Author Topic: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank  (Read 2929 times)

Offline apophenia

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Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« on: November 12, 2016, 01:26:03 PM »
NATO Standard Tank - 120 mm (NST-120)

This sprang from the Secret Projects thread 'NATO Standard Tank for the 60s and 70s'. Most responders went for the Leopard 1 (and I agreed). Abraham Gubler suggested combining "... the best from each nation ... Basically a bigger Leopard 1 with Chieftain style hull and turret castings." http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,28064.msg293404.html#msg293404

The rationale is that the appearance of the T-62 made the planned Europa-Panzer concept obsolescent (the German Leopard is abandoned although the French persist with their AMX-30). The only NATO tank capable of defeating the T-62 is the FV4201 Chieftain but early models of this British tank are underpowered and suffer poor reliabilty records. For NST-120, an improved version would be developed.

Initially, the NST-120 program had only four European countries involved - Britain, German, the Netherlands, and Belgium (the US chose to go with the M60A1, the French with their AMX-30). The NATO Standard Tank was basically a Chieftain with German drivetrain, Dutch electronics, and Belgian secondary armament. For a fairer workshare, the Netherlands and Belgium would also produce ARV and AEV variants.

Shown here is the German NST-120 - the Kampfpanzer Lwe A2 mit 120-mm-Gebohrtenkanonen. Armed with the German equivalent of the Royal Ordnance's 120 mm L11A2 L/55 gun, this tank was powered by a 1,100 hp V-10 MTU MB 843 Ka501 diesel. The Kpz Lwe A2 differed from the British Army's similar Chieftain Mk.4 primarily in having a TEM 2A Optical range-finding system andflexible tracks skirts (armour skirts would not appear on the German tanks until the Lwe A3A1/Lwe A4).

The NST-120 initially served Britain as the second-series Chieftain; Germany as the Lwe; the Netherlands as the Leeuw; and Belgium as the CCSO (Char de combat standard de l'OTAN). Later marks served Denmark and Norway (Lve); Sweden (Strv 120 'Lejon'); Italy (Leone); Spain (Len); Greece (λιοντάρι/Liontri); and Turkey (Aslan).

The final variant was the German Lwe A10 mit 120-mm-Glattrohrkanone. Armour protection was strengthened (including mine protection), a 1,600 hp MB 843 Ka901 engine fitted, and main armament switched to a new smoothbore gun - the Rheinmetall NPzK-120 or Neue Panzerkanone 120-mm-Glattrohrkanone).
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Offline Volkodav

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2016, 01:40:47 PM »
Interesting, I have a Leo I in the stash and there are a couple of Cheiftains at the LHS (all Tamiya).  Whats the idea, engine deck, side skirts, what else?

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2016, 03:14:01 AM »
Interesting.  Wil we be seeing derivative vehicles?
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Offline apophenia

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2016, 10:02:39 AM »
Volkodav: You've got it. The big differences for the RW Chieftain are the engine deck, suspension/track, and track covers. All the rest of the changes are more superficial and would depends upon which army and which exact variant.

For example, the German Lwe A1 and Dutch Leeuw 1 had no track covers at all while the British Chieftain Mk.4 had the full armour skirts of the 'all-Brit' Mk.2. The earliest variants had 12.7mm FN ranging guns. Those were replaced on the Lwe A2 (as shown) with an optical range-finder, on later British and Belgian marks with LF-2 laser range-finders.

Of course, the real beauty here is that since I'm making all this up, so can you  ;)

GTX: Thanks Greg. It was going to be a one-off but now I'm wondering about more ...  >:D
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Offline Volkodav

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2016, 10:19:41 AM »
Thanks.

Very tempting, I had been thinking of an MTU engined Chieftain for a while, i.e. Antipodean Armour Fest and the Australian Tank Brigade that used them while the Cavalry used Leos.

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2016, 12:49:38 PM »
I'm thinking SPAAG and SPH variants at least.  The former could use Gepard or Marksman turret whilst the latter might use a GCT 155mm turret.  One might also see some export variants...
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Offline taiidantomcat

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2016, 03:20:39 AM »
That ha a great look to it!!  :-*
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Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2016, 04:14:03 AM »
Nice! :)

Looks believable & do-able (only, I won't 'coz I'd have to buy more kits & I've currently run out of places to hide the additions).
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Offline Volkodav

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #8 on: November 14, 2016, 05:58:44 AM »
Nice! :)

Looks believable & do-able (only, I won't 'coz I'd have to buy more kits & I've currently run out of places to hide the additions).

With my stock rotation system I may be able to do something, just need to complete some models and I can buy some new ones.

Offline buzzbomb

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #9 on: November 14, 2016, 06:17:31 AM »
love it.
Just about to finish the Takom Chieftain Mk10 so I have the Modern Brit thang happenin'

Offline apophenia

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2016, 11:47:51 AM »
Thanks folks!

The British Army's SP80 Project to replace stalled SP70 resulted in the NATO Standard Tank-based AS80 or, more properly, the Gun Equipment 155mm L128 (AS80). Initial studies for SP80 featured the Vickers GBT 155 turret but, as an economy measure, the AS80 received refurbished turrets from British Army M109A2s.

The AS80 served only with the British Army. Other members of the NATO Standard Tank group chose to upgrade M109s instead. The AS80 served alongside the FV488  Gun Equipment 105mm L109 (Abbot).
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Offline LemonJello

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #11 on: November 14, 2016, 08:45:11 PM »
Oh, so well done! The Lowe just looks the business - and I agree with GTX - more variants are more better.  The AS80 is an impressive creation in its own right.

Offline Weaver

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #12 on: November 14, 2016, 09:18:15 PM »
This is a great idea!  :)

I've been toying with the idea of a Germanized (Germanated?) Chieftain too. In my case it would be a straight UK-FRG deal whereby the UK buys a Britishized Marder (one of which I've got half-finished).
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Offline Volkodav

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2016, 06:18:05 AM »
This is a great idea!  :)

I've been toying with the idea of a Germanized (Germanated?) Chieftain too. In my case it would be a straight UK-FRG deal whereby the UK buys a Britishized Marder (one of which I've got half-finished).

The Chieftain actually fits war time German thinking, i.e. independent heavy tank battalions supporting divisions and corps while the medium /MBT Leopards, M-47 and M-48 battalions are organic to the mechanised (Grenadier) and armoured brigades.  It also fits the post Cold War practice of using the lighter Leopard 1A4 and A5 for mobile or rapid deployment forces while the various Leopard 2 versions were retained for the heavy formations.

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Lwe - NATO Standard Tank
« Reply #14 on: November 16, 2016, 02:04:08 AM »
The Chieftain actually fits war time German thinking,

But didn't the Germans (and the British for that matter) tend to change their practices after WWII as a result of perceived lessons learnt?
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