Beyond The Sprues

Modelling => Ideas & Inspiration => Sea => Topic started by: Jeffry Fontaine on November 13, 2013, 04:23:48 AM

Title: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: Jeffry Fontaine on November 13, 2013, 04:23:48 AM
A place holder for all things related to amphibious operations from the sea to the beach and beyond with the focus on vessels and not vehicles. 

A few links to various landing craft types:

Wikipedia - Landing Craft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_craft)

Wikipedia - Landing Craft Assault (LCA) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_Craft_Assault)

Wikipedia - Landing Craft, Mechanized (LCM) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_Craft_Mechanized)

Wikipedia - Landing Craft, Personnel, Large (LCPL) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LCPL)

Wikipedia - Landing Craft, Vehicle, Personnel (LCVP) aka "the Higgins boat" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LCVP_(United_States))

Wikipedia - Landing Ship, Tank (LST) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_Ship,_Tank)

Wikipedia - Landing Craft, Tank (LCT) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_craft_tank)

Wikipedia - Landing Craft, Utility (LCU) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_craft_utility)

Wikipedia - Air-Cushioned Landing Craft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air-cushioned_landing_craft)

Wikipedia - Landing Craft, Air Cushion (LCAC) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landing_Craft_Air_Cushion)

Wikipedia - Assault Boat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_boat)

Wikipedia - Category:Landing craft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Landing_craft)
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: Volkodav on November 13, 2013, 05:02:04 AM
Yes, I like.
 :)
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: Jeffry Fontaine on November 13, 2013, 05:08:06 AM
I was a bit stumped when I opened this can of worms.  So many variations on the theme to choose from and soon found myself creating a monster list where normally you would only have one or two links to the subject. 

Woke up this morning thinking about modifying one of my 1:35th scale LCM kits into a diver support boat which is what got me started on this as there was no place to share that idea until now :)
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: jcf on November 13, 2013, 05:39:13 AM
Late 60s Bell concept, from JANE'S Surface Skimmer Systems 1967-68.

(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/LCAC_01.png)

Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: Volkodav on November 13, 2013, 07:42:36 AM
The RAN is in the process of retiring their Landing Craft Heavy (LCH), with three gone and three to go. With over 40 years service they have done almost any mission you could imagine from classic amphibious assault to logistics, in shore hydrograghic survey to boarder protection patrols (very slow ones ). Even though old they still do their jobs very well and economically and could be kept in service for a couple of decades longer.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: elmayerle on November 14, 2013, 02:09:14 AM
Late 60s Bell concept, from JANE'S Surface Skimmer Systems 1967-68.

([url]http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/LCAC_01.png[/url])

Not too far off form the LCAC's the USN is now looking to replace and retire.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: dy031101 on May 15, 2016, 08:23:36 AM
Models of Republic of China (a.k.a. Taiwan) Navy's planned Landing Platform Dock.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: elmayerle on May 15, 2016, 08:46:17 AM
That LPD looks a lot like the US San Antonio class; I wonder if the hanger doors can accommodate folded V-22's?  Also be interesting to see if the docking well can easily take LCAC's or their replacement SSC's.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: dy031101 on May 15, 2016, 10:27:59 AM
That LPD looks a lot like the US San Antonio class......

About half its displacement.

...... I wonder if the hanger doors can accommodate folded V-22's?

Don't know although the closest thing ROCN can procure from abroad would be MH-53E (which I don't think is going to happen at this point).  The helipad should be able to handle and refuel CH-47SD, but the hangar is likely arranged with S-70C(M) in mind.

Also be interesting to see if the docking well can easily take LCAC's or their replacement SSC's.

Likely just old-school LCUs.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: elmayerle on May 15, 2016, 10:46:10 AM
I could see them being the first to purchase export MH-53K's, but I doubt the CH-53E and/or MH-53E will ever go up for sale, even when replaced as they are just too worn out to be worth it.  I still like the idea of ROCN MV-22B's and think their camo scheme would look good on one.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: Volkodav on May 15, 2016, 07:11:18 PM
I could see a San Antonio being upgraded like this, medium calibre gun or even an AGS, perhaps a VLS and improved sensors, maybe a CEAFAR Mast. 
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: dy031101 on May 16, 2016, 01:13:15 AM
I could see them being the first to purchase export MH-53K's, but I doubt the CH-53E and/or MH-53E will ever go up for sale, even when replaced as they are just too worn out to be worth it.

MH-53E was an item that was brought up during the Bush Jr. administration.  If ROCN wasn't going to take it then, it's extremely unlikely that they ever will take it.

I don't know which one I'd like better for airborne mine countermeasure, MH-53K or MH-60S (so as to also be able to use the vacant second hangar on Cheng Kung a.k.a. O.H. Perry class frigates).

I could see a San Antonio being upgraded like this, medium calibre gun or even an AGS, perhaps a VLS and improved sensors, maybe a CEAFAR Mast.

ROCN feels inclined to arm their ships this way because it's unlikely they will be procuring any equivalent of the Arleigh Burke class DDG.  Equivalent of LCF is much more likely.

Featured word- inclined.  The recently commissioned AOE was to have a Mk.75 gun as well; and then the ship gets a Sea Chaparral launcher instead.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 16, 2016, 02:34:40 AM
and then the ship gets "value-engineered"

Is that the term officially used or your own description?  If the latter please chose a different description - Value Engineering is a quite legitimate, useful process and should not be confusingly misrepresented as a derogatory term.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: jcf on May 16, 2016, 02:53:14 AM
Late 60s Bell concept, from JANE'S Surface Skimmer Systems 1967-68.

([url]http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/LCAC_01.png[/url])

Not too far off form the LCAC's the USN is now looking to replace and retire.


3-view of the SK-10 that I thought I had posted, turns out I hadn't.  :-\

(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/ACV/SK-10_02.png)
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: The Big Gimper on May 16, 2016, 03:22:39 AM
When Greg and I went to the Niagara Aerospace Museum a year ago at the old Bell Plant in Niagara Falls, I took the following pictures with my iPhone.

EDIT (July 2017): Photos moved to Flickr and reposted.

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4328/36083372132_c2de9c760a_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/WYyHpJ)IMG_1867 (https://flic.kr/p/WYyHpJ) by Carl Wimmi (https://www.flickr.com/photos/153210713@N02/), on Flickr

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4323/36209362336_de40358b39_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/XaGrUC)IMG_1868 (https://flic.kr/p/XaGrUC) by Carl Wimmi (https://www.flickr.com/photos/153210713@N02/), on Flickr

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4294/36083369542_7920a97698_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/WYyGD5)IMG_1869 (https://flic.kr/p/WYyGD5) by Carl Wimmi (https://www.flickr.com/photos/153210713@N02/), on Flickr

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4320/36209360556_6b5c65ca37_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/XaGrnW)IMG_1870 (https://flic.kr/p/XaGrnW) by Carl Wimmi (https://www.flickr.com/photos/153210713@N02/), on Flickr

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4305/36083368722_3b213ca146_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/WYyGoW)IMG_1871 (https://flic.kr/p/WYyGoW) by Carl Wimmi (https://www.flickr.com/photos/153210713@N02/), on Flickr

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4312/36209360006_6135ff170d_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/XaGrds)IMG_1873 (https://flic.kr/p/XaGrds) by Carl Wimmi (https://www.flickr.com/photos/153210713@N02/), on Flickr

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4294/36083367922_854bc11300_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/WYyGa9)IMG_1874 (https://flic.kr/p/WYyGa9) by Carl Wimmi (https://www.flickr.com/photos/153210713@N02/), on Flickr
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: finsrin on May 16, 2016, 03:59:29 AM
Being active reader of anything military at the time.  Saw that SK-10 picture in some publication(s) or another.
Thanks for posting Jon.  A flashback time capsule moment seeing it.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: jcf on May 16, 2016, 04:03:40 AM
Remember folks there is also a stand alone thread for ACVs of all sorts:
http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2058.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2058.0)
 :icon_fsm:

I have a bunch more stuff scanned that I'll be adding at some point, including drawings for that LSES.  ;)


Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: dy031101 on May 16, 2016, 05:30:43 AM
If the latter please chose a different description......

Done.

...... Value Engineering is a quite legitimate, useful process and should not be confusingly misrepresented as a derogatory term.

I stand corrected about the term's official status, but just to be clear, I didn't knowingly screw with language, nor did I really use that term in a derogatory way (while the differences between planned and actual configuration certainly have cost considerations involved, at this point we wouldn't know how useful a Mk.75 on a replenishment ship would have been beyond ending up as a bigger gun to shoot pirates with anyway; the Sea Chaparral might be outdated, but there is still logic behind its inclusion).
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: dy031101 on May 17, 2016, 02:52:38 AM
I could see a San Antonio being upgraded like this, medium calibre gun or even an AGS, perhaps a VLS and improved sensors, maybe a CEAFAR Mast.

Addendum to that model picture of the ROCN's planned LPD:

Armaments suggested by the model include one Mk.75 (with locally-refitted low-observable cupola) forward, two 16-round above-deck fixed launchers (again, in low-observable housings) amidship for TC-2 point-defense missiles, two Phalanx CIWS, two small-calibre autocannons, and several .50 cal. or 7.62mm machineguns.

One of the integrated masts is believed to be meant to accommodate a 3D search radar
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: dy031101 on May 17, 2016, 10:50:36 AM
...... two 16-round above-deck fixed launchers (again, in low-observable housings) amidship for TC-2 point-defense missiles......
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: dy031101 on June 06, 2016, 08:48:08 AM
That LPD looks a lot like the US San Antonio class; I wonder if the hanger doors can accommodate folded V-22's?

Totally neglected the illustration:
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: M.A.D on July 30, 2017, 06:56:25 AM
Late 60s Bell concept, from JANE'S Surface Skimmer Systems 1967-68.

([url]http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/LCAC_01.png[/url])

Not too far off form the LCAC's the USN is now looking to replace and retire.


3-view of the SK-10 that I thought I had posted, turns out I hadn't.  :-\

([url]http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/ACV/SK-10_02.png[/url])


Its sort of typically ironic (like that of the Ling-Temco-Vought (LTV) XC-142 and the V-22 Osprey), that the USN could have such an effective LCAC in the Bell SK-10 decades before it finally developed and deployed the Aerojet General [Textron Marine and Land Systems] LCAC (first deployed in 1987)  :(

M.A.D
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: jcf on July 30, 2017, 07:28:12 AM
Uh, the production LCAC is a development of the Bell JEFF-B design, which used design elements from the SK-10. 
The Aerojet JEFF-A lost the competition. Textron Marine (Textron Marine & Land Systems since 1994, after merger
with Cadillac Gage) is a sub-division of Textron just like Bell Helicopter.
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: M.A.D on July 30, 2017, 03:23:47 PM
Uh, the production LCAC is a development of the Bell JEFF-B design, which used design elements from the SK-10. 
The Aerojet JEFF-A lost the competition. Textron Marine (Textron Marine & Land Systems since 1994, after merger
with Cadillac Gage) is a sub-division of Textron just like Bell Helicopter.
Well that's embarrassing JCF, to think all these years I had it arse about  :-[

M.A.D
Title: Re: Amphibious Ships, Vessels, and Landing Craft
Post by: LemonJello on September 27, 2018, 09:10:09 AM
Modern Day Marine Expo, Ingalls Shipbuilding's booth:

(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1943/44027160295_c83d2846f3_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2a5wGSB)

(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1904/44939431221_da85852f94_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2bt9keF)

(https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1911/44027161835_7f4e018d1e_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2a5wHka)