Author Topic: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration  (Read 43704 times)

Offline Daryl J.

  • Assures us he rarely uses model glue in dentistry
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #50 on: January 20, 2014, 02:39:16 AM »
Two thumbs up.
kwyxdxLg5T

Offline Weaver

  • Skyhawk stealer and violator of Panthers, with designs on a Cougar and a Tiger too
  • Chaos Engineer & Evangelistic Agnostic
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #51 on: January 20, 2014, 11:14:44 AM »
That looks excellent - nice one!  :)
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline gogs007

  • Newly Joined - Welcome me!
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #52 on: June 13, 2014, 06:04:37 AM »
Guys I am looking to make a 2014 skyraider, I am looking to arm it with lgb, brimstone and or jdam. What I am stuck on are the cannon, do I stick with 20mm or change it. Can I have some suggestions .

Offline kitnut617

  • Measures the actual aircraft before modelling it...we have the photographic evidence.
  • Holding Pattern
  • *
  • I'd rather be dirtbike riding...
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #53 on: June 13, 2014, 06:53:51 AM »
Just say they're 25mm or 30mm.  Mind you, you could replace them with a 20mm M61 Vulcan in each wing ---   8)

Offline Old Wombat

  • "We'll see when I've finished whether I'm showing off or simply embarrassing myself."
  • "Define 'interesting'?"
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #54 on: June 13, 2014, 08:52:43 AM »
Guys I am looking to make a 2014 skyraider, I am looking to arm it with lgb, brimstone and or jdam. What I am stuck on are the cannon, do I stick with 20mm or change it. Can I have some suggestions .

What about using the Rheinmetall (ex-Mauser) BK-27, 27mm cannon?
"This is the Captain. We have a little problem with our engine sequence, so we may experience some slight turbulence and, ah, explode."

Offline Weaver

  • Skyhawk stealer and violator of Panthers, with designs on a Cougar and a Tiger too
  • Chaos Engineer & Evangelistic Agnostic
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #55 on: June 13, 2014, 10:25:46 AM »
Guys I am looking to make a 2014 skyraider, I am looking to arm it with lgb, brimstone and or jdam. What I am stuck on are the cannon, do I stick with 20mm or change it. Can I have some suggestions .

I'd say leave them. 20x110mm ammo is still available, they're as good as anything else against targets that can't shoot back effectively, and against targets that can (i.e. that have MANPADS) you'll want to stay so far out of range that any kind of cannon will be useless.

If 20x110mm ammo is difficult or undesirable, one possible option might be to replace them with M39 cannons (same as on the F-5) which fire the same 20x102mm round as the Vulcan.
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline jcf

  • Global Moderator
  • Turn that Gila-copter down!
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #56 on: June 13, 2014, 10:35:30 AM »
-Doh, M3 not Mk.12, don't rely on memory always go to the bookshelf.-

The wing-mounted M3 cannon used in the AD-1 are basically the HS 404, any of the later cannon (ADEN, DEFA, BK 27, M-61 etc.) are much too large to fit in the same envelope as the M3. Weight is also an issue, i.e. 45 kilos for a M3, 100 kilos for a BK 27. The M39 is closed in general size, but is still much 'thicker' and would not fit within the wing. I suppose you could bulge the wing above and below and say it has M39s (one per wing), but it wouldn't do much for the aerodynamics.

As Harold sez, stick with the 20mm, but now that I've corrected my goof, swap out the M3 for the Mk.12,
it used the much more powerful M100 series ammo and had a higher rate of fire than the M3. Externally
you'd see no difference.
 :icon_fsm:
« Last Edit: June 13, 2014, 11:48:00 AM by jcf »
“Conspiracy theory’s got to be simple.
Sense doesn’t come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated shit
actually is than they ever are about
whatever’s supposed to be behind the
conspiracy.”
-The Peripheral, William Gibson 2014

Offline Rickshaw

  • "Of course, I could be talking out of my hat"
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #57 on: June 13, 2014, 11:30:37 AM »
BK27 ammo is also expensive and ASIUI no longer in production.  Trying to put a Vulcan in the wing, that far out would cause all sorts of problems with inertia, loads, etc.  I agree with Weaver, the existing cannot are quite good enough.   If you want more firepower, hang a cannon pod on it.

Offline Weaver

  • Skyhawk stealer and violator of Panthers, with designs on a Cougar and a Tiger too
  • Chaos Engineer & Evangelistic Agnostic
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #58 on: June 13, 2014, 12:02:29 PM »
I thought Rheinmetall were selling 27mm naval guns? In that case, the the ammo must still be in production, unless they've changed the spec so much that it's no longer compatible with the aircraft guns....?
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Online Jeffry Fontaine

  • Unaffiliated Independent Subversive...and the last person to go for a trip on a Mexicana dH Comet 4
  • Global Moderator
  • His stash is able to be seen from space...
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #59 on: June 13, 2014, 12:03:43 PM »
reduce the number of guns to two and make them 25mm or 30mm Bushmasters :)
"Every day we hear about new studies 'revealing' what should have been obvious to sentient beings for generations; 'Research shows wolverines don't like to be teased" -- Jonah Goldberg

Offline jcf

  • Global Moderator
  • Turn that Gila-copter down!
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #60 on: June 13, 2014, 12:52:38 PM »
Jeff, originally the AD only had two guns, mounted in the inner wing, the outer panel
guns were added during the AD-4 production run. Fatigue problems led to structural
mods that came in with the AD-6.

The problem is still available space, you'd be hard pressed to fit the 25mm Bushmaster,
let alone the 30mm, and the increased weight and force would lead to more structural
problems. The hot 100 series 20X110 used by the Mk.12 would be more than ample.

The M230 is the only one of the common chain-guns that could possibly be made to fit,
m/v and rate of fire are both much lower than the Mk.12.
“Conspiracy theory’s got to be simple.
Sense doesn’t come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated shit
actually is than they ever are about
whatever’s supposed to be behind the
conspiracy.”
-The Peripheral, William Gibson 2014

Offline Rickshaw

  • "Of course, I could be talking out of my hat"
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #61 on: June 13, 2014, 01:29:06 PM »
I thought Rheinmetall were selling 27mm naval guns? In that case, the the ammo must still be in production, unless they've changed the spec so much that it's no longer compatible with the aircraft guns....?

I think the air guns fire different rounds to the naval weapons.  The lack of manufacture may refer to UK manufacture - this was during the time when the RAF Typhoons weren't/were going to have guns fitted/used/ignored/used as ballast/etc.

Online Jeffry Fontaine

  • Unaffiliated Independent Subversive...and the last person to go for a trip on a Mexicana dH Comet 4
  • Global Moderator
  • His stash is able to be seen from space...
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #62 on: June 13, 2014, 01:35:45 PM »
Jeff, originally the AD only had two guns, mounted in the inner wing, the outer panel guns were added during the AD-4 production run. Fatigue problems led to structural mods that came in with the AD-6.

The problem is still available space, you'd be hard pressed to fit the 25mm Bushmaster, let alone the 30mm, and the increased weight and force would lead to more structural problems. The hot 100 series 20X110 used by the Mk.12 would be more than ample.  The M230 is the only one of the common chain-guns that could possibly be made to fit, m/v and rate of fire are both much lower than the Mk.12.
I recall the changes from two to four guns, never paid much attention to the hows and whys behind it all.  Amping it up to a pair of 30mm M230s would certainly create more destruction per shot fired which might make up for the lower muzzle velocities for attacking ground or surface targets.  I suppose you could get around the lack of internal space in the wings and emulate the Spitfire by adding bumps over the guns receiver sections.  That might actually look pretty nice if done right.  :)
"Every day we hear about new studies 'revealing' what should have been obvious to sentient beings for generations; 'Research shows wolverines don't like to be teased" -- Jonah Goldberg

Offline GTX_Admin

  • Evil Administrator bent on taking over the Universe!
  • Administrator - Yep, I'm the one to blame for this place.
  • Whiffing Demi-God!
    • Beyond the Sprues
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #63 on: December 07, 2015, 03:04:28 AM »
I am sure most of you have heard/read about the Skyraider mission that dropped a toilet:



But did you know that there was an earlier one that dropped the Kitchen Sink?

All hail the God of Frustration!!!

You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it.

Offline GTX_Admin

  • Evil Administrator bent on taking over the Universe!
  • Administrator - Yep, I'm the one to blame for this place.
  • Whiffing Demi-God!
    • Beyond the Sprues
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #64 on: December 15, 2015, 03:16:11 AM »
Years ago I drew this:






Now look what turns up:




I'm seeing somewhat of a similarity with the first picture
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it.

Offline kitnut617

  • Measures the actual aircraft before modelling it...we have the photographic evidence.
  • Holding Pattern
  • *
  • I'd rather be dirtbike riding...
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #65 on: December 15, 2015, 09:29:36 AM »
Interesting find Greg,  but then they ended up doing this

Online Jeffry Fontaine

  • Unaffiliated Independent Subversive...and the last person to go for a trip on a Mexicana dH Comet 4
  • Global Moderator
  • His stash is able to be seen from space...
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #66 on: February 14, 2016, 05:39:50 AM »
After seeing another VX-4 F-14 in all gloss black with the Bunny on the tail I had this brilliant idea for a VX-1 VX-4 Skyraider in all gloss black with a bunny on the tail. 

So why not!? 

It would be perfect for a what if and an excellent wind up tool on the display tables :)





*VX-4, not VX-1 :P
« Last Edit: February 15, 2016, 04:05:26 AM by Jeffry Fontaine »
"Every day we hear about new studies 'revealing' what should have been obvious to sentient beings for generations; 'Research shows wolverines don't like to be teased" -- Jonah Goldberg

Offline The Big Gimper

  • Any model will look better in RCAF, SEAC or FAA markings
  • Global Moderator
  • Cut. Cut. Cut. Measure. Cut. Cut. Crap. Toss.
    • Photobucket Modeling Album
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #67 on: February 14, 2016, 07:35:49 PM »
Yes. No reason not to build it Jeff.   ;) 

The current VX-4 was established in 1952 so the all black Black Bunny scheme could have come into existence much sooner.  What not go big with a P-3?  ;)
Work in progress ::

I am giving up listing them. They all end up on the shelf of procrastination anyways.

User and abuser of Bothans...

Offline KiwiZac

  • The Modeller Formerly Known As K5054NZ
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #68 on: February 17, 2016, 03:38:17 AM »
Executive aircraft like the prewar A-17A based Model DT-202 proposal.
Use an AD-5/A-1E as the basis. Think Spartan Executive on steroids.
 ;D



Yeah, I think I have to do something with this. Gorgeous!
Zac in NZ
#avgeek, modelbuilder, photographer, writer. Callsign: "HANDBAG"
https://linktr.ee/zacyates

Offline The Big Gimper

  • Any model will look better in RCAF, SEAC or FAA markings
  • Global Moderator
  • Cut. Cut. Cut. Measure. Cut. Cut. Crap. Toss.
    • Photobucket Modeling Album
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #69 on: February 17, 2016, 03:59:12 AM »
Cool. The wings look like they are from a SBD Dauntless.
Work in progress ::

I am giving up listing them. They all end up on the shelf of procrastination anyways.

User and abuser of Bothans...

Offline elmayerle

  • Its about time there was an Avatar shown here...
  • Über Engineer...at least that is what he tells us.
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #70 on: February 17, 2016, 06:45:22 AM »
Cool. The wings look like they are from a SBD Dauntless.
Considering that the SBD evolved out of the A-17, that's hardly surprising.

Offline jcf

  • Global Moderator
  • Turn that Gila-copter down!
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #71 on: February 18, 2016, 02:17:13 AM »
Cool. The wings look like they are from a SBD Dauntless.

Considering that the SBD evolved out of the A-17, that's hardly surprising.


Yep, and the basic wing design goes all the way back to the Northrop Gamma.

“Conspiracy theory’s got to be simple.
Sense doesn’t come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated shit
actually is than they ever are about
whatever’s supposed to be behind the
conspiracy.”
-The Peripheral, William Gibson 2014

Offline M.A.D

  • Also likes a bit of arse...
  • Wrote a great story about a Christmas Air Battle
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #72 on: February 19, 2016, 05:21:19 PM »
What if Heineman designed fighters derived from Skyraider?




So it would have been more akin to a competitor to the Boeing XF8B (Model 400)?

M.A.D

Offline GTX_Admin

  • Evil Administrator bent on taking over the Universe!
  • Administrator - Yep, I'm the one to blame for this place.
  • Whiffing Demi-God!
    • Beyond the Sprues
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #73 on: December 07, 2016, 02:25:37 AM »
What about a RAF Skyraider in classic grey/green scheme ala below:



Maybe have it that not long after retiring the Hawker Typhoons in 1945, the RAF decides it does need a heavy ground attack platform after all and thus make a purchase of Skyraiders...
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it.

Offline GTX_Admin

  • Evil Administrator bent on taking over the Universe!
  • Administrator - Yep, I'm the one to blame for this place.
  • Whiffing Demi-God!
    • Beyond the Sprues
Re: Douglas A-1 Skyraider Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #74 on: October 26, 2017, 02:30:21 AM »
Was there ever a 2 seat Skyraider with two crew in tandem?

I know there were the side-by-side seating (both 2 and 4 seat).
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it.