Beyond The Sprues

Modelling => Ideas & Inspiration => Aero-space => Topic started by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 03:18:18 AM

Title: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 03:18:18 AM
Hi folks,

A thread for your Messerschmitt Bf110 (and Me210/Me310/Me410) Ideas and Inspiration.

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/melbsyd/6zg76screenshot.jpg)

Regards,

Greg
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 03:20:25 AM
To begin with, here are some I did a while ago:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/melbsyd/ST110G4.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/melbsyd/110est.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 03:22:59 AM
Some more:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/Bf110T-1a2.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/bf110ss.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 03:24:41 AM
More:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/Bf110C1FW.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/Bf110SSC.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 03:26:58 AM
Last but not least..my favourite:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/Bf110T-1a.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/Bf110T-1a1.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/Bf110T-1b.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/Bf110T-1.jpg)

scheduled to be rendered in plastic in 1/48 in the future.

Regards,

Greg
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 03:28:22 AM
One more:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/ecf73177.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 03:30:47 AM
Well, maybe another couple:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/melbsyd/110G4r.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/melbsyd/110e1tur.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 04, 2012, 04:03:25 AM
One more:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/5ce5bfad.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: elmayerle on May 04, 2012, 12:46:01 PM
And the most obvious, to my mind, set of variants isn't even mentioned.  It's a fact that the German DB605-powered Spitfire used the BF110 cowling because the contours at the firewall were very close.  Why not, then, transplant a pair of Spitfire engine and cowling installations on to a Bf110.  Exact mark of Spitfire used would depend on when the conversion was done, as well as in whose service it was done.  I could see Spanish-built Bf110 variants with either late-model Merlins or Griffons; for a bit more outre variation, Griffons with contra-props.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: Daryl J. on May 04, 2012, 01:03:03 PM
If the Dragon and Eduard kits were not so time consuming of a build, I'd build one with extra-early cowlings and fully spatted mains similar to what the Stuka first had.   Each seating position would have a 3 pane windscreen but the rest would be open cockpit.
Twin blade props.
And in Spanish Civil War markings.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 06, 2012, 04:21:37 AM
We know about the Bf-109TL proposal:

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0b/Bf109TL_Seite.jpg/800px-Bf109TL_Seite.jpg)

But what about an equivalent Bf-110TL proposal with the pistons replaced by jets?

Regards

Greg
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: raafif on May 06, 2012, 08:23:56 AM
Quote from: Daryl J. on May 04, 2012, 01:03:03 PM
one with extra-early cowlings and fully spatted mains similar to what the Stuka first had.   Each seating position would have a 3 pane windscreen but the rest would be open cockpit.
Twin blade props.
And in Spanish Civil War markings.

 :o

get to it >:( Greg !!  Only you can do this idea justice in pixels ....... I'm sure there are several others here who would like to see it too 8)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: elmayerle on May 06, 2012, 09:58:28 AM
Quote from: GTX_Admin on May 06, 2012, 04:21:37 AM
We know about the Bf-109TL proposal:

([url]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0b/Bf109TL_Seite.jpg/800px-Bf109TL_Seite.jpg[/url])

But what about an equivalent Bf-110TL proposal with the pistons replaced by jets?

Regards

Greg


Perhaps with two jet engines in each nacelle with the installation designed so that the main gear can retract between the exhausts?  You could either keep it a tail-dragger or look at a tricycle-gear installation.  My own thoughts are to keep it a tail-dragger.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: jcf on May 06, 2012, 01:54:22 PM
(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/bf-110TRI.jpg)
Bf 110 wind-tunnel model based on a 109

(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/BF110_V9_01.jpg)
110 with shortened nose ala Me 210

(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/ME110_REARFACE_MG17_01.jpg)
Rear-fuselage mounted aft facing MG 17

(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/ME110_REARFACE_MG17_02.jpg)
Sight for same

(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/ME110_TURRET_01.jpg)
Experimental remote-controlled gun installation

(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/ME110_TURRET_02.jpg)
Close-up of same

(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/ME410_BMW003.jpg)
A proposal to add one or two jets to the belly of a 410, why not use the same basic concept for a 110?

Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: apophenia on May 07, 2012, 09:48:01 AM
A variation on that single-seat Bf 110 theme ...
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: raafif on May 07, 2012, 01:10:02 PM
Here you are Daryl, my first try ..... 3 open cockpits, short nose, early engines & pantaloons !

(http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s34/hobgrot/110-0.png)

                 yet to add the red-brown cam.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: elmayerle on May 07, 2012, 01:30:04 PM
It has a definite look to it, though the engine installations look a bit too streamlined.  Perhaps something similar to the engine installation on the early Bf109?
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 07, 2012, 03:29:43 PM
Quote from: apophenia on May 07, 2012, 09:48:01 AM
A variation on that single-seat Bf 110 theme ...


Kind of looks familiar...

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/Me410SS.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 07, 2012, 03:30:58 PM
Quote from: elmayerle on May 07, 2012, 01:30:04 PM
It has a definite look to it, though the engine installations look a bit too streamlined.  Perhaps something similar to the engine installation on the early Bf109?

Or maybe similar to the He-51?

Still good though.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 07, 2012, 03:33:29 PM
How about a twin boom '110:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/Bf110TB.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: raafif on May 07, 2012, 05:26:46 PM
cammed in the German Fighter / Fighter-bomber scheme -- light green-grey & red-brown.

(http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s34/hobgrot/110-01.png)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: raafif on May 09, 2012, 11:50:40 AM
(http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s34/hobgrot/110aJ.png)

Also sold to Sweden to complement their Junkers K-47s.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: apophenia on May 09, 2012, 11:55:09 AM
Nice. The BMW 132 radials make a big difference  :)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: A1_Phoenix on May 09, 2012, 05:11:42 PM
Lovely both scw and japan version!  :)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 10, 2012, 03:49:59 AM
Quote from: apophenia on May 09, 2012, 11:55:09 AM
Nice. The BMW 132 radials make a big difference  :)

Indeed!
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: raafif on May 10, 2012, 07:15:41 AM
(http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s34/hobgrot/110aS.png)

(http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s34/hobgrot/110aF.png)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: apophenia on May 10, 2012, 11:28:49 AM
Love it! I bet that Finnish example is the first one to evolve a cockpit canopy! Brrr ...  :o
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: Daryl J. on May 10, 2012, 12:37:37 PM
Flying Frozen Finns!  :-)

I like all the open cockpit/spatted profiles guys!  Thanks for the efforts.
 :)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: raafif on May 10, 2012, 01:52:31 PM
if you check, I've replaced the above Spanish war ones with more appropiate early engines.

Now for the first one with a full canopy
(http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s34/hobgrot/110a1.png)

The early 3-tone cam was a bit spikey !
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: sequoiaranger on July 15, 2012, 08:30:56 AM
To navalize a Bf-110 for carrier-torpedo-bomber use aboard the Italian carrier Aquila, Macchi of Italy added a third engine (Tifone DB-601 clone), wingtips, made the double tail into triple tails, added the Me-410 cockpit/canopy and remotely-firing rear defense guns (plus torpedo, of course!) and created a folding wing. A Squadron of Mc 605's were set to do a "Doolittle Raid" (launched by carriers, land on home base) on Alexandria and any shipping in the Suez. By the time the attack was ready to be launched the Italians had capitulated.

Italy and the carrier Aquila surrendered to the Allies, and was prepped for use against the Japanese in Indonesia. Fascist Italian markings gave way to new "Allied Italian" stars-and-bars using Italy's red, white, and green. The red was eventually deleted when the Aquila arrived in the Far East (so as not to have any red that might be mistaken for a Hinomaru), but the attractive three-color style was used by the United States post-War using blue.

(http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv173/sequoiaranger/Mc605Vendetta06m.jpg)

(http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv173/sequoiaranger/Mc605Vendetta03-m.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: finsrin on July 15, 2012, 02:27:00 PM
So inspiring  :-*      Kit-bashing gray cells are wide awake  :o
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: Daryl J. on July 16, 2012, 09:58:45 AM
Back to the spatted, open cockpit variant:   H-S 12Y with the twin blade prop a la Avia 534 series III.   
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: sequoiaranger on July 17, 2012, 02:30:57 PM
A real-world project, the Bf-162 was a slightly-oversized Bf-110 with a glass nose--a "competitor" in a bid for official production that was won by the Ju-88 instead.

http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=1190 (http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=1190)

I have a contemporary treatise on the Battle of Britain that had an illustration of the "Jaguar"and the narrative stated it as being used/seen over the British Isles. Nope. Kinda like the Heinkel He-113--propaganda.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 17, 2012, 06:23:10 PM
Also see here:  http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=1320.msg18616#msg18616 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=1320.msg18616#msg18616)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 17, 2013, 02:30:32 AM
Random Idea:  Finnish Bf110
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: arkon on May 17, 2013, 08:35:32 AM
thinking p-38 style pond racer
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: elmayerle on June 17, 2013, 09:50:12 AM
Bf110 license-built in Spain and later re-engined with Merlins, much like the Buchon was.  Since a Bf110 engine cowling was used on the DB-powered Spitfire the Luftwaffe tested, perhaps Spitfire engine cowlings could be used here.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: jcf on June 18, 2013, 02:35:13 AM
Quote from: elmayerle on June 17, 2013, 09:50:12 AM
Bf110 license-built in Spain and later re-engined with Merlins, much like the Buchon was.  Since a Bf110 engine cowling was used on the DB-powered Spitfire the Luftwaffe tested, perhaps Spitfire engine cowlings could be used here.


Na, Hispano 12Z powered Ha 1109 K-1L type cowlings with the Italian-style cheek oil coolers. 
Just like its single-engined stablemate it will look cool and perform like crap. ;D

(http://me109.airwar1946.nl/foreign/images/008spain12.jpg)

(http://me109.airwar1946.nl/family/Images/aj3-ha1109-4.jpg)

Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: perttime on June 18, 2013, 03:03:52 AM
How would the Bf 110 handle a pair of Junkers Jumo 213s?
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: Rickshaw on June 18, 2013, 08:09:08 AM
How about a Turbo-Prop powered, tricycle undercarriaged, single-seat Bf110?
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: elmayerle on October 08, 2013, 01:05:35 PM
I don't know that I've ever seen it mentioned, were there /Trop versions of the Bf110 and follow-ons similar to the sand filters added to the Bf109 and MC.202 for desert operations?   that could make for interesting markings options for North African operations.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 08, 2013, 07:25:41 PM
Yes there were definitely "Tropicalised" versions of the Bf110:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/image_zps19c5c87f.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/image_zps124deb94.jpg)

I believe they were mainly C and E variants.  "Tropicalisation" consisted of adding a dust filter on the port wing air intake and also redesigned nacelles featuring deeper oil cooler housings
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: elmayerle on October 08, 2013, 08:18:32 PM
Which leads one to wonder what Tropicalized Me210's and Me410s would look like.  Methinks this could be done as a subtle whif.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 09, 2013, 01:58:35 AM
I like the subtle whiff idea. :)

I doubt anything on the 210 given their curtailed operational use.  The Me410 would be possible though.  I know they were used operationally in the Mediterranean but I don't know if any were given a Trop modification.  Will check up more this weekend.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 10, 2013, 03:24:38 AM
Thinking about this a bit more, I quite like the idea of a Me410 in ANR markings similar to below:

(http://www.maquetland.com/v2/images_articles/39ANR%202.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: The Big Gimper on October 11, 2013, 11:01:10 PM
Me 210/410 torpedo bomber: Early stages of thought design but use TBF wings (I checked and they do fit), add a Junkers Jumo 211D upfront (JU-87?) and a tail hook.  Me510T?
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 12, 2013, 04:06:47 AM
The Me410 was trialed with a torpedo in real life.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 12, 2013, 04:17:50 AM
(http://s2.postimage.org/1kycb7br5/0_Me410_134.jpg)
(http://s2.postimage.org/3cuuihl66/0_Me410_136.jpg)
(http://s2.postimage.org/isxsjwbg/0_Me410_137.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 03, 2015, 02:31:36 AM
Random ideas:

Turkish Bf110
Spanish Bf110
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: Volkodav on January 03, 2015, 09:12:37 PM
Quote from: GTX_Admin on October 12, 2013, 04:17:50 AM
([url]http://s2.postimage.org/1kycb7br5/0_Me410_134.jpg[/url])
([url]http://s2.postimage.org/3cuuihl66/0_Me410_136.jpg[/url])
([url]http://s2.postimage.org/isxsjwbg/0_Me410_137.jpg[/url])


Carrier or land based?
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: jcf on January 04, 2015, 12:52:28 AM
The proposed anti-ship variants of the Me 410 (which is what they were rather than dedicated 'torpedo bombers') were all to be land-based aircraft. The Baltic and the Med were the intended areas of operation. Oh, and the Black Sea provided the Nazis and their allies could have held on to any of the coastal areas on that body of water.
 ;D

While some kit was tested on B models, the production anti-ship aircraft was to be a version of the Me 410C.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 26, 2015, 06:01:15 AM
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-sYCoIGsMrGc/UwIJRcYJxEI/AAAAAAAAMcQ/ZKW0YKg2pkE/s1600/ScreenshotBf-110asKi-45Skinpack.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: arkon on July 26, 2015, 02:18:02 PM
Wow. That looks really good in Japanese camo.
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 08, 2021, 02:03:00 AM
Does anyone know if you can get a 1/48 conversion for this fitment to the Me410:

(https://www.asisbiz.com/il2/Me-410/Messerschmitt-Me-410/images/Messerschmitt-Me-410-Hornisse-02.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: Geoff on January 09, 2021, 07:53:04 PM
Love the idea of a Japanese 110
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 10, 2021, 04:51:11 AM
Quote from: GTX_Admin on October 12, 2013, 04:17:50 AM
([url]http://s2.postimage.org/1kycb7br5/0_Me410_134.jpg[/url])
([url]http://s2.postimage.org/3cuuihl66/0_Me410_136.jpg[/url])
([url]http://s2.postimage.org/isxsjwbg/0_Me410_137.jpg[/url])


Better image:

(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/e68/GTwiner/410torps.jpg)
Title: Re: Messerschmitt Bf110/Me210/Me310/Me410 Ideas and Inspiration
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 29, 2021, 02:14:05 AM
Random idea:  Bf110D but with honking big gun protruding from belly tank:

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/proxy/qbnKIqGFBhZGiYYaui_KGAGOwUYelA1AonJfBRofqVdFLNBeFZK64DwuEGOhGO3TK4lLnjlQ9A3pByjXr_8)