M41 Walker ''Bulldog'' Light Tank

[Old Wombat]

I'm thinking late-60's to late-70's, operational.

Probably more forward areas, artillery protection detail / forward fire-base defence in an irregular-infiltration / regular force enemy environment similar to Viet Nam.

[Rickshaw]

M113 variant the, I'd suggest.  Either M113 itself or an M577 command vehicle.  Here's one example on M548:



Not sure what the radar is but it looks like an air search one.

Alternatively, there is the Hawk SAM PARS radar:



Put something similar on top of an M577.

Alternatively you could do something similar with the Contraves Flycatcher radar (which is a proper AA set and right for the period) and put it on the back of M548:

[Weaver]

M113 variant the, I'd suggest.  Either M113 itself or an M577 command vehicle.  Here's one example on M548:



Not sure what the radar is but it looks like an air search one.

Think that's a variation on the Contraves Skyguard. It looks like the standard shelter just stuck on the back of the M548.

[Weaver]

A bit of armour might be nice, given the number of HARM's floating around during/just before bombing missions, though.

How about a M41 undergoing a major rebuild (like the Israelis do) with an armoured box superstructure, a smaller (more) modern engine fitted off to one side, layout reversed (so that it is, essentially, going backwards), with the driver seated (at least partially) beside the engine?

You could even do something similar for the SPAAG, with a double hatch at the (new) rear to make reloading easier.

Isn't that basically an M75? : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M75_(APC)

Would make a good radar carrier: loads of room.

[Old Wombat]

1^st time I've heard of the M75 but, yes, it does fit the bill nicely! :)

[Kerick]

I was thinking of rebuilt M-41s as scout vehicles or a vehicle to run with the APCs to give them more protection from other AFVs that are less than a MBT.

[Rickshaw]

Think that's a variation on the Contraves Skyguard. It looks like the standard shelter just stuck on the back of the M548.

I knew it looked familiar but I couldn't place it.

[Rickshaw]

Isn't that basically an M75? : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M75_(APC)

Would make a good radar carrier: loads of room.

Yes but not terribly successful as an APC and already out of service in most armies by the late 1950s. Belgium stuck with them longer than most though. Also rather thirsty and short-ranged.

[Weaver]

Isn't that basically an M75? : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M75_(APC)

Would make a good radar carrier: loads of room.

Yes but not terribly successful as an APC and already out of service in most armies by the late 1950s. Belgium stuck with them longer than most though. Also rather thirsty and short-ranged.

All true and Belgium only stuck with them because they got them for free. However, if you're looking for radar/ammo vehicles on the same platform as your M-41 SPAAGs, then you're going to end up with something awfully like the M75 whatever you do.

[Rickshaw]

Good point but rather an expensive way of going about it and little outside the parameters set down by Guy as to period.   I'm unaware of any models of the M75 from a mainstream manufacturer in 1/35, which I think is really what Guy is looking for.

[Old Wombat]

Nah, I was just running through a thought experiment triggered by Weaver's M41 20mm SPAAG idea!

[Cliffy B]

I know these are for M60 tanks but some of the mods should prove inspirational for the M41 too.

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,7417.0.html

[dy031101]

The attached picture speaks of a proposed M41 variant, made after the T49 development, armed with the same rifled 90mm gun as early M48 medium tank.

(Well, I wished I could find a picture of better resolution or even the source article but couldn't......)

[Rickshaw]

The attached picture speaks of a proposed M41 variant, made after the T49 development, armed with the same rifled 90mm gun as early M48 medium tank.

(Well, I wished I could find a picture of better resolution or even the source article but couldn't......)

Looks like it comes from Hunnicutt's book on the Sheridan.  Which, if you want an explicit history of US post-war light tank development is THE one to get (as are all Hunnicutt's books).

[dy031101]

The artist's impression seems to include a thicker mantlet but not the raised roof à la T49.  Does it seem like I should be expecting reduced vertical gun arc compared to the original 76mm?

[Kerick]

My only thought about installing a 90mm gun is the room left inside the turret. The breech has to be larger and the ammunition would take up much more space.

[dy031101]

My only thought about installing a 90mm gun is the room left inside the turret. The breech has to be larger and the ammunition would take up much more space.

It reminds me of what I've been wondering about the Sherman M51's turret volume...... granted, I don't know enough to make the comparison.

[Rickshaw]

The M51 turret was extensively modified.  In the end, the only thing left of the original Sherman turret was the sides.  Both fore and aft was cut away and new structures welded on.  They had to do that because when they pushed the trunnions forward, to fit first the 90mm and then the 105mm gun, they had to create a counter-balancing mass at the rear (and provide more room for the crew) to balance the load on the turret ring.

[dy031101]

If I scaled this correctly:



I tried to align the trunnions of both vehicles as well, hoping for ease of comparison...... how far does each gun recoil again?

[Rickshaw]

I think you'll find that the M48 drawing is somewhat squashed both horizontally and vertically.  You need to make sure they are both to the same scale before you do a comparison.

As to how far the guns recoil, I have no idea.  However, remember they must be able to recoil at maximum depression, otherwise the breech will be smashing into the roof at full recoil!

[ysi_maniac]

[Volkodav]

 :)

[dy031101]

So it appears that the 152mm gun/missile launcher system would work on the M41 and as much as I dislike the shape of the M41 turret, I absolutely hate the shape of the M551 turret.

This question didn't immediately come to me, but does the M41's turret have more internal space than the M551 turret or less?

[Kerick]

The Bradley turret on the tank hull looks familiar. Does anyone know just how "deep" the Bradley sits into the vehicle hull? Would a tank have a deep enough space?

[Volkodav]

Researching for my Antipodean Armour Fest I found this:

http://www.military-today.com/tanks/mb3_tamoyo.htm

I had completely forgotten about the Tamoyo and only remembered it when the Osorio popped up in my cold war tank searches.

I liked the look of the Tamoyo but had no idea it owed so much to the M-41, having the same basic chassis but stretched to fit an extra road wheel.  Once I was aware of the connection I could actually see the likeness to the M-41.

It would probably be a big job to build a Tamoyo from an M-41 but it does give some additional whiffing ideas.