Author Topic: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!  (Read 17658 times)

Offline Weaver

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British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« on: August 05, 2014, 03:19:17 AM »
Okay, I'm in with this little project, which combines two things I bought at the Bolton Show back in January (with no initial intention to combine them): an Airfix Skyvan and and S&M decal sheet for British Antarctic Survey aircraft.

The Budgie will be getting a re-arranged interior, possibly external tanks and a radar nose, and certainly the skis from the Twin Otter pictured, and will then be getting the decals for the real life BAS Twotter seen at the bottom of the sheet.



The colour is a surprisingly interesting issue: the decal sheet simply describes it as gloss red, and it certainly isn't dayglo orange. However, it's a distinctly orangy red and I'm not sure that any straight-from-the-tin Humbrol shade replicates it. IIRC, the rattle-can dayglo I have is translucent and very affected by the undercoat colour, so my first thought is that dayglo-over-red may do the job. I shall be conducting experiments.....

« Last Edit: November 11, 2014, 01:30:15 AM by Weaver »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
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Offline buzzbomb

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2014, 06:38:00 AM »
Hmm. this appears to be quite a natural for this environment.

Offline kitnut617

  • Measures the actual aircraft before modelling it...we have the photographic evidence.
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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #2 on: August 05, 2014, 07:22:14 AM »
The shade of red for a Canadian Maritime Patrol aircraft, the CanMilAir Decals instructions say to use ModelMaster Guards Red over a gloss/satin white primer.  It comes out quite a bright colour (wing tips and tail planes).
 

Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #3 on: August 05, 2014, 09:17:29 PM »
Looks like Xtracolour Red Arrows Red XO14 (might also be known as signal red) would be a close match, it's more an Orangy red as against
Post office/roundel/cherry red, which is just red ;) if you know what I mean

Regards
Keith

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2014, 12:03:45 AM »
Okay well after an interesting discussion over on What If Modellers, I've come to the conclusion that I'm going to use Hu.174 Signal Red for this one. Now the discussion about colour shouldn't have prevented me from starting, but in the process I looked at a lot of pics taken inside BAS aircraft and I realised that my interior fit probably wasn't a good idea.

An airliner-configured Skyvan has six rows of seats, each consisting of two seats on the left and one on the right, separated by an aisle. At the back, a three-quarter bulkhead has some basic galley equipment on it's back (can't find a good pic of exactly what). What I was going to do was have three double seats at the front, with a personal gear rack next to them in place of the single seats, then the galley bulkhead turned around 180 degrees, then the cargo compartment. However, two things have struck me about this:

1. BAS aircraft carry a LOT of cargo, and significant proportion of it is fuel drums, which are very heavy and have to be loaded with due regard for the aircraft CofG. In my layout, all the cargo would be in the rear half of the cabin, and that might cause CofG and tipping issues.

2. BAS aircraft have detachable seats and they use that facility regularly and flexibly, fitting just enough seats for the number of passengers and leaving the rest of the cabin free for cargo. They don't seem concerned about galley facilities (the Twotters tend to do short-haul anyway) and nor do they seem bothered about separating the passengers from the cargo in the event of a crash. Those two observations remove my rationale for the bulkhead, which would be much more difficult to make QD than the seats.

So instead, I'm going for a more flexible layout: no bulkhead, all the single seats in place and the space next to them free for cargo. That means that cargo can be positioned freely lengthways.

Some aircraft interior shots from the BAS's own website here: http://www.antarctica.ac.uk/living_and_working/aircraft_and_vehicles/index.php

Inside Twotters:





Inside the Dash-7:

Note the lack of separation betwen cargo and passengers (the cargo door is at the front on this aircraft):



"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
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Offline Old Wombat

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2014, 09:27:14 AM »
Good reference photo's! :)
"This is the Captain. We have a little problem with our engine sequence, so we may experience some slight turbulence and, ah, explode."

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2014, 12:16:12 AM »
Well it's been an eventful first day......

Cleaned up the various parts that make up the interior walls, decided not to embellish them, and sprayed them with white undercoat. Fine. Then this afternoon, I set about building the wings. Just one side trimmed and sanded, reached for the glue......... and knocked over the bottle of Liquid Poly... :o :o :o :(

It spilled straight over the four wing halves. I ran to the kitchen, filled a pint glass with brush cleaner and dropped them in it, but I think they're still spoilt. I now have a living room full of lovely fumes to boot, and it's cold and raining cats and dogs outside, so having the windows open is not a joy.

The good thing is, I have a spare set of wings because I built one Skyvan kit as a helicopter a few years back, and the wing halves were the ONLY things the glue landed on.

On the whole, don't know whether to call that lucky or unlucky....... :-[


EDIT: I've just had to dismantle my whole modelling set up in the living room because I use a cardboard tray which the glue had soaked into, so it was evaporating too slowly to clear the fumes. The tray is now close to a warm air blower in another room with the windows open and the door closed.

I SO want the proper modelling room I've planned: tomorrow I'm going to go and see about getting the furniture taken away that's blocking me from getting on with it.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2014, 12:36:02 AM by Weaver »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline raafif

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2014, 12:05:19 PM »
need a steam-punk sled to pose alongside it !!

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2014, 06:58:16 PM »
Cheers for that.

I was actually thinking of a vehicle to go alongside it, but I was thinking of something roughly like this:



http://www.foremost.ca/products/nodwell-110-0

It's a Nodwell 110C. I've got an Academy M977 which would provide the cab and flat bed, and I think you could approximate the running gear using T-34 wheels and 1/48th King Tiger tracks. wouldn't be anything like an exact model, but it would have the same vibe.
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Camthalion

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2014, 02:18:49 PM »
Looks interesting

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2014, 04:17:49 PM »
Cheers!

Progress is slow and steady and not worth photographing at the moment. This kit is VERY fiddly, being broken down into lots of tiny parts, and I'm currently trying to get all the little bits built and painted to suite a build sequence that makes the colour scheme easy to mask (you can't see it from the pic I posted, but the top of the BAS Otters' wings and flying surfaces are black).

Also been slightly held up by a request to make some new bits for pre-built Concorde that a mate bought and then dropped........
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2014, 06:24:30 AM »
Well that's a bugger: got everything lined up for the promised "progress" piccie, then found that the damn camera battery was flat..... >:(

It was underwhelming anyway. Progress on this has bee delayed by two factors:

1. ROSH (Random Other Sh*t Happening),

2. Picking, buying, modding and painting the cargo. Can't build the rest until the cargo's done, and it's going very slowly. Good news is that it's starting to look good.

Another photo attempt tomorrow. Not saying "promise" 'cos that's obviously what flattened my battery today......
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2014, 03:38:59 PM »
Are those two fit to the idea somehow?

... and kill me again
or take me as I am,
for I shall not change...
never...

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2014, 07:16:27 PM »
Oooh, that Lotus is fancy. BMW bike engine I see. 8)

Not doing an Aerosan with this one, but I do have a 1/72nd Scammel Scarab stashed away with the idea to make one, so I might put it with one of the other Antarctic projects. It would be a nice whiffy addition to the Pilatus PC-6, because that actual plane will be real-world.

Thanks for the idea!  :)
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Frank3k

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2014, 09:54:22 PM »
...but I do have a 1/72nd Scammel Scarab...

Ooooooooooo! Where did you get that?

Offline Tophe

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2014, 09:29:12 AM »
Freezing & interesting... :-*

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2014, 11:10:30 AM »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline kerick

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #17 on: September 19, 2014, 08:30:16 PM »
Not sure how far along you are. If you have closed up the fuselage it may be too late but I noticed in the pics of the cargo loaded on the aircraft it looks like plywood on the floor. You could paint up some really thin sheet plastic and place it where it would be seen through the loading door.

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #18 on: September 19, 2014, 09:49:30 PM »
Not sure how far along you are. If you have closed up the fuselage it may be too late but I noticed in the pics of the cargo loaded on the aircraft it looks like plywood on the floor. You could paint up some really thin sheet plastic and place it where it would be seen through the loading door.

That is a good spot! I have the seats glued in down one side of the cabin, but I could put plywood under the cargo on the other side. I was going to put the four barrels on a pallet, but then I went off the idea since manhandling them would probably be easier.

Thanks for the idea!
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline kitnut617

  • Measures the actual aircraft before modelling it...we have the photographic evidence.
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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2014, 10:06:14 PM »
Freightdog does some decals of wood grain   ;)  one sheet is of light coloured wood and the other dark wood.  Got a couple of sheets some time ago so I could do wood props but would work here too.

Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #20 on: September 20, 2014, 02:46:26 AM »
Harold, what about changing the name to Ptarmigan? :)
"Every day we hear about new studies 'revealing' what should have been obvious to sentient beings for generations; 'Research shows wolverines don't like to be teased" -- Jonah Goldberg

Offline jcf

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #21 on: September 20, 2014, 03:47:32 AM »
Harold, what about changing the name to Ptarmigan? :)

Perhaps not because ptarmigan don't live in the Antarctic?  :icon_ninja:

I do think though that it needs a Miskatonic University badge.  ;)

Tekeli-li! Tekeli-li!  :icon_fsm:
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And we, till now unmatched in ill,
Must leave successors more corrupted still."
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Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #22 on: September 20, 2014, 04:55:27 AM »
Harold, what about changing the name to Ptarmigan? :)
Perhaps not because ptarmigan don't live in the Antarctic?  :icon_ninja:

I do think though that it needs a Miskatonic University badge.  ;)

Tekeli-li! Tekeli-li!  :icon_fsm:
It was the only snow bird I could think of and it does live in areas covered in snow.  Plus the ptarmigan is found in northern reaches of the UK, so there is that.  Thpppppt! ;)
"Every day we hear about new studies 'revealing' what should have been obvious to sentient beings for generations; 'Research shows wolverines don't like to be teased" -- Jonah Goldberg

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #23 on: September 20, 2014, 07:11:01 AM »
I kind of thought that "Snow Budgie" would start as an insider nickname for it, then evolve into a put-on for newbies, along the lines of the Australian Drop Bear.... ;)

Anyway, some progress pics. Not all of this stuff is fully painted yet, some of it needs fixing and none of it's glued in (apart from the seats):





The pilots are white metal and the big crate is full of steel balls, so I'm using the cargo to help keep the nose down (probably crush the nose wheel now....).
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline kerick

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #24 on: September 20, 2014, 11:09:00 AM »
Not sure how far along you are. If you have closed up the fuselage it may be too late but I noticed in the pics of the cargo loaded on the aircraft it looks like plywood on the floor. You could paint up some really thin sheet plastic and place it where it would be seen through the loading door.

I doubt the seats would have plywood under them. Its more for protecting the floor from the cargo. How much of the floor would actually be visible?

That is a good spot! I have the seats glued in down one side of the cabin, but I could put plywood under the cargo on the other side. I was going to put the four barrels on a pallet, but then I went off the idea since manhandling them would probably be easier.

Thanks for the idea!

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #25 on: September 24, 2014, 07:55:02 PM »
1/72nd scale plywood:



I noticed that the ply in the pics had holes in it, which I'm guessing is to allow the cargo straps to reach the tie-down points. I made mine by finding a suitable pic on the web, scaling it to size, sticking it to 0.5mm card with spray mount, then punching the holes with a jewellery punch (drilling didn't go well). the edges are about to be touched up with light brown paint, of course.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2014, 01:25:04 AM by Weaver »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline kitnut617

  • Measures the actual aircraft before modelling it...we have the photographic evidence.
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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #26 on: September 24, 2014, 09:43:23 PM »
Clever idea that --  :)

Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2014, 01:03:10 AM »
Brilliant!
"Every day we hear about new studies 'revealing' what should have been obvious to sentient beings for generations; 'Research shows wolverines don't like to be teased" -- Jonah Goldberg

Offline kerick

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2014, 03:09:53 AM »
Looks great to me!

Offline Frank3k

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2014, 07:01:51 AM »
The plywood looks great, and so does the figure. Hard to believe it's 1/72! Although he does seem to be standing in a gooey mess. Every group always has "that guy"!

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #30 on: September 25, 2014, 07:24:30 AM »
The plywood looks great, and so does the figure. Hard to believe it's 1/72! Although he does seem to be standing in a gooey mess. Every group always has "that guy"!

Yeah, he's even looking down and raising his left foot as if to say "awwwww, what is this blue stuff?"  ;D
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Frank3k

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #31 on: September 25, 2014, 09:14:32 AM »

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #32 on: September 30, 2014, 10:25:37 AM »
Had to do some micro-engineering on the skis. Firstly, the nosewheel needed a brass axle:




Then I hit a serious problem with the main gear. The standard Twotter ski has a pair of pyramid-shaped struts which go either side of the wheel, which is on the end of a long, thin pylon. Unfortunately, the Skyvan wheel sits on a vertical "fin" on the end of a short sponson. The inner pyramid strut wouldn't fit between the wheel and the fin, and the struts wern't wide enough to fit around the wheel and the fin.



Looking at a cutaway of the landing gear, I realised that the latter option was technically credible if a hole were cut in the inboard skin of the fin, so I set about modifying the skis with an offset inboard strut. The Revellobox ski struts are just plain triangles with no axle attachement, and the stub axle is too wide to fit in them, so I made the axle of alloy tube and put a brass rod through the middle of it, which sits in drilled holes that JUST fit in the tips of the triangles.




Here are the exhaust pipes treated with Humbrol Metalcote Steel. The holes in the nacelles are nowhere near big enough to take them, so that was another tricky fettling job:




Quite please with how the sledge turned out. Here's what you get (everything moulded in two halves, solid handle etc..):



And here's the end result, with a hollowed-out handle and my best shot at making the cargo items look separate from the frame and each other:



The fuselage is currently glued and clamped and taped together. Had lots of fit issues there: this kits turns out to be quite a bit more warped than the last Skyvan I built.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2014, 10:27:32 AM by Weaver »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Frank3k

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #33 on: September 30, 2014, 11:43:30 AM »
Did you deepen the lines of the existing cargo, or is that just a wash? The extra purple bag does make it more 3D. Good job on the ski/gear attachment.

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #34 on: September 30, 2014, 12:40:33 PM »
Did you deepen the lines of the existing cargo, or is that just a wash? The extra purple bag does make it more 3D. Good job on the ski/gear attachment.

I physically deepened the lines around the top of the cargo because there was basically no definition there at all, so nothing to actually hold a wash. The rest of the effects are a mixture of washes plus a 0.05mm pigment ink marker.

I put the purple bag there because I originally intended to put the skis on top of the sledge and I needed something to level up the top surface, but then I decided to use them differently.
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #35 on: October 01, 2014, 05:28:58 AM »
Progress:



The wings arn't glued on yet: this rig is just to get the struts to dry to the sponsons in the right position. The plan is to paint the wing and fuselage separately to make the black top easier to mask, and then join them up afterwards.

This kit is definately more warped and badly fitting than the last Skyvan I built: had all sorts of problems and some still to fix...
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Brian da Basher

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #36 on: October 01, 2014, 11:52:24 PM »
That's some impressive work, Weaver! Excellent detailing on the sled, too!

You have mad skills, sir!

Brian da Basher

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #37 on: October 02, 2014, 06:19:43 AM »
ARGHHHHH!!!!! It's driving me mad today. Every time I get near to the point of being able to put paint on it, a seam pops or something falls off..... >:( >:( >:(
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #38 on: October 03, 2014, 11:15:00 PM »
Okay, I'm afraid it's very likely that I'm not going to finish by the deadline. I put the first coat of red paint on it this morning and while it went on okay, the Hu.174 diluted to airbrushing consistency is so pale that it'll probably take 3 coats before it's deep enough, and there just aren't enough paint/dry cycles left between now and Sunday to do everything that needs to be done.

I'm still trying to finish it as soon as possible. Sorry.
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #39 on: October 05, 2014, 01:26:09 AM »
Might just get away with it yet. Managed to shorten the drying time by using a lot of heat in the spraying area overnight, and I now have three coats of red on, and looking pretty good. Now I just need to mask it all, spray the matt black, let it dry, do the major assembly, put the decals on, spray it with satin varnish, and I'm done.
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #40 on: October 05, 2014, 04:10:06 AM »
Nope, I'm screwed. To try to save time, I used masking fluid on the cockpit glazing instead of tape. Unfortunately, the paint has got under or through the masking (not sure which) and the transparency is now ruined. There's no way I can fix it without spoiling another kit, unless I can get a spare glazing from Airfix, and since the kit's been out of production for ages, I'm not hopeful. either way, I'm not going to make the deadline - sorry folks. :( :( :(

I hate everything........ >:(
« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 04:12:25 AM by Weaver »
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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #41 on: October 05, 2014, 04:16:10 AM »
Is it worth painting the windows black n order to recover?
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Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #42 on: October 05, 2014, 04:28:26 AM »
Is it worth painting the windows black n order to recover?
good idea, great fix for the snow blindness issue.
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #43 on: October 05, 2014, 04:58:46 AM »
Is it worth painting the windows black n order to recover?

Not given the effort I put into the interior, no. I'd only consider doing that as a temporary measure if I knew that I'd be able to replace the transparency later, but I won't find that out until Airfix's spares dept come in on Monday.

<edited to remove something snappy and uneccessary for which I apologise to anyone who saw it>
« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 05:13:00 AM by Weaver »
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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #44 on: October 05, 2014, 05:12:54 AM »
Can you share some photos of the "damage" - maybe we can offer some suggestions?
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #45 on: October 05, 2014, 05:20:22 AM »
Can you share some photos of the "damage" - maybe we can offer some suggestions?

Yes, but it'll take a while to upload: my camera software's a bit flaky..... ::)
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #46 on: October 05, 2014, 05:29:38 AM »
Okay, it worked quickly for once. Here we go:



Looks to me like the masking fluid didn't adhere fully to the plastic and the paint (sprayed) crept under it. I've already tried scraping a little off with a cocktail stick and it smeared, which suggests to me that it isn't fully dry, and it might come off properly if left overnight.

The reason I used masking fluid (Micromask) is that the glazing is difficult to mask with tape on two counts:

1. The side windows wrap around the side/top line in a way that tape can't easily follow,

2. The frames arn't very well defined, which means it's risky to just smother it with tape and then cut along the edges. There's a also a little L-shaped from on the quarterlight that would be very fiddly to cut.
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Offline Cliffy B

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #47 on: October 05, 2014, 05:51:55 AM »
There's not as much on there as it sounded.  Mix some colors and you could go for a mud covered effect like the it made a landing on a muddy runway.  Would have to carry the effect over the rest of the plane but its a thought.  Could have some guys cleaning it off and make it look like they saved the windscreen for last?
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #48 on: October 05, 2014, 06:14:52 AM »
There's not as much on there as it sounded.  Mix some colors and you could go for a mud covered effect like the it made a landing on a muddy runway.  Would have to carry the effect over the rest of the plane but its a thought.  Could have some guys cleaning it off and make it look like they saved the windscreen for last?

In Antarctica?
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Offline Cliffy B

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #49 on: October 05, 2014, 06:23:59 AM »
Details...........

Was just trying to think of a way of salvaging what you had.
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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #50 on: October 05, 2014, 06:29:11 AM »
The red paint is about the right colour for blood smears from a bird strike or three
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #51 on: October 05, 2014, 07:23:35 AM »
The red paint is about the right colour for blood smears from a bird strike or three

Yeah, but unfortunately it's exactly the same colour as the rest of the plane, so it'd be hard to "read" it as anything but the paint.

I do have another Skyvan kit, but it's still sealed and it's the later version with three decals options (NASA/Austrian/Olympic Airways) so I don't really want to destroy it's resale value by nicking the glazing from it. I might need that resale value at some point under current circumstances......
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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #52 on: October 05, 2014, 07:38:49 AM »
Having been there I can say that yes you have plenty of mud in Antartica.  Moreover, the red is very similar in colour to one finds around some penguin colonies (see below).



Maybe you could also delicately touch t up with some white to represent snow.
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #53 on: October 05, 2014, 09:38:54 AM »
Hmmm - slight problem getting a birdstrike with penguins, so it'd have to be "BAS Skyvan lands in a penguin colony": funny, but gross. So which wargame figure makers does a bag of 100 splattered penguins then... (you KNOW somebody does.... ;D )
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #54 on: October 05, 2014, 07:16:42 PM »
Okay, now it's really dead. I used the same masking fluid on the side windows, and it's done the same thing. The side windows are fitted from the inside, so the only way to replace them is to crack the fuselage open.

Game Over.

Moral of this story? Test new products before you use them on stuff you care about..... :(
« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 07:39:56 PM by Weaver »
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Offline Frank3k

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #55 on: October 06, 2014, 12:00:06 AM »
You might still be able to scrape off the paint. I use acrylics exclusively, but there are still times I have to scrape off some paint from canopy frames. I take a piece of Sprue and carve the end into a pointy chisel and use that to scrape off the paint. The Sprue will be the same hardness as the clear plastic (so there's less chance of scratching) but harder than the paint.
Also, when masking ( even with tape) if you spray the underlying color (in this case, clear) it will seal any gaps in the mask.
Another idea for the fuselage windows if you can't scrape the paint off is to pop them off into the fuselage, then use white glue (or Krystal clear) to make new ones - if the holes aren't too big.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2014, 12:02:13 AM by Frank3k »

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #56 on: October 06, 2014, 02:40:22 AM »
Can you post more pics showing the side windows and the overall current state - we may yet be able to save this baby!
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Offline perttime

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #57 on: October 06, 2014, 02:56:13 AM »
Snow all over the airplane, because it had to stay on the ground during a snowstorm.
Or just a frost all over because a fog froze onto it.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2014, 03:01:08 AM by perttime »

Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #58 on: October 06, 2014, 03:14:27 AM »
Harold,

So sorry to hear that your project has hit a snag.  Things were looking darned good until that paint leaching under the masking material got in the way.  Really hope you can some how salvage this as I really like all of the work you have put into this with the modifications to the landing gear to mount the skis and the details in your lashed down cargo in the passenger compartment. 

Maybe a snowed in/under Snow Budgie diorama is the way to go at the moment and then later when the fiasco has passed you can revisit the problem and tackle it with a clear head and better frame of mind.  At least you have not thrown the project against the wall and into the trash bin.  So there is hope yet. 
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #59 on: October 06, 2014, 04:26:12 AM »
You might still be able to scrape off the paint. I use acrylics exclusively, but there are still times I have to scrape off some paint from canopy frames. I take a piece of Sprue and carve the end into a pointy chisel and use that to scrape off the paint. The Sprue will be the same hardness as the clear plastic (so there's less chance of scratching) but harder than the paint.

I've been trying this, but with wooden cocktail sticks, so I gave it a go with sprue as you suggest. No good I'm afraid: it still smears and discolours the plastic. I use enamel paints pretty much exclusively and I think they "bite" to the surface more aggressively than acrylics, particularly when thinned for airbrushing.

Quote
Also, when masking ( even with tape) if you spray the underlying color (in this case, clear) it will seal any gaps in the mask.

Yeah, I've done that in the past. Trouble was that in this case, it never occurred to me that there might be "gaps" in masking fluid. I've been testing the masking fluid on other clear plastic and it worked. I think that perhaps the clear plastic in the windows was greasy from being handled and that caused the masking fluid to fail to adhere to it properly.

Quote
Another idea for the fuselage windows if you can't scrape the paint off is to pop them off into the fuselage, then use white glue (or Krystal clear) to make new ones - if the holes aren't too big.

Doesn't fix the cockpit glazing though, plus with all the stuff inside, I wouldn't care to bet on all of the side windows shaking out of the tail ramp instead of getting stuck.
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #60 on: October 06, 2014, 04:36:18 AM »
Jeff and Perttime: thanks for the ideas, but I don't want to go down the route of "saving" this one and then doing it better next time, because I only have the one set of BAS decals and I don't want to use them on this model if it's then going to the boneyard as soon as the better one is done.

I think what I might do is put this on the back burner for now and see if I can get another cheap Skyvan (I have a heap of Skyvan projects). Then with enough stock of parts in hand, I'll split the fuselage of this one to recover the interior and use it's painted wings and other bits on a new fuselage to try again.

The sad thing is that the paint was looking really good from a distance. However looking at it in detail, the black's "crackled" in one place, probably due to over-loading (the spray can had a really coarse nozzle). Add that to small paint leaks and even if the window thing hadn't happened, touch-up and re-paints would have taken it past the deadline anyway.
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #61 on: October 06, 2014, 05:12:27 AM »
Can you post more pics showing the side windows and the overall current state - we may yet be able to save this baby!


Here we go:





The paint is much harder to get off the side windows because it has a white undercoat as well.
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #62 on: October 16, 2014, 06:52:34 PM »
Airfix's brilliant spares department may have saved the day for me. They not only had a replacement clear sprue in stock for this model that was last issued in 2002, but they sent it to me yesterday, BEFORE sending me an e-mail asking me for payment, and the part arrived this morning before I had a chance to ring them up and pay them. Total cost? £4 including postage. Way to go Airfix!

It doesn't get the model back into the GB unfortunately, but it does mean there's half a chance of finishing it for Telford. What I think I might do with the side windows is pop them out, then cut the flanges off the new ones and slither them in from the outside. We shall see.............
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Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #63 on: October 17, 2014, 04:47:47 AM »
Harold,

Very happy for you that the good folks at AirFix came through for you. 
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Offline apophenia

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #64 on: October 18, 2014, 09:46:26 AM »
You've got to love stories like that. I've had similar experiences with Airfix in the past. Nice to know that the tradition continues!  :)
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan aka The Snow Budgie
« Reply #65 on: November 11, 2014, 01:10:50 AM »
Well it got finished (kinda) and made it onto the What If SiG stand at Telford (SMW 2014).

The replacement transparencies went okay. I masked the cockpit windows with tape this time and cut round them individually, which is something I've never had much luck with in the past, but it seemed to work this time. Don't know if the mould got cleaned up at some point, but the frames seemed better defined on the replacement than the original. For the cabin windows, I clipped/sanded the "top hat" sections from them and then inserted them into the already-painted and assembled fuselage from the outside using PVA, a cocktail stick with a little old blu-tack on the end, and fear. Went surprisingly well actually.

Then I glued the wings and tail on, and, despite the front half of the cargo and both pilots being white metal, watched it rock majestically back on it's wheels. Yes, it was a tail-sitter. Drilled out the round thing behind the nosewheel, with the intention of dropping steel shot into the space under the cockpit floor, only to hit solid plastic. Then I remembered that I'd "cleverly" glued a central keel into that space months before to make it easier to put the shot in from the sides.... ::) So, nothing for it but to drill two damned great holes a little further back, fill it with shot, and then stick a couple of black discs (irises from soft-toy eyes) over them to make "geophysical sensors". ;)

I'm only calling it kinda finished on three counts:

1. I want to see if I can make a better job of the jokey bus number over the cockpit (No.77 is the bus you'd get from Cambridge Airport to Maddingly Road where the BAS HQ is ;D ). I stuck a couple of 7s pillaged from the spares box on last week but didn't have time to get into custom decals.

2. The skis are supposed to have various cables and rods that arn't modelled in the Revellobox donor kit. Again, I didn't want to risk screwing it up that close to a show with no time to fix it, but I'd to try and do something that at least acknowledges that I know they're supposed to be there, even if the result isn't 100%. Various ideas.

3. I'd like to put it on a snow base with figures and a vehicle.

Because of this, I'm not doing a full article and write-up now, and these are just temporary pics:





I know the props don't all have the same stripe pattern: the BAS Twotters are sometimes painted like that. The badge on the nose is International Polar Year 2007-2008 so that sets the timeframe.







The "geophysical sensors" (above) and why they're really there (below). The ski bottoms are unfinished to make it easier to put it on a base. The LORAN "towel rail" aerials are optional on the Skyvan, but I figured they'd want every nav aid you can get. Same argument for the aerials on top of the cockpit.

More victims of the masking fluid were the exhausts. I'd got a lovely Metalcote finish on them, but in this case, the masking fluid bound to it so strongly that I had to scratch the finish getting it off. They were repainted from the outside with normal HU.56 aluminium.




EDIT: forgot to include the finished interior shots!









« Last Edit: November 11, 2014, 02:26:30 AM by Weaver »
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Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #66 on: November 11, 2014, 02:24:06 AM »
Really nice work Harold! 

Was there no alternative to the LORAN antennas being mounted under the fuselage?  I would have imagined the signal reception would have been better with the antennas mounted on the top of the fuselage.  Plus there is the hazard of having the antennas sheered off during landing on a rough patch of snow/ice. 
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Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #67 on: November 11, 2014, 02:30:09 AM »
I've just put some more pics on folks.

Really nice work Harold! 

Was there no alternative to the LORAN antennas being mounted under the fuselage?  I would have imagined the signal reception would have been better with the antennas mounted on the top of the fuselage.  Plus there is the hazard of having the antennas sheered off during landing on a rough patch of snow/ice.

Cheers Jeff.

Yeah, maybe: hadn't thought of that. The underbody position is where they're mounted on real Skyvans (they're kit parts) but the civvie and military versions have one or two respectively. The wing "hump" means you can only really put them behind it, and maybe the fins would block it there?
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Offline raafif

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #68 on: November 11, 2014, 02:39:10 AM »
if my stuff-ups could come out as good looking as this budgie I'd finish more of them :)

Got the hankering to do a Skyvan myself now.

Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #69 on: November 11, 2014, 02:49:30 AM »
Skyvan + Osprey = V-Budgie :)
"Every day we hear about new studies 'revealing' what should have been obvious to sentient beings for generations; 'Research shows wolverines don't like to be teased" -- Jonah Goldberg

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #70 on: November 11, 2014, 02:54:31 AM »
 :)
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

Offline Weaver

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #71 on: November 11, 2014, 04:21:31 AM »
Skyvan + Osprey = V-Budgie :)

Now there's a thought, but I'll be leaving it for someone else. I've got a nearly-finished-then-dropped (literally) "five ton bumble bee" though: a Skyvan helicopter with Kaman-style eggbeater rotors. I'll get round to finishing it off one day.....
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

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Offline Weaver

  • Skyhawk stealer and violator of Panthers, with designs on a Cougar and a Tiger too
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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #72 on: November 11, 2014, 04:26:35 AM »
if my stuff-ups could come out as good looking as this budgie I'd finish more of them :)

Got the hankering to do a Skyvan myself now.

It can make up into a nice model, but be warned, test fit EVERYTHING before you fit it: literally every little thing. Skyvan kits seem to get warped in odd ways and you also get the impression that the mould has either worn or been worked on at soem stage because two kits can be way different.

Your first reaction on seeing the part count is that it's over-engineered, but then, with a body shape like that, it's hard to see how else much of it it could have been done pre-slide moulding. Having said that though, there's not much excuse for the separate rudders and three-peice wing trailing edges....
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Brian da Basher

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #73 on: November 11, 2014, 07:29:38 AM »
What a mighty save, Weaver! That's got to be one of the most eye-catching Shorts Skyvans to ever grace the table at Telford! Glad you made it in under the wire and you're bound to get many compliments!

Brian da Basher

Offline elmayerle

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #74 on: November 11, 2014, 08:16:26 AM »
Just a thought for the next one, go for a more powerful set of TPE331 engines and a four- or five-bladed prop.  I could see them wanting more power in that harsh environment.

Offline Frank3k

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #75 on: November 11, 2014, 10:31:41 AM »
This came out great, despite the mishaps. I have an early boxing of this kit; I didn't realize it could look this good.

Offline kitnut617

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Re: British Antarctic Survey Skyvan FINISHED (kinda)!
« Reply #76 on: November 11, 2014, 09:33:16 PM »
That came out very well Weaver   :)