 02:41:59 AM »
It looks like you're having a wonderfully productive weekend, mon ami.

There is something meditative about sanding. I've been doing a fair bit of it myself lately.

Watching with interest,

Brian da Basher

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #29 on: March 11, 2018, 08:13:36 PM »
Continuing to glue and support with pieces of sprues. This is impossible this way for most of you, serious modellers, but as I ignore the underside, it is all right for me... ???

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #30 on: March 11, 2018, 09:00:47 PM »
Continuing to glue and support with pieces of sprues. This is impossible this way for most of you, serious modellers, but as I ignore the underside, it is all right for me... ???

that is an interesting method  ;) you are right, it makes it possible to strengthen the things from below

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #31 on: March 11, 2018, 11:17:16 PM »
Thanks!
And this is less shocking with a few drops of paint making the extra parts and "normal" parts look like each others:

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #32 on: March 12, 2018, 12:57:49 PM »
Painting the main side now, like a normal (solid) model:

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #33 on: March 13, 2018, 12:23:08 PM »
The model is finished! The first vacform of all my life! Almost a success (according to my poor standards)!

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #34 on: March 13, 2018, 03:21:36 PM »
 :smiley:

the cockpit is very streamlined


Offline Brian da Basher

  • He has an unnatural attraction to Spats...and a growing fascination with airships!
  • Global Moderator
  • Hulk smash, Brian bash
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #35 on: March 13, 2018, 05:28:11 PM »
That really finished up nice, Tophe!

It has a very fast, sleek look, like a racing plane.

Well done, mon ami!

Brian da Basher

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #36 on: March 14, 2018, 02:29:54 AM »
Thanks!

the cockpit is very streamlined
In fact, the cockpit is flat, like on a few racer prototypes of the 1930s...

Offline Robomog

  • Would you buy a used kit from this man?
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #37 on: March 16, 2018, 05:49:03 AM »
I tend to treat vacforms as a scratch build project, good luck with this on Tophe, it's looking good so far.


Mog
>^-.-^<

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: MiG-3Y Utka
« Reply #38 on: March 17, 2018, 10:21:19 PM »
good luck with this on Tophe, it's looking good so far.
Sorry, there will be nothing further for me: my models have no landing gear, no roundels, no engine exhausts, seldom propellers... ??? ;)