Author Topic: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration  (Read 51750 times)

Offline AGRA

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #30 on: May 18, 2012, 08:02:00 PM »
The question began when I remembered reading somewhere that Yak-41 (a.k.a. Yak-141) is primarily intended for shore-based operation as its exhaust heat is considered too hot even for the heat-resistant materials available for the former Soviets to build flight decks with.

I wonder if having the aircraft hovering alongside the ship rather than directly over the ship itself would help alleviate the problem......

Also, is there other STOVL designs (East and West, of all timeframes) that might have the same "too hot for carrier flight deck" problem?  I mean Mirage IIIV, VJ-101, D188A, and a few others from the West also uses liftjets.  How far along is the West when it comes to making heat-resistant flight deck?

Actually, how different a challenge is fabricating a flight deck capable of supporting the above-mentioned aircraft from, say, the jet blast deflectors on CATOBAR or STOBAR carriers?

The too hot for flight deck VTOL thing is mostly unsupported. The exhaust flow at full power is usually very limited in time enabling the deck to recover. Hovering over or beside the ship isnít the issue but the last seconds before touch down. Also you can cool the deck (run water through pipes under it) or use a grill with jet blast channelling like on Soviet ships.

The biggest flight deck problem I know of was the F-4K Phantom cross decking onto US Essex class. Because the Phantomís jets are canted downwards and the Spey produced a lot of extra mass flow and velocity in the exhaust it set the wooden flight deck on fire. But these Phantoms had no problems on their own carriers. Itís all about designing the plane for the ship and the ship for the plane.

Offline dy031101

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #31 on: May 19, 2012, 09:03:39 PM »
Hovering over or beside the ship isnít the issue but the last seconds before touch down.


I brought this one up because I was doing a Shipbucket drawing of a Skyhook carrier, which does not use flight deck as the primary mean of recovering aircraft  ;D

Also you can cool the deck (run water through pipes under it) or use a grill with jet blast channelling like on Soviet ships.


Did the Soviet anticipate naval use when the Yak-41 was still on the table?  So far as I have read, some said no and others didn't even bother.

The biggest flight deck problem I know of was the F-4K Phantom cross decking onto US Essex class.


I know that it was thought to be do-able but never know that it was done before.  But it has to be done one ships with angled-deck modification, no?  And doesn't it have metal flight deck?
« Last Edit: May 19, 2012, 09:05:15 PM by dy031101 »
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Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #32 on: June 11, 2012, 04:30:26 AM »
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

Online finsrin

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #33 on: June 21, 2012, 01:53:04 PM »
In the stash we bought is a 1/700 Shinano. 
Figuring the sinking story was a cover for Shinano taking only one torpedeo which slowed it and kept Japanese busy with damage repair while first ever RAN/USN Seal team snuck aboard then took over.  All it took was one radioman coerced with offerings of Hershey bars and cigarettes into radioing IJN that all is lost and last of crew was abandoning ship.  Where upon RAN/USN sailed it to Australia for study and repair.  In mid 1950's Shinano was refitted by RAN with contemporary systems, an angle deck, renamed to ???.  With successive modernizations the former Shinano served into the 1990's or is it still serving today with 21st Century systems and aircraft?
Decided to keep the kit in hopes building as configured in one of decades from 1950's to ?
Bill

Offline RussC

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #34 on: June 21, 2012, 11:58:49 PM »
In the stash we bought is a 1/700 Shinano. 
Figuring the sinking story was a cover for Shinano taking only one torpedeo which slowed it and kept Japanese busy with damage repair while first ever RAN/USN Seal team snuck aboard then took over.  All it took was one radioman coerced with offerings of Hershey bars and cigarettes into radioing IJN that all is lost and last of crew was abandoning ship.  Where upon RAN/USN sailed it to Australia for study and repair.  In mid 1950's Shinano was refitted by RAN with contemporary systems, an angle deck, renamed to ???.  With successive modernizations the former Shinano served into the 1990's or is it still serving today with 21st Century systems and aircraft?
Decided to keep the kit in hopes building as configured in one of decades from 1950's to ?
Bill


Excellent concept! With a concrete flight deck, could have served with updates , including reactors - until present day. Would have an angled deck eventually along with deck edge elevators. Current airwing would be Hornets hopefully not in boredom gray.

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #35 on: July 21, 2012, 03:08:28 AM »
RFS Vladivostok,DCNS concept - modified French Mistral class amphibious assault ship (BPC/LHD)for Russia:



The first BPC is scheduled for delivery in 2014, the second will be delivered in 2015.
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Offline Logan Hartke

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #36 on: July 21, 2012, 03:57:13 AM »
Neat.  I was looking for an image of one with Russian modifications earlier today.  Looks neat with the Russian CIWS on the stern.

Anyone else still half-expect to see the deck painted green?

Cheers,

Logan

Offline dy031101

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #37 on: August 27, 2012, 09:36:09 AM »
Someone made Shipbucket-grade drawings of the Japanese helicopter carrier (pre-Hyuga; rejected in favour of Haruna- and Shirane-class DDHs) project here.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2012, 09:37:49 AM by dy031101 »
Forget about his bow and arrows- why wait until that sparrow has done his deed when I can just bury him right now 'cause I'm sick and tired of hearing why he wants to have his way with the cock robin!?

Offline Cliffy B

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #38 on: August 27, 2012, 10:44:58 AM »
You have to join or be a member to see anything larger than thumbnail  :-\  From what I can see they look rather neat though.
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Offline TerryCampion

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #39 on: September 24, 2012, 10:10:04 PM »
Found this one....

Offline dy031101

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« Last Edit: October 07, 2012, 11:47:42 AM by dy031101 »
Forget about his bow and arrows- why wait until that sparrow has done his deed when I can just bury him right now 'cause I'm sick and tired of hearing why he wants to have his way with the cock robin!?

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #41 on: December 02, 2012, 04:32:00 AM »
Turkey to build first domestic aircraft carrier - sounds very much like a LHD/LHA to me.
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

Offline elmayerle

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #42 on: December 02, 2012, 05:50:26 AM »
Turkey to build first domestic aircraft carrier - sounds very much like a LHD/LHA to me.

Indeed.  what would be most "interesting" is if the final design had a "ski-jump".

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #43 on: December 02, 2012, 06:34:12 AM »
I wonder if you will see Greece wanting one now...not that they could afford it.
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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Aircraft Carrier Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #44 on: December 02, 2012, 06:49:30 AM »
I wonder if you will see Greece wanting one now...not that they could afford it.
I wonder how much they'd have to hock to afford and equip one?  I wouldn't wonder if one could pick up some recently used aircraft that way.  It could make for interesting whifs with various customers purchasing some of their older aircraft.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2013, 05:29:52 AM by elmayerle »