Sikorsky S-92/VH-92A

[The Big Gimper]

Sikorsky Receives Second Contract To Build Presidential Helicopters

STRATFORD, Conn., Feb. 20, 2020 - Sikorsky, a Lockheed Martin company, will build six production VH-92A® Presidential Helicopters under a contract from the U.S. Navy. These helicopters are part of the 23 aircraft program of record for the U.S. Marine Corps.

Under the terms of the contract, known as Low Rate Initial Production (LRIP) Lot II, Sikorsky will begin deliveries of six VH-92A helicopters in 2022. The remaining production aircraft will be delivered in 2022 and 2023.

All six of the production aircraft from the first Low Rate Initial Production contract are undergoing modifications at Sikorsky's Stratford, Connecticut plant and are on schedule to begin deliveries in 2021.

The VH-92A aircraft will provide safe, reliable and capable transportation for the President and Vice President.
This program ensures long term affordability and maintainability by utilizing the FAA certified S-92 aircraft which has industry leading reliability and availability. The S-92 fleet surpassed 1.5 million flight hours in 2019 and averages 14,400 hours of safe flight per month.

[Kerick]

Blackhawk meets Jolly Green Giant!

[LemonJello]

I need one* of these in 1/48 kit form. 

* 1 is just a starting point, a more reasonable total would be 3

[Jeffry Fontaine]

Blackhawk meets Jolly Green Giant!

I need one* of these in 1/48 kit form. 
* 1 is just a starting point, a more reasonable total would be 3

I think Kerick has the right analysis to create one of these in 1:48th scale.  HH-3 (1:72nd scale) + UH-60 (1:48th scale)= 1:48th scale S-92/VH-92

[jcf]

So, I guess they fixed the various mechanical gremlins? 

[jcf]

Blackhawk meets Jolly Green Giant!

I need one* of these in 1/48 kit form. 
* 1 is just a starting point, a more reasonable total would be 3

I think Kerick has the right analysis to create one of these in 1:48th scale.  HH-3 (1:72nd scale) + UH-60 (1:48th scale)= 1:48th scale S-92/VH-92

 
Not even close.
 
Aside from being completely different shapes the three machines are very similar in size.

S-61R/HH-3
Length: 73 ft (22 m)
Height: 18 ft 1 in (5.51 m)
Main rotor diameter: 62 ft (19 m)

S-70/H-60
Length: 64 ft 10 in (19.76 m)
Height: 17 ft 6 in (5.33 m)
Rotor diameter: 53 ft 8 in (16.36 m)

S-92/CH-148/VH-92
Length: 68 ft 6 in (20.88 m)
Rotor diameter: 56 ft 4 in (17.17 m)
Height: 15 ft 5 in (4.71 m)

[kitnut617]

So, I guess they fixed the various mechanical gremlins? 

Hopefully ----    Only taken 17 years (and counting)   ---

[taiidantomcat]

They are very pretty helicopters  was absolutely obsessed with them about 4 years ago, came up with about a dozen different Lego iterations of the nose/cockpit section trying to find one I liked best.




This is a "real life what if" painted in military camo to attract military buyers.






 

[apophenia]

Hopefully ----    Only taken 17 years (and counting)   ---

Plenty of blame-share to go around there 

Sikorsky for pretending that the SH-92 and H-92 were the same or different according to convenience. UT for whining every time they missed every deadline (and the GoC for letting them get away with it - a shout-out there for Steve and Pete). Avio SpA for blowing CT78-E development (and GE for sub-contracting '8C work and making the CT7-8C necessary in the first place).

NDHQ and the MHP PMO for specifying their overly-complex MHP Integrated Mission System. GD Canada for promising that they could deliver this MHP IMS on-time and on-schedule. The Directorate of Aerospace Requirements for not telling MARCOM that they were dreaming when the New Shipboard Aircraft Requirement drifted out of the realm of reality. The DAR again for not correcting Air Command's petulant demands on cabin size (with the notion that big somehow represented a win for them).

The GoC (Mulroney) for dragging out NSA (1985-1993). The GoC (Mulroney, again) for allowing DND to hide the unstowed details by combining NSA with the New SAR Helicopter Project. The GoC (Campbell) for kicking NSA into the electoral tall grass. The GoC (Chrétien) for f@cking up the CH148 Petrel order (and paying half a Billion in penalties instead of using the threat of cancellation to wangle a better combined purchase deal). The GoC (Martin) for freezing all DND projects except MHP. The GoC (Harper) for not having the wits to screw a MH-60R Seahawk contract out of Sikorsky when they missed their delayed, delayed, delayed deadline. The GoC (Harper, again) for letting Peter MacKay plough on while forgiving Sikorsky its contractually obliged late-delivery fees.

Okay, starting to repeat myself and spray foam on my screen ... who needs a drink? ... 

[Gingie]

^ Well said.

[Kerick]

I’m pretty ignorant of this program but I just have to ask, why didn’t they go with an SH-60 or Merlin or some other preexisting type?

[kitnut617]

I’m pretty ignorant of this program but I just have to ask, why didn’t they go with an SH-60 or Merlin or some other preexisting type?

Well the Merlin was on order, but after a change in government, the incoming bunch cancelled it, costing millions of dollar in cancellation fees. Then they didn't do anything for years but then just before the PM retired, he went and ordered the Sikorsky, supposedly an 'off-the-shelf' purchase. But as we know, it was anything but --- and as I said, it's now 17 years and counting. Nine Cyclones were delivered, but these are pre-production aircraft, not the full deal. We're still waiting for the 'full deal' aircraft.

I have seen one though, about a week before the 2018 Abbotsford Airshow where it was to be revealed to the public. It had flown into YYC and landed not far from where I was working that day.

[dy031101]

Thanks for the update- I apparently somehow adopted an over-optimistic version of the story *banging head against the wall*

[taiidantomcat]

Hopefully ----    Only taken 17 years (and counting)   ---

Plenty of blame-share to go around there 

Sikorsky for pretending that the SH-92 and H-92 were the same or different according to convenience. UT for whining every time they missed every deadline (and the GoC for letting them get away with it - a shout-out there for Steve and Pete). Avio SpA for blowing CT78-E development (and GE for sub-contracting '8C work and making the CT7-8C necessary in the first place).

NDHQ and the MHP PMO for specifying their overly-complex MHP Integrated Mission System. GD Canada for promising that they could deliver this MHP IMS on-time and on-schedule. The Directorate of Aerospace Requirements for not telling MARCOM that they were dreaming when the New Shipboard Aircraft Requirement drifted out of the realm of reality. The DAR again for not correcting Air Command's petulant demands on cabin size (with the notion that big somehow represented a win for them).

The GoC (Mulroney) for dragging out NSA (1985-1993). The GoC (Mulroney, again) for allowing DND to hide the unstowed details by combining NSA with the New SAR Helicopter Project. The GoC (Campbell) for kicking NSA into the electoral tall grass. The GoC (Chrétien) for f@cking up the CH148 Petrel order (and paying half a Billion in penalties instead of using the threat of cancellation to wangle a better combined purchase deal). The GoC (Martin) for freezing all DND projects except MHP. The GoC (Harper) for not having the wits to screw a MH-60R Seahawk contract out of Sikorsky when they missed their delayed, delayed, delayed deadline. The GoC (Harper, again) for letting Peter MacKay plough on while forgiving Sikorsky its contractually obliged late-delivery fees.

Okay, starting to repeat myself and spray foam on my screen ... who needs a drink? ... 

It was a very high risk thing sold as low risk. S-92 has almost no issues as a civilian transport. Canada decided to be the beta-testers for the heavily militarized/specialist version though.

[Kerick]

Well, in the US we bought a bunch of C-27s and sent them straight to the bone yard. At least the Coast Guard has picked them up. It appears we also bought some of these Sikorsky’s for presidential transports a few years ago and did basically the same thing. Then Canada bought these nearly new choppers for spare parts, but then couldn’t decide to part them out or rebuilt to add to the fleet. Were does this stupidity end? For Pete’s sake! Decide what is needed and then go get it!

Biggest part of the problem is when people place politics over doing right by the people.

[kitnut617]

 S-92 has almost no issues as a civilian transport.

The S-92 has/had a major transmission problem, I wouldn't call that almost no issues TC.

[apophenia]

I’m pretty ignorant of this program but I just have to ask, why didn’t they go with an SH-60 or Merlin or some other preexisting type?

Well the Merlin was on order, but after a change in government, the incoming bunch cancelled it, costing millions of dollar in cancellation fees. Then they didn't do anything for years but then just before the PM retired, he went and ordered the Sikorsky, supposedly an 'off-the-shelf' purchase. But as we know, it was anything but --- and as I said, it's now 17 years and counting. Nine Cyclones were delivered, but these are pre-production aircraft, not the full deal. We're still waiting for the 'full deal' aircraft.

I have seen one though, about a week before the 2018 Abbotsford Airshow where it was to be revealed to the public. It had flown into YYC and landed not far from where I was working that day.

kerick: The SH-60 ... actually, the export S-70 version ... was offered to Canada back when the MHP was still NSA. But the ideal cabin size had already been announced by DND and the S-70 cabin was too small - judged both too short to stand up in and not big enough to accommodate all the internal kit desired for Canadian ASW missions.

Bowing to the inevitable, Sikorsky pulled the S-70 from the NSA contest before it could be officially eliminated. I've often wondered if that experience was what part of what prompted Sikorsky to develop the S-92 into the H-92 in the first place (although my sense was that the H-92 started out as more of an S-61R/HH-3 analogue).

Cyclone: It's a noisy sucker,  isn't it Robert?  Having both CH148s and CH149s overhead within a few days of each other gave an opportunity for comparison. Struck me as peculiar that DND ended up with a quiet rescue helicopter and a loud ASW aircraft 

[elmayerle]

Well, in the US we bought a bunch of C-27s and sent them straight to the bone yard. At least the Coast Guard has picked them up. It appears we also bought some of these Sikorsky’s for presidential transports a few years ago and did basically the same thing. Then Canada bought these nearly new choppers for spare parts, but then couldn’t decide to part them out or rebuilt to add to the fleet. Were does this stupidity end? For Pete’s sake! Decide what is needed and then go get it!

Biggest part of the problem is when people place politics over doing right by the people.

Actually, the US first went with modified EH-101s for presidential helicopters but then did such a requirements creep that more redesign was needed, as well as more powerful engines, and the whole program got cancelled.  The new presidential helicopter in development is a derivative of the S-92.  Hopefully their experience with the presidential S-61s will help them get this right.

[taiidantomcat]

 S-92 has almost no issues as a civilian transport.

The S-92 has/had a major transmission problem, I wouldn't call that almost no issues TC.

I used the qualifier "almost" 

Remember that the S-92 was supposed to be the "logical" and "low risk" blackhawk derivative that was supposed to be the alternative to the "widow maker" V-22 Osprey. Naturally it ended up with some horrific accidents as well. No free lunches.

[jcf]

Remember that the S-92 was supposed to be the "logical" and "low risk" blackhawk derivative that was supposed to be the alternative to the "widow maker" V-22 Osprey. Naturally it ended up with some horrific accidents as well. No free lunches.

The S-92 was a civil transport program from the start, notions to militarize it were an afterthought.

[taiidantomcat]

Remember that the S-92 was supposed to be the "logical" and "low risk" blackhawk derivative that was supposed to be the alternative to the "widow maker" V-22 Osprey. Naturally it ended up with some horrific accidents as well. No free lunches.

The S-92 was a civil transport program from the start, notions to militarize it were an afterthought.

it was critics who had no idea what they were talking about. before the S-92 the pressure was on with blackhawks.

[kitnut617]

So, I guess they fixed the various mechanical gremlins? 

Hopefully ----    Only taken 17 years (and counting)   ---

This is not good news ----

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/helicopter-crash-canadian-navy-fredericton-1.5549654

Although there's no news yet on what happened to it.