Beyond The Sprues
Modelling => Completed GBs => Group and Themed Builds => The Coulda, Woulda, Shoulda GB => Topic started by: Tophe on August 21, 2013, 11:44:09 PM
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As Lockheed, with its P-38 design, failed to reach the long-range specifications, the Burnelli company modified it with much more room for fuel: UB-38.
Trans-Pacific ability!
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I think I will have to modify the leading edge, with the help of http://www.jitterbuzz.com/manreal/burnelli_01.jpg (http://www.jitterbuzz.com/manreal/burnelli_01.jpg)
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Improved version (able to fly!):
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The UB-38 (then improved UB-38A) was the "real" part, but Ing. Burnelli then said this plane coulda/woulda/shoulda have radial engines like his UB-14B: this led to the UB-38B...
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My son Jacky disapproved this design UB-38B and required the tail to be removed, and the colour to be changed (shoulda!): UB-38J
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Engineer Jacky, 4 years old, required less realistic colours, and I added a canard tailplane for balance...
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As the foreplane denied the "flying wing" name on the UB-38K, we coulda/woulda/shoulda add fins for better control: UB-38L
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Cooperation with my little son goes on, do you adults have other improvement ideas?
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To take off with trans-Pacific fuel, 3 engines might have been necessary:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaaal_zpsc4e35ae9.jpg)
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With a very long runway and reduced drag, one engine might have been enough at last...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaaam_zps5cd0f665.jpg)
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With a bigger engine and even reduced drag, this gave the UB-38MD (Minimum Drag):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaaao_zpsf03dd488.jpg)
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A derivative of the former, more balanced when the tanks are empty: UB-38ME
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/P38eclairE_aaaaq_zps8c69ab9f.jpg)
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UB-38MF: reduced drag did not mean two engines were forbidden (to have a free nose)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaaar_zpsda97b35f.jpg)
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With a bigger engine and even reduced drag, this gave the UB-38MD (Minimum Drag):
Wrong! A Lightning cannot be single engined! A Zwilling may cure the problem, even in the flying wing family:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaaat_zps2e79acb5.jpg)
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Increased range on this version:
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A more compact, slightly asymmetric version:
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My wife cooperated also: this is the UB-38A-3:
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Super long range version (if able to take off): UB-38A-1
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The UB-38A-2 was different from the UB-38A in having its 2 engines on the centerline. The rear one was shut down after take off to save fuel.
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For very long subsonic flights over the Pacific, two pilots shoulda be there...
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Made by Burnelli or not, a Lightning shoulda be twin-boom, not triplex-boom...
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Without huge tailplane, does this one count as quadruple boom?
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Tophe and the Amazing Technicolor Lightning Whif! ;D
I'm kinda partial to the triple-engined one your wife inspired and to the single-engined one derived from that. :)
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Thanks for your answer... Do you have other ideas for a Burnelli Lightning?
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Google pictures, for "Burnelli", finds immediately a jet-Burnelli patent at http://www.mysteriesofcanada.com/Canada/Canada_Car/burnelli_designs.htm (http://www.mysteriesofcanada.com/Canada/Canada_Car/burnelli_designs.htm)
So... here is a Burnelli Jet-Lightning:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaabj_zps38140a12.jpg)
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What? A Lightning shoulda be twin-engined? No problem for the Burnelli design team:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaabk_zpsa08a136b.jpg)
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Far away from my naive dreams, I shoulda face the bloody urgency in 1945: fighting the Me-163 Komet transsonic fighter... This requires rocket and swept wings, Burnelli or not:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaabl_zps41b67465.jpg)
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And from Burnelli's http://www.aerofiles.com/burnelli-wing.jpg (http://www.aerofiles.com/burnelli-wing.jpg) I shoulda add:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaabn_zps50b77704.jpg)
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What? I shoulda be more realist? and respect Burnelli's tailplane and contra-props? I fear I am unable to be realistic but any transformation is welcome:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaabq_zps93d2b7c3.jpg)
(with 8 micro-engines...)
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What do you mean "micro-engines do not exist, Burnelli was designing a huge bomber"? Well I do not understand the meaning of "exist" and I dislike terror-bombing, but I woulda imagine a huge airliner with 8 normal engines:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaabr_zpsb2fed660.jpg)
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What a shame!: Google found a Burnelli patent that was neither twin-boom nor flying wing but featuring a simple tail...
see http://hobby-maquettes.xooit.fr/t902-GRUMMAN-XF5-f1-SKYROCKET.htm (http://hobby-maquettes.xooit.fr/t902-GRUMMAN-XF5-f1-SKYROCKET.htm)
A Burnelli-Lightning shoulda match:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaabu_zps6afd9a68.jpg)
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Fortunately, the Zwilling derivative restored the twin-boom layout of the Lightning:
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A more compact derivative:
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Of course, old archives explain that the Uppercu-Burnelli family UB came from the Remington-Burnelli family RB, but there has also been a RB-38, biplane
See http://www.aerofiles.com/burnelli-rb1.jpg (http://www.aerofiles.com/burnelli-rb1.jpg)
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From the biplane RB-38 woulda come the monoplane XUB-38:
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And then the twin-boom YUB-38, now you know almost all of the Burnelli-Lightning...
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On Burnelli's main page http://www.burnelliaircraft.com/ (http://www.burnelliaircraft.com/) is a true canard with lifting fuselage, and I shoulda make a connection with the Lightning:
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And the twin-jet derivative:
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Final: the rocket version:
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There was not enough asymmetry in this topic of mine... I shoulda include more uncommon derivatives.
The UB-38O was a Flying Observation Post:
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In 1946 there coulda/woulda/shoulda be a jet derivative of the UB-38O:
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Without asymmetry, the result was less sexy:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairE_aaacl_zpsda769a5a.jpg)
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The rocket derivative was even better for tourism:
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I don't like my national colours (too bright) but as long as this is for tourism, it's OK:
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Even better with jets at wingtips:
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In the new Trait d'Union magazine (#270) is an article about the Turboclair ground device made with French Vampire. A Burnelli-Lightning derivative would have been efficient (against fog) for a much longer duration:
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A twin-"plane" would have an improved volume coverage:
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A simplified (twin-boom) version:
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Far from ground devices, the very first designs of jet-aircraft had to deal with 2 commands : several units as the power was low, lots of tank room because jets were eating much. The Burnelli layout was good for that:
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Burnelli Lightning pulse-jet fighter:
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Pulse jets are not atomic engines, they may be closer to the pilot:
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Blohm und Voss licence-built the Burnelli Lightning, but with a difference:
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The UB-38BV-1 above found no purchaser, all customers being afraid of a flying-wing design and of a single asymmetric engine. Blohm und Voss thus designed the UB-38BV-2 below, still with Burnelli's aproval:
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For marketing reasons, the Blohm und Voss catalogue needed an UB-38BV-3 so it shoulda be designed:
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UB-38BV-4: the safest of all airplanes, with a mechanic to repair in flight all the engines
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UB-38BV-5:
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UB-38BV-6 push-pull:
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UB-38MI Mistel-Burnelli-Lightning:
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UB-38MI-2 simplified Mistel, with the component above being a simple lifting tank:
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Even more simplified, to show better the Burnelli-Lightning lines:
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UB-38BV-5B:
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Inspired by José Fern's topic http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=1715.120, (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=1715.120,) here is another Burnelli Lightning:
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Without gun, the civilian UB-38U needed no long nose:
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The single-boom version of the Burnelli-Lightning may be asymmetric too:
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Top secret! The UB-38XYZ was the only propeller-driven airplane that reached 1000km/h in level flight. It used either 10 V-3420 engines or 20 V-1710 engines. A Burnelli fuselage was needed for fuel, everyone may understand why...
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This Lightning airliner is half devoted to passengers, half to engineers:
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A half-Burnelli Lightning:
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Tophe, you're mad (but in a good way ;) ). :)
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Thanks a lot Weaver, I will tell that to my psychiatrist... ;)
And still with my son's colouring, here is the UB-38NF Night-Fighter 1936 (before radar was invented, night interceptors had to circle for very long flights with many eyes trying to discover something...)
Which one(s) should I present as final entry (ies)?
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that last one needs the outer-cockpit noses to be the same as the center one :)
You still haven't done one with inter-meshing prop-blades >:D
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As the foreplane denied the "flying wing" name on the UB-38K, we coulda/woulda/shoulda add fins for better control: UB-38L
([url]http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3454.0;attach=6937;image[/url])
If this one had the tail fins back on the ends of the booms it would be pretty cool and almost believable... ;)
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Thanks Raafif and Weaver.
that last one needs the outer-cockpit noses to be the same as the center one :)
This one is easy to "correct" in a shoulda improvement... (I will work on other suggestions today)
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As the foreplane denied the "flying wing" name on the UB-38K, we coulda/woulda/shoulda add fins for better control: UB-38L
If this one had the tail fins back on the ends of the booms it would be pretty cool and almost believable... ;)
So here are the famous UB-38W-1 and W-2, result of Burnelli/Weaver cooperation...:
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You still haven't done one with inter-meshing prop-blades >:D
Now this is serious historical facts, I shoulda stop colouring madly... You are obviously referring to the secret UB-38RAA-1 (and -2 and -3), ordered by the RAAF in 1937 and cancelled in 1938 after propeller damage during ground testing:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairB_baaaao.JPG)
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Of course, 1938's engineers understood that intermeshing propellers must be driven by a single engine. But could I reveal the UB-38RAA-4 (and -5 and -6), top secret, that saved Australia from invasion? Well, maybe in 2013 we should do it, let's go:
(the UB-38RAA-6 is a twin-engined plane, with its port engine driving the push-propellers and its starboard engine driving the pull-propellers)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairB_baaaaq.JPG)
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Other twin-engined projects with intermeshing propellers (not built, even if some could have been):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairB_baaaav.JPG)
EDIT: the second one was not Burnelli, sorry, I have changed it!
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Push-pull asymmetric Burnelli-Lightnings:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairB_baaaax.JPG)
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I have completed my finished entry but on the other forum Wuzak directed me to a peculiar Spitfire
http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o73/namnoitca7/DSC08378.jpg (http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o73/namnoitca7/DSC08378.jpg)
and I needed to design Burnelli-Lightnings this way too...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairB_baaaba.JPG)
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As the push-pull Spitfire mentionned above had tandem wings, I should add still new Burnelli-Lightnings:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairB_baaabb.JPG)
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Especially love that last, twin-bodied model Tophe :-*
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Thanks a lot, apophenia!
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Still other ones :
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairG_aai.JPG)
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And related to the Bv-138: the UB-138A, B, C:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairG_aaj.JPG)
And related to the Savoia S.55, 66 and 77: the UB-38SM-1, 2, 3:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairG_aal.JPG)
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aah yes,,, With high mounted engines on that novel configuration, you are onto flying boat designs :)
Very interesting. The plot thickens......
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Thanks finsrin for that new idea! ;)
Do you mean Burnelli lifting fuselage acting as Dornier sponsons? or supporting floats?
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The flying boats are pretty damn cool! :)
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Pictured you headed toward designs like one on left. But they both look doable as kitbashes waiting to happen.
Like for Something Floaty #2
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Thanks!
And as there were some Burnellis being single-boom, there could be designed such a Burnelli-sea-Lightning: UB-38DO (built under licence by Dornier, expert about sponsons):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairG_aan_zpsd4272ff3.jpg)
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To build this hmmm:
> P-38 kit for engines and outer wings 1/48
> Tail boom from any number of kits
> Nose from Banshee or your pick 1/48
> Center wing from OV-10 outer wings ? 1/48
> Main body from 1/72 XB-35/49 or scratch build or ?
Other ideas..... ?
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Great building project, thanks for the analysis!
But before deciding, let us consider that a Lightning flying boat shoulda be twin-hull, because this is a Lightning!:
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Last pic today (final day for the GB - I mean Group Build, not Great Britain...), September 15th 06:
10 19 am
This is the secret UB-38X-3 that made the first round-the-world flight without refueling, decades before the Rutan Voyager (though maybe on another planet): 40,000km range (24,860.16 miles) after a take-off run of 17km (10 miles)... ;)