Author Topic: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration  (Read 13401 times)

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #60 on: June 16, 2018, 06:22:35 AM »
Supposedly a real proposal:


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Offline jcf

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #61 on: June 16, 2018, 06:27:07 AM »
 1969?
That seems awfully late for something with that layout.  ???
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Offline M.A.D

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #62 on: June 22, 2018, 01:16:05 PM »
Interesting, particularly from the whif point of view, unbuilt Crusader variants from the new Specialty Press book:

VFA Crusader with more attack capability and a second hard point under each wing
All-weather F8U-2 with slightly larger radome, no guns, and carrying Sparrow III's

Ohhh, any drawings of these proposals?? :P

M.A.D

Offline Volkodav

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #63 on: June 22, 2018, 07:29:19 PM »
How about an F/A-8 Crusader instead of the A-7, a true F-8 derivative instead of virtually a new aircraft of the same configuration?  This likely would have sold quite well, imagine it with all the A-7 operators, as well as a number of countries that opted for supersonic fighter attack types.

Offline tankmodeler

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #64 on: June 23, 2018, 02:29:26 AM »
How about an F/A-8 Crusader instead of the A-7, a true F-8 derivative instead of virtually a new aircraft of the same configuration?  This likely would have sold quite well, imagine it with all the A-7 operators, as well as a number of countries that opted for supersonic fighter attack types.
The Crusader really didn't have a lot of spare lifting capability with a max payload, including fuel, of 7 ton. The Phantom's, by comparison was double that at over 14 tons. It's also instructive that the primary stores points were on the side of the fuselage (even though the wings could take 2000 lb each) which suggests that the wing hinge and elevation mechanism wasn't terribly happy with extra wing loads during landing and take off.

So you'd probably have to redesign the wing and the mechanism to handle higher loads. Of course, once you've done that the effect ripples through the aircraft in terms of higher weights and lower overall performance and possibly shorter range. Certainly, the aircraft didn't have long legs and loading it up with bombs wouldn't help that at all. The Crusader really isn't a terribly good candidate for turning into a multirole or strike fighter mostly because it had been quite optimised as a daytime visual range dogfighter. It's instructive that neither the Yanks nor the French moved to upgrade the Crusaders to carry BVR missiles which seems to indicate that they were too specialised to be worth the upgrade. And remember, one of the reasons the Crusader had the variable incidence wing was to allow it to take off and land with a wing that required either too high a landing speed or too great a nose up attitude to generate the needed lift at carrier speeds. Increasing loads, dirtying the wing or changing it substantively would possibly result in the inability to carrier deploy or in a larger wing, further degrading performance.  They really did optimise the Crusader as a day fighter.

Paul

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #65 on: June 23, 2018, 04:30:16 AM »
Crusaders with wing stores:



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Offline kitnut617

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #66 on: June 23, 2018, 08:33:41 AM »
Apart from thinking those bombs aren't big enough     :P :P :P  what are those pods mounted on the Sidewinder rails ?

Offline ed s

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #67 on: June 23, 2018, 09:59:42 AM »
Apart from thinking those bombs aren't big enough     :P :P :P  what are those pods mounted on the Sidewinder rails ?

The bombs are Mk-84 2000lb bombs. Plenty big enough to ruin someone's day. The pods are rockets. Each pod carries two 5 inch Zuni rockets for 4 on each side and 8 total. But the F-8 never was considered a very effective or useful ground attack bird.

Ed

Offline Volkodav

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #68 on: June 23, 2018, 02:25:38 PM »
So in a nut shell the excellent day fighter F-8 wasn't a very good attack aircraft while the excellent Attack A-7 wasn't a very good fighter.  Maybe something half way between the two could have been good enough, or more than good enough at both....


Oh wait a second, isn't that what I suggested in the first place  ;)

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #69 on: June 24, 2018, 03:34:32 AM »
Something akin to the V-1000 or Super V-1000?



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Offline tankmodeler

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #70 on: June 26, 2018, 03:12:26 AM »
Crusaders with wing stores:
Exactly. There's not much actually hanging on those wings. 2000 lb per wing I think was the max. according to Wiki.

Offline elmayerle

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #71 on: July 15, 2018, 02:04:25 PM »
How about an F/A-8 Crusader instead of the A-7, a true F-8 derivative instead of virtually a new aircraft of the same configuration?  This likely would have sold quite well, imagine it with all the A-7 operators, as well as a number of countries that opted for supersonic fighter attack types.
According to the recent Specialty Press book on the F-8, there was a study, V-456, that added another hardpoint to each wing of the F-8.  This ended up being a waypoint in the evolution of the "Attack Crusader"/Corsair II from the Crusader.  Might be worth modeling in USMC markings.

Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #72 on: July 16, 2018, 02:07:38 AM »
Wing-Tip mounted AAM launch rails should also be a must-have for any new build or refurbished Crusader. 
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Offline kitnut617

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #73 on: July 16, 2018, 02:31:42 AM »
Crusaders with wing stores:
Exactly. There's not much actually hanging on those wings. 2000 lb per wing I think was the max. according to Wiki.

I wonder if that had more to do with the variable incidence jacking system the F-8 had. Maybe not able to handle too much weight on the wing.

Offline tankmodeler

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Re: Vought F-8 Crusader Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #74 on: July 17, 2018, 12:55:17 AM »
Crusaders with wing stores:
Exactly. There's not much actually hanging on those wings. 2000 lb per wing I think was the max. according to Wiki.

I wonder if that had more to do with the variable incidence jacking system the F-8 had. Maybe not able to handle too much weight on the wing.
Very likely, I suspect. Mind, the entire wing system may have been built lightly to limit weight, so having decided that the aircraft was primarily a dogfighter, they could have purposely decided to limit everything else in an effort to lower weight and increase speed/acceleration.

So the jacks may be designed at the same time as a wing that can also only take the 2000 lb loads, etc. etc. as the whole thing is optimised for the dog fight mission.

Paul