Author Topic: Seaknight & M16, red : primary seaplanes  (Read 287985 times)

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #75 on: September 16, 2015, 10:09:57 PM »

well, I'm not in it for the money, luckily because I don't think it would quite work  ;)
I am rather looking for the fun of pursuing ideas like "what if aircraft had some relation with insects?"

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #76 on: October 29, 2015, 02:25:13 AM »


I had it in mind for some years, I don't really know why, and it had to be the twin seater ...
and finally I met a nice TA4 kit, which I combined with a beautifully shaped Twin Otter float :








Online GTX_Admin

  • Evil Administrator bent on taking over the Universe!
  • Administrator - Yep, I'm the one to blame for this place.
  • Whiffing Demi-God!
    • Beyond the Sprues
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #77 on: October 29, 2015, 02:56:34 AM »
 :)
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it.

Offline finsrin

  • The Dr Frankenstein of the modelling world...when not hiding from SBA
  • Finds part glues it on, finds part glues it on....
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #78 on: October 29, 2015, 04:23:36 AM »
Nice A4, this works  :)
Inspired to build similar.

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #79 on: October 29, 2015, 12:42:17 PM »
Very harmonious, thanks for this piece of enjoyment. :-*

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #80 on: October 29, 2015, 06:02:50 PM »
thanks all

Nice A4, this works  :)
Inspired to build similar.

please do !  ;)
I use only monochrome primary colors, but other liveries coudl be invented

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #81 on: October 31, 2015, 02:19:07 PM »
I have been inspired this morning, thanks a lot, ericr! ;)

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #82 on: October 31, 2015, 05:28:51 PM »
I have been inspired this morning, thanks a lot, ericr! ;)


beautiful!

I makes me think of this, which I posted some (long) time ago :






Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #83 on: October 31, 2015, 05:50:26 PM »
Wonderful Bv-194W, yes :-* :-*

Offline Volkodav

  • Counts rivits with his abacus...
  • Much older now...but procrastinating about it
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #84 on: October 31, 2015, 06:35:48 PM »
Just imagine an amphibian version or the Skyhawk Floatplane with perhaps harrier type undercarriage incorporated into the central float and out riggers!  Just imagine the diabolical challenges in making it work for a land based amphibian Skyhawk, then also for a carrier operation (like the Walrus, Sea Otter and Seagull ASR1 etc.), could you imagine the absolute terror experienced by pilots coming to land an amphibian Skyhawk or similar on a carrier?

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #85 on: November 02, 2015, 04:41:39 AM »
Just imagine an amphibian version or the Skyhawk Floatplane with perhaps harrier type undercarriage incorporated into the central float and out riggers!  Just imagine the diabolical challenges in making it work for a land based amphibian Skyhawk, then also for a carrier operation (like the Walrus, Sea Otter and Seagull ASR1 etc.), could you imagine the absolute terror experienced by pilots coming to land an amphibian Skyhawk or similar on a carrier?


luckily, in the whiff world, there is no fear  ;D

speaking of the Harrier, I did try something, not amphibious but ...





Offline elmayerle

  • Its about time there was an Avatar shown here...
  • Über Engineer...at least that is what he tells us.
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #86 on: November 02, 2015, 07:04:25 AM »
What can I say, that Harrier looks so right!  Another thought for one that would look so right, a Grumman Panther on a single float.

Offline FAAMAN

  • 'bin building for years ....... and it feels it!
  • Always thought of himself as a 'straight' modeller
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #87 on: November 02, 2015, 03:51:28 PM »
Being a bit of a TA-4 buff, I'd have to say your float TA-4 is a cool idea 8), a great bit of original thought and Whiffery :) ;)  8) 8)

From what I can see in your pics (a side and bottom view would've been helpful) the problem is there just isn't any structure where you've picked to attach to the fuselage on your model. The front attachment is in a void called the 'Forward Hell Hole' that gives access to aileron power pack, engine intake, front face of the engine and the CSD unit, also a rack can be attached here for a large bag (for pilot kit).
The aft attachment you've chosen appears to also be in a void, called the 'Aft Hell Hole' where we gain access to the single point refuelling receptacle, hydraulic couplings, drains, the rear engine mount, wing tank fuel pump and the jet pipe attachment fitting, it would severely interfere with engine changes (the whole tail comes off an A-4/TA-4 to effect an engine change) and make it unnecessarily complicated.

The best attachment option would be to use stores station 3 on the centre line belly where it is already stressed for 3600lb (?) weapons carriage. The loss of this weapons station would not be a big problem as you could install a fuel tank in the float and instantly increase the jet's range. Also a single pylon attachment would reduce form drag and limit the affect on the jets manoeuvrability requiring no modification to do engine changes or standard A-4/TA-4 maintenance. Also you could use the now unused main landing gear bays as extra fuel tanks for even more range.

Are your out rigger floats fitted to the outer weapon stations? These stations are cleared to carry 500lbs each and would make an excellent place to fit floats with some beefing up of the structure. There is a bit of a prob with outriggers that cannot fold or retract as an A-4 can roll at approx. 720deg a second, pilots that do this with a full wing tank have actually blown out the tip of the wing tanks due to excessive G at these locations, so one would think a non-retractable/foldable float assembly wound not fare well either.

I'd be concerned at the amount of spray that the voracious J-52 would suck up at full power, so it makes sense to increase the width and length fore and aft of the gun blast strakes and have them double as intake spray guards without affecting the guns.

Well done again, hope this helps,
Neil
"Resistance is useless, prepare to be assembled!"

Offline Volkodav

  • Counts rivits with his abacus...
  • Much older now...but procrastinating about it
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #88 on: November 02, 2015, 10:18:48 PM »
Fairey Fulmar or Battle, maybe even a Bolton Paul Defiant on a single float, a float plane scout fighter for service on capital ships with a number of aircraft, i.e. three fighters and one Walrus instead of four Walrus.  Mid war changes to Fireflies, maybe even Typhoons ;)

Offline FAAMAN

  • 'bin building for years ....... and it feels it!
  • Always thought of himself as a 'straight' modeller
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #89 on: November 03, 2015, 11:58:10 AM »
Forgot to mention it but the Blackburn B.44 was a very interesting take on seaplane fighter design  8)
"Resistance is useless, prepare to be assembled!"

Offline Volkodav

  • Counts rivits with his abacus...
  • Much older now...but procrastinating about it
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #90 on: November 03, 2015, 04:05:01 PM »
Forgot to mention it but the Blackburn B.44 was a very interesting take on seaplane fighter design  8)

And the obvious question to follow that is, "what are Unicraft kits like?"

Offline Tophe

  • He sees things in double...
  • twin-boom & asymmetric fan
    • my models
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #91 on: November 04, 2015, 01:25:24 AM »
Wonderful float-Harrier (this is "The Real Sea-Harrier" somehow!). :-*
I just wonder what happens at (vertical) take-off: does the flame backwards make the water boil and go to steam like big fume? weird... ;)

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #92 on: November 04, 2015, 08:16:58 PM »
What can I say, that Harrier looks so right!  Another thought for one that would look so right, a Grumman Panther on a single float.

thanks for the compliment, and thanks for the idea  ;D

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #93 on: November 04, 2015, 08:22:29 PM »
Being a bit of a TA-4 buff, I'd have to say your float TA-4 is a cool idea 8), a great bit of original thought and Whiffery :) ;)  8) 8)

From what I can see in your pics

... snip ...

Well done again, hope this helps,
Neil

thank you very much for your appreciation!
You seem indeed to be a Skyhawk specialist, which makes it even more meaningful to me.
I have to confess (but you might have guessed already  ;) ) that my Whiffery is of the wild kind, rather than carefully engineered.
Actually, when I considered where to attach the float, I thought about the central pod place indeed, but that seemed too high and close to the fuselage; then I noticed two rectangles in the panel lines (probably the accesses to the holes you mention) and went for that ;-) and then the side floats ended up a bit far from the wings indeed ... it "works" only in a whiff world


Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #94 on: November 04, 2015, 08:27:53 PM »
Fairey Fulmar or Battle, maybe even a Bolton Paul Defiant on a single float, a float plane scout fighter for service on capital ships with a number of aircraft, i.e. three fighters and one Walrus instead of four Walrus.  Mid war changes to Fireflies, maybe even Typhoons ;)


thanks a lot for the ideas : I still have a few floats left indeed  ;D

a Defiant on floats would remind of a Blackburn ROC which I did in the past







Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #95 on: November 04, 2015, 08:29:29 PM »
Forgot to mention it but the Blackburn B.44 was a very interesting take on seaplane fighter design  8)

a beautiful concept indeed, a bit amphigouric maybe  ;)

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #96 on: November 04, 2015, 08:31:42 PM »
Wonderful float-Harrier (this is "The Real Sea-Harrier" somehow!). :-*
I just wonder what happens at (vertical) take-off: does the flame backwards make the water boil and go to steam like big fume? weird... ;)

as PR19_kit once said, it can make for a good tea ;-)


Offline Volkodav

  • Counts rivits with his abacus...
  • Much older now...but procrastinating about it
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #97 on: November 04, 2015, 11:25:48 PM »
I don't know why but a central float with out riggers just seems to look cleaner and faster than a twin float set up.  I know its more complex than that but that's how it looks.

Offline ericr

  • He's like some sort of Dr Frankenstein of modelling...
  • Has something for red, yellow or blue...
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #98 on: November 05, 2015, 12:39:25 AM »
I don't know why but a central float with out riggers just seems to look cleaner and faster than a twin float set up.  I know its more complex than that but that's how it looks.

yes indeed, it looks more elegant somehow I agree

Offline Volkodav

  • Counts rivits with his abacus...
  • Much older now...but procrastinating about it
Re: Puma, red : primary seaplanes
« Reply #99 on: November 05, 2015, 11:33:14 PM »
It could even be justified in terms of permitting a ship configured to operate Walrus, Otter or Seagull amphibians to also easily operate single main float fighters.  The King George V class battleships as well as the pre-WWII battleship and battlecruiser modernisations included a cross deck catapult and hangers for four aircraft of Walrus size, so could easily accommodate float plane versions of the types I listed previously.

I have long imagined floatplane fighters designed to fly off RN battleships in the 1930s with more and more powerful types entering service through until sufficient numbers of carriers made them irrelevant.  Your neat work is getting the ideas flowing, especially that Skyhawk.