Author Topic: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets  (Read 3322 times)

Offline Tophe

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Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« on: April 26, 2015, 02:16:48 AM »
With the high rate of prototype crashes, in France 1950s, the French government decided to use old airframes in all new prototypes (with a life expectation of 1 flight). So the first Mach2 French fighter was not a Mirage but a transformed Mustang called M-51D.
And the generals were so innocent, the Dassault company succeeded in selling a M-51Z, with the "promess" of reaching Mach4 for sure because 2 times 2=4... (cancelled before crash):

 :icon_fsm: :icon_alabanza: :icon_swat: :icon_music: :icon_ninja: :) ;) :D >:( 8)

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2015, 02:54:56 AM »
There was some competition though: the Nord-Aviation sellers came and told the generals "hey, this is impossible, look: HOW can you reach Mach 2 with 1 jet???!!!, so you need 2 jets on our M-38 Lightnijet, and if you need Mach4 performance: M-38Z Double-Lightnijet with 4 jets, this is logics!". Alas they got no contract, because the Dassault sellers explained Nord-Aviation was secretly communist, was the enemy...

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2015, 01:56:38 PM »
The Nord-Aviation sellers tried another way: "Yes, general, you are right: no need to sacrify the life of 2 test-pilots to reach Mach4, the M38Z2 do the same while killing a single pilot! Congratulations for you if you order it: sign here!"

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2015, 04:37:02 PM »
Dassault answered to the M-38Z2 proposal by a M-51H Hustlirage (and the M-51HZ for reaching Mach 8 ). They remained dreams, because too expensive probably...


Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #4 on: April 28, 2015, 12:35:25 PM »
The hypersonic rocket RF-51B/D and RF-82E came before (with USAF & NACA) but they were completely secret, with mysterious "transparent propeller blades" bringing no drag at all...:

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2015, 01:14:55 PM »
In the US, 1949, there were thousands of outdated P-51D "available" (replaced by P-51H in service), and before they were destroyed, a plan was considered, to transform them as VTOL P-51V:

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2015, 01:37:54 PM »
For stability in the vertical move, the P-51V was transformed in 1951 into the tandem-wing 5-engined P-51Vē:

(very short range, but very high speed and VTOL-feature!)

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2015, 04:32:56 PM »
The Mustangs ordered in 1936 (red), the Lightnings ordered in 1945 (blue)... simply using the fashion/technology of each time...:
« Last Edit: May 02, 2015, 06:10:33 PM by Tophe »

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2015, 07:12:36 PM »
The Mustangs ordered in 1936 (red), the Lightnings ordered in 1945 (blue)... simply using the fashion/technology of each time...:
The same for the Mustang 1935 (biplane) and Lightning 1946 (with motorjets):

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2015, 10:40:36 PM »
X-38A, B, C: P-38 converted in 1947 to challenge the sound barrier... (no need of jets, US scientists said)

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2015, 01:49:18 AM »
The Lightninginer was a Mach2 airliner, designed in 1946, using parts of the classical P-38:

(broken against the sound barrier, alas)

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #11 on: May 17, 2015, 01:08:29 PM »
Do you think there is no relation between Lightning and Lightninginer? See the missing links (that remained on the drawing board):

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #12 on: May 17, 2015, 03:30:51 PM »
Ups, there was an order mistake for the port rear propeller... ??? :(
Here is, corrected, the triplex:

Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #13 on: May 18, 2015, 01:38:41 AM »
Ooooh, now i can see what a supersonic P-38 may have looked like!!

And i like it :-*

Offline Tophe

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Re: Mustang Mach2 and other secrets
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2015, 12:24:45 AM »
Thanks a lot!
And the next one was the hypersonic Lightninginer H (reaching Mach 5 in stratospher):

(alas broken against the heat barrier ??? )