Author Topic: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....  (Read 2966 times)

Offline Aeroplanedriver

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Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« on: March 10, 2019, 08:24:01 AM »
Hase's 1/48 A-4 is one of my favorite kits.  I've done two in the past, a RN FG.5 back about ten years ago that actually won a Group Build and more recently a RW USMC A-4E. 

I picked up an A-4M a while back and decided to tackle it as my next build.   When I was kid in the early 80s we did a couple of family vacations in the low country of South Carolina, not far from Beaufort MCAS, and I will never forget being on the beach and watching a pair of Marine A-4Ms in low vis markings screaming along the waterfront down low. 

My original plan was to build this kit as a Beaufort based A-4M from VMA-311 "Tomcats" using the great looking TwoBobs decals. 

As I got going with the build though I'm having second thoughts...While I love the muscular look of the A-4 with the avionics hump, I REALLY love the sleek look of it without it. 
« Last Edit: March 10, 2019, 09:27:56 AM by Aeroplanedriver »

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2019, 09:07:13 AM »
I actually prefer the versions with the hump.  They look more pugnacious to me.

That said, if you want one without the hump, maybe model something akin to the Singaporean Super Skyhawks.
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Offline Aeroplanedriver

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2019, 09:38:47 AM »
I actually prefer the versions with the hump.  They look more pugnacious to me.


I am VERY torn...I love the look with the hump too...but there is just something about the non-hump ones that looks like the perfect jet design to me. 

Having said that I am getting close to decision time...





I think I need to sleep on this one.  If you look closely you see that two of the three slat tracks on the left wing are missing...It came out of the bag that way..I found one, but the other is lost to the styrene gods.  I was already leaning towards a nice clean inflight build on a stand, so this may be a deciding factor.  Much as I love the A-4 it always looks a tad ungainly to me on the ground. 

As far as the decision on the scheme goes...the more I think about a Roundel Blue over white Station Hack would look really nice.  The scheme is seen here on a Hunter: 

https://www.fightercontrol.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=134280

Turns out Roundel Blue is damned hard to find...all I can see available is Xtracolor enamel from Hannants.  I've done some research on equivalents and there don't seem to be any suggestions other than "eyeball and hand mix it".  And then I looked at the rarely touched bottle of Testors "Gloss Blue" from a generic acrylic set I bought over a year ago when I first got back into building...it seems a damn close match...


Offline Brian da Basher

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2019, 09:11:05 PM »
My go-to for this is Model Masters Insignia Blue acrylic. It usually works but the problem I have is that the blue used on decals is rarely consistent and seems to run the gamut from Prussian Blue to Midnight Blue. Ugh.  :-\

Always enjoy seeing an A-4. You're right, AD, there's just something about this design that hits all the high points!

Brian da Basher

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2019, 01:34:16 AM »
Might be interesting to model the prototype:



Alongside a fully developed, late version such as a A-4M crossed with a A-4S or A-4K Kahu.

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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2019, 03:38:42 AM »
A-4M crossed with an A-4K Kahu comes pretty close to what the A-4AR is (same radar).  Modeling the engine mods for the A-4SU to add to this mix would be difficult as not even the Hasegawa 1/48 A-4SU has this right ('tis more of A-4 variant they were modified from).  To model this change accurately, you would need to add the underside paneling for the AMAD gearbox and the grill for the Air Turbine Starter outflow as well as one new scoop on the side of the fuselage; good drawings of the A-4Su should show these features.

Offline Brian da Basher

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2019, 06:46:57 AM »
Might be interesting to model the prototype:



Alongside a fully developed, late version such as a A-4M crossed with a A-4S or A-4K Kahu.

Now that's one tasty A-4! Hmmm I've got one somewhere in the pile that needs a "mission" too...

Brian da Basher

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #7 on: March 11, 2019, 11:10:23 AM »
Well, either the prototype as pictured above or A-4M plus A-4K plus the Israeli A-4 tailpipe extension. >:D

Offline Aeroplanedriver

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2019, 12:55:34 PM »
Copied from another forum, credited from Flying Review, March 1966....would be an interesting build.  Too much cutting and PSR for me right now though. 


IMPROVEMENTS WITH THE SPEY

The Spey A-4 is based on the proposed CA-4E airframe [A-4F] which was a single-seat development of the TA-4E, incorporating many of the latter's improvements plus new features of its own. Like the TA-4E, the CA-4E has a 9,300 lb st (4,220 kgp) Pratt & Whitney J52-P-8A turbojet, lift dumpers, steerable nose-wheel, zero-zero ejection seat and modernized electronics. In addition, the wing and fuselage store positions have been strengthened, to permit maximum loads of 4,600 lb (2,086 kg) on the fuselage, 2,600 lb (1,180 kg) on each inner wing position and 1,000 lb (454 kg) loads on the outer pylons. The maximum weight is increased by 2,920 lb (1,325 kg) to 27,420 lb (12,440 kg), and low pressure tyres are introduced for operations from unprepared fields.

All these features are offered in the Spey A-4, but use of the Rolls-Royce turbofan offers 41 per cent more thrust and 17-24 per cent lower cruising sfc compared with the J52-P-6A in the standard Navy A-4E, with consequent performance improvement. The Spey version in the Skyhawk is the RB.168-20, rated at 12,000 lb st (5,443 kgp) and specified also for the HS 801 (maritime Comet); it is essentially an unreheated version of the RB. 168-25R specified for the F-4K Phantom II and is a military version of the RB.163-25 in the later Tridents and One-Elevens. The Spey weighs some 470 lb (213 kg) more than the J52 and has a frame diameter 3.5 in (8.9 cm) greater. To accommodate this larger engine, the fuselage of the Skyhawk is deepened by 5 in (12.7 cm) aft of the self-sealing fuel tank behind the cockpit, and is lengthened by a 10 in (25.4 cm) section just aft of the cockpit. The engine air intakes are enlarged to match the greater air mass flow requirement, the minimum cross-section of the inlet duct being increased from 3.3 sq ft to 5 sq ft (0.31 to 0.46m2). The changes to the fuselage involve a small increase in fin area by increasing the chord and the overall height of the fin. Approximately one-third of the bare airframe (less engine) by weight is modified for the Spey installation. Materials and construction methods are unchanged, but the changes in the fuselage shape require some re-arrangement of the equipment in the centre and rear fuselage and some re-routing of control cables. Other items needing modification in the Spey installation include the cockpit environment control system (for compatibility with the higher pressures and temperatures of bleed air from the Spey); the pneumatic system which pressurizes the fuel system; and the hydraulic system (because of larger-displacement, lower-speed pumps used on the Spey).

The Spey A-4 has an empty weight of 10,739 lb (4,871 kg), compared with 9,853 lb (4,470 kg) for the standard A-4E. As already noted, there is a 2,920 lb (1,325 kg) difference in maximum weights and the maximum ordnance load is increased to 12,000 lb (5,443 kg). Key points of the Spey A-4's performance are its ability to take-off in 3,840 ft (1,170 m) at max weight: its 2,750 naut mile (5,095 km) ferry range without refuelling and its Mach 0.92 max speed (590 knots-1,093 km/h) at 35,000 ft (10,670 m). Douglas estimates that there is currently a market for about 2,000 low-cost ground attack aircraft, to replace F-84s, F-86s and other obsolescent aircraft. The competition for this market is growing, not only from other US manufacturers (primarily Northrop with the F-5A and Ling-Temco-Vought with the A-7A) but also from the European industry, primarily with the BAC/Breguet Jaguar (see Vol 21 No 6 p 371). At $764,000 (£272,000) complete with all-weather navigation equipment, the Spey A-4 is among the lowest priced of the available types, and is offered in quantity in less than two years from go-ahead.

Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2019, 04:43:51 PM »
CA-4E almost sounds like something the RAN may have been looking at through the CAC.


Back in my Tracker-Whacker days, I got used to seeing the RAN A-4G's, which didn't have the hump (despite being upgrades of the humped A-4F), so I kinda prefer the humpless look.

As you say, AD, the slimline look of the humpless A-4's is close to the epitome of jet elegance. However, the humped A-4's do have a more aggressive look.


Decisions! Decisions! Glad I'm not you, mate! ;)
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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2019, 02:20:50 AM »
Copied from another forum, credited from Flying Review, March 1966....would be an interesting build.  Too much cutting and PSR for me right now though. 


IMPROVEMENTS WITH THE SPEY

The Spey A-4 is based on the proposed CA-4E airframe [A-4F] which was a single-seat development of the TA-4E, incorporating many of the latter's improvements plus new features of its own. Like the TA-4E, the CA-4E has a 9,300 lb st (4,220 kgp) Pratt & Whitney J52-P-8A turbojet, lift dumpers, steerable nose-wheel, zero-zero ejection seat and modernized electronics. In addition, the wing and fuselage store positions have been strengthened, to permit maximum loads of 4,600 lb (2,086 kg) on the fuselage, 2,600 lb (1,180 kg) on each inner wing position and 1,000 lb (454 kg) loads on the outer pylons. The maximum weight is increased by 2,920 lb (1,325 kg) to 27,420 lb (12,440 kg), and low pressure tyres are introduced for operations from unprepared fields.

All these features are offered in the Spey A-4, but use of the Rolls-Royce turbofan offers 41 per cent more thrust and 17-24 per cent lower cruising sfc compared with the J52-P-6A in the standard Navy A-4E, with consequent performance improvement. The Spey version in the Skyhawk is the RB.168-20, rated at 12,000 lb st (5,443 kgp) and specified also for the HS 801 (maritime Comet); it is essentially an unreheated version of the RB. 168-25R specified for the F-4K Phantom II and is a military version of the RB.163-25 in the later Tridents and One-Elevens. The Spey weighs some 470 lb (213 kg) more than the J52 and has a frame diameter 3.5 in (8.9 cm) greater. To accommodate this larger engine, the fuselage of the Skyhawk is deepened by 5 in (12.7 cm) aft of the self-sealing fuel tank behind the cockpit, and is lengthened by a 10 in (25.4 cm) section just aft of the cockpit. The engine air intakes are enlarged to match the greater air mass flow requirement, the minimum cross-section of the inlet duct being increased from 3.3 sq ft to 5 sq ft (0.31 to 0.46m2). The changes to the fuselage involve a small increase in fin area by increasing the chord and the overall height of the fin. Approximately one-third of the bare airframe (less engine) by weight is modified for the Spey installation. Materials and construction methods are unchanged, but the changes in the fuselage shape require some re-arrangement of the equipment in the centre and rear fuselage and some re-routing of control cables. Other items needing modification in the Spey installation include the cockpit environment control system (for compatibility with the higher pressures and temperatures of bleed air from the Spey); the pneumatic system which pressurizes the fuel system; and the hydraulic system (because of larger-displacement, lower-speed pumps used on the Spey).

The Spey A-4 has an empty weight of 10,739 lb (4,871 kg), compared with 9,853 lb (4,470 kg) for the standard A-4E. As already noted, there is a 2,920 lb (1,325 kg) difference in maximum weights and the maximum ordnance load is increased to 12,000 lb (5,443 kg). Key points of the Spey A-4's performance are its ability to take-off in 3,840 ft (1,170 m) at max weight: its 2,750 naut mile (5,095 km) ferry range without refuelling and its Mach 0.92 max speed (590 knots-1,093 km/h) at 35,000 ft (10,670 m). Douglas estimates that there is currently a market for about 2,000 low-cost ground attack aircraft, to replace F-84s, F-86s and other obsolescent aircraft. The competition for this market is growing, not only from other US manufacturers (primarily Northrop with the F-5A and Ling-Temco-Vought with the A-7A) but also from the European industry, primarily with the BAC/Breguet Jaguar (see Vol 21 No 6 p 371). At $764,000 (£272,000) complete with all-weather navigation equipment, the Spey A-4 is among the lowest priced of the available types, and is offered in quantity in less than two years from go-ahead.

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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2019, 11:38:07 AM »
Copied from another forum, credited from Flying Review, March 1966....would be an interesting build.  Too much cutting and PSR for me right now though. 


IMPROVEMENTS WITH THE SPEY

The Spey A-4 is based on the proposed CA-4E airframe [A-4F] which was a single-seat development of the TA-4E, incorporating many of the latter's improvements plus new features of its own. Like the TA-4E, the CA-4E has a 9,300 lb st (4,220 kgp) Pratt & Whitney J52-P-8A turbojet, lift dumpers, steerable nose-wheel, zero-zero ejection seat and modernized electronics. In addition, the wing and fuselage store positions have been strengthened, to permit maximum loads of 4,600 lb (2,086 kg) on the fuselage, 2,600 lb (1,180 kg) on each inner wing position and 1,000 lb (454 kg) loads on the outer pylons. The maximum weight is increased by 2,920 lb (1,325 kg) to 27,420 lb (12,440 kg), and low pressure tyres are introduced for operations from unprepared fields.

All these features are offered in the Spey A-4, but use of the Rolls-Royce turbofan offers 41 per cent more thrust and 17-24 per cent lower cruising sfc compared with the J52-P-6A in the standard Navy A-4E, with consequent performance improvement. The Spey version in the Skyhawk is the RB.168-20, rated at 12,000 lb st (5,443 kgp) and specified also for the HS 801 (maritime Comet); it is essentially an unreheated version of the RB. 168-25R specified for the F-4K Phantom II and is a military version of the RB.163-25 in the later Tridents and One-Elevens. The Spey weighs some 470 lb (213 kg) more than the J52 and has a frame diameter 3.5 in (8.9 cm) greater. To accommodate this larger engine, the fuselage of the Skyhawk is deepened by 5 in (12.7 cm) aft of the self-sealing fuel tank behind the cockpit, and is lengthened by a 10 in (25.4 cm) section just aft of the cockpit. The engine air intakes are enlarged to match the greater air mass flow requirement, the minimum cross-section of the inlet duct being increased from 3.3 sq ft to 5 sq ft (0.31 to 0.46m2). The changes to the fuselage involve a small increase in fin area by increasing the chord and the overall height of the fin. Approximately one-third of the bare airframe (less engine) by weight is modified for the Spey installation. Materials and construction methods are unchanged, but the changes in the fuselage shape require some re-arrangement of the equipment in the centre and rear fuselage and some re-routing of control cables. Other items needing modification in the Spey installation include the cockpit environment control system (for compatibility with the higher pressures and temperatures of bleed air from the Spey); the pneumatic system which pressurizes the fuel system; and the hydraulic system (because of larger-displacement, lower-speed pumps used on the Spey).

The Spey A-4 has an empty weight of 10,739 lb (4,871 kg), compared with 9,853 lb (4,470 kg) for the standard A-4E. As already noted, there is a 2,920 lb (1,325 kg) difference in maximum weights and the maximum ordnance load is increased to 12,000 lb (5,443 kg). Key points of the Spey A-4's performance are its ability to take-off in 3,840 ft (1,170 m) at max weight: its 2,750 naut mile (5,095 km) ferry range without refuelling and its Mach 0.92 max speed (590 knots-1,093 km/h) at 35,000 ft (10,670 m). Douglas estimates that there is currently a market for about 2,000 low-cost ground attack aircraft, to replace F-84s, F-86s and other obsolescent aircraft. The competition for this market is growing, not only from other US manufacturers (primarily Northrop with the F-5A and Ling-Temco-Vought with the A-7A) but also from the European industry, primarily with the BAC/Breguet Jaguar (see Vol 21 No 6 p 371). At $764,000 (£272,000) complete with all-weather navigation equipment, the Spey A-4 is among the lowest priced of the available types, and is offered in quantity in less than two years from go-ahead.
I have the Spey-Skyhawk brochure if you want to get down and dirty with the details.  There are mold line changes in addition to the larger intakes; the larger engine diameter also needs to be dealt with.

Offline Aeroplanedriver

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2019, 12:51:44 AM »
That's an offer I may take you up on for a later Skyhawk build!  I'd love to do a Speyhawk someday. 

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2019, 01:50:53 AM »
That's an offer I may take you up on for a later Skyhawk build!  I'd love to do a Speyhawk someday.

Ditto - would love a scan of it Evan.
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Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: Hasegawa 1/48 A-4M...something....
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2019, 02:06:42 AM »
It would be interesting to see if as one-piece windscreen would be possible on the A-4M, something akin to the windscreen on the F-18 or the modifications made to a select few late production F-4E Phantom II aircraft assigned to the Missouri ANG at Saint Louis airport. 
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