Author Topic: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV  (Read 37951 times)

Online Jeffry Fontaine

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Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« on: March 20, 2012, 06:03:47 AM »
Marder IFV

Wikipedia - Marder IFV

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(Image source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Marder1A3.6.jpg)


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TAM (Tank) and VCTP

Wikipedia - TAM (Tank), VCTP, VCA 155, VCTM, VCPC, VCLC, VCA (Med-Evac), and VCRT

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(Image source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:TAM_snorkel.JPG

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Puma IFV

Wikipedia - Puma IFV

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(Image source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SPz_Puma_Mobilitätsversuchfahrzeug_VS2.jpg)

PSM (Krauss-Maffei Wegmann - Rheinmetall Landsysteme) - Puma

KMW (Krauss-Maffei Wegmann) - Puma

Army Recognition.com - PUMA Technical Data Sheet and Images

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Links to models of the Marder IFV/TAM Family of Vehicles built by Diethelm Berlage at Track-Link.net (hot-linking images is not allowed):

VCTP with Mine Roller

VCTP, UN in Croatia

VCLC rocket-launcher

VCA 155mm Howitzer

TAM / TH 301 Prototype

VCTM mortar carrier

VCI Marder 1A3

Marder KUKA M12 Project, 1998

TH301/TAM Tractor

The gallery containing all of Diethelm's Models at Track-Link.net

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I recall seeing some drawings in a German modelling magazine many years ago for an Infantry Fire Support Vehicle based on the Marder IFV that was armed with a 57mm auto-loading cannon, 7.62NATO machinegun in a turret that was very low profile. 

Other ideas for the Marder:

Turret from the M42 Duster to create a low-tech air defense vehicle. 
Armored logisitcs vehicle by removing the sides of the troop compartment and making a cargo bed.
Bradley IFV turret instead of the regular turret to make an updated IFV with integral ATGM capability.
 
« Last Edit: March 20, 2012, 06:25:07 AM by Jeffry Fontaine »
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Offline ChernayaAkula

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2012, 10:37:37 AM »
<...>
I recall seeing some drawings in a German modelling magazine many years ago for an Infantry Fire Support Vehicle based on the Marder IFV that was armed with a 57mm auto-loading cannon, 7.62NATO machinegun in a turret that was very low profile.  <...>

That was the "Begleitpanzer 57" (escort tank 57). It was also to be equipped with ATGMs.
 Apparently a private venture, they found no customers. I think it's interesting that the concept was (kinda) revived with the Russian BMPT.
Cheers,
Moritz

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Offline dy031101

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2012, 10:46:22 AM »
What's the elevation of the stock ATGM mount?  I'm thinking of the crude way of simply replacing the MILAN launcher with a MANPADS.
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Online Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2012, 01:44:56 PM »
<...>I recall seeing some drawings in a German modelling magazine many years ago for an Infantry Fire Support Vehicle based on the Marder IFV that was armed with a 57mm auto-loading cannon, 7.62NATO machinegun in a turret that was very low profile.  <...>
That was the "Begleitpanzer 57" (escort tank 57). It was also to be equipped with ATGMs.
Apparently a private venture, they found no customers. I think it's interesting that the concept was (kinda) revived with the Russian BMPT.

Yes indeed, that was the one.  I recall someone building a model of the thing and was hoping to find images of it on-line but so far no luck. 
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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2012, 02:28:06 PM »
Posted these on What-If a couple years back.





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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2012, 02:31:18 PM »
VCTP also from Modell-Fan



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Offline ChernayaAkula

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2012, 07:59:36 PM »
What's the elevation of the stock ATGM mount?  I'm thinking of the crude way of simply replacing the MILAN launcher with a MANPADS.


A good friend of mine was a Marder commander. I'll ask him when I see him the next time. But I don't think there is much in the way of elevation. The ATGM mount on the Marder is just a kind of clamp that fixes the Milan and associated bits by clamping the normal folded-up tripod to the vehicle. There are a couple of really good pics in THIS WALK-AROUND.  I also don't think the Milan launcher proper can elevate that much. With the way the ATGM mount fixed in place on the turret, I don't think there's much lateral movement either. Anything apart outside of 11-1 o'clock and you really have to twist yourself out of the hatch.
I just remember that the SOP for firing the Milan from the vehicle includes swinging the turret to the 11 o'clock position and depressing the 20mm gun all the way.

If you want to have the MANPADS power-operated from within the vehicle, I suppose the best bet is to fix a Stinger or two to the external MG3 mount on the turret.
Cheers,
Moritz

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2012, 08:02:07 PM »
Moritz, did the Heer end up doing away with that external remote MG3 at the rear of the vehicle in the later variants?  That might be a place to put a RWS with a MANPADS attached.

Regards,

John
Regards,

John

Offline Weaver

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2012, 08:56:41 PM »
You can get a fairly good analogue of the VCTP in 1/72nd by just cross-kitting a Luchs Turret onto a Marder hull - Revell have done both vehicles.

Stalled project for a British Army fire-support version:


« Last Edit: March 20, 2012, 08:59:07 PM by Weaver »
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Offline ChernayaAkula

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2012, 09:18:13 PM »
^ Neat!  :)

Moritz, did the Heer end up doing away with that external remote MG3 at the rear of the vehicle in the later variants?  <...>

Yup. They dropped that when they converted them to Marder 1A2 standard.
Cheers,
Moritz

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Online Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2012, 11:09:52 PM »
Posted these on What-If a couple years back.

Thanks for sharing once again Jon.  Much appreciated. 
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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2012, 06:56:23 AM »
Posted these on What-If a couple years back.

a couple years back ?  Gee time flies when you're having fun , I thought it was only last year some time !

Now that marder with the Beer kegs at the back gives me ideas  8)

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2012, 04:32:47 PM »
How about a dedicated SPAAG Marder?
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Offline ChernayaAkula

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #13 on: March 22, 2012, 01:20:29 AM »
^ Here you go, Greg!  :)

One version with an M163 turret and one with the turret of an CV9040 AAV:



I find the one with the CV9040 turret especially nice to look at.

So much for the easily kitbashable (is that a word? If not, it should be!) options. I suppose you could also whif a Roland turret to incorporate some guns (instead of the SAM).
Or how about a Wildcat turret?

Cheers,
Moritz

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Re: Marder IFV, TAM, and Puma IFV
« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2012, 02:17:02 AM »
 :) :) :)
All hail the God of Frustration!!!