Author Topic: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C  (Read 6145 times)

Offline The Big Gimper

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Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« on: February 14, 2012, 01:48:39 AM »
Following the Gonzo thread, I thought it would be cool if 414 SQN Falcon 20s we replaced with an all-black HS 125 (there is no coincidence that I have one in my stash).  ;)

So I was thinking the mods could include:
  • a new nose
  • IFR probe
  • Blanked out windows
  • Lots of lumps and bumps
  • two hard points per wing
  • ECM pods. ALQ-87,  -101 or -131 come to mind
  • Drop tanks
Comments?

And if you happen to have a nose you could donate to said project, I`m all ears.  ;D

Carl
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Offline Maverick

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2012, 06:32:43 AM »
I did my Matchbox 125 as an MPA aircraft back in the day.  Always liked the type myself.

Regards,

John
Regards,

John

Offline The Big Gimper

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2012, 06:53:19 AM »
Moi aussi. I have an Airfix Dominie which will be a RCN CP-125B. 
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Offline kitnut617

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2012, 10:47:26 PM »
I've got the CT-142 Gonzo conversion in the stash, if I can work up the courage to try dropping it in rubber and make some castings I'd let you have one.  But don't hold your breathe    ;) ---------

Offline The Big Gimper

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2012, 10:58:42 PM »
Is this the Leading Edge kit? Yes please. The plain Jane Dash-8 are far numerous.
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Offline kitnut617

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2012, 01:56:49 AM »
Yes it's the Leading Edge 'Conversion', it's not a kit.  All you get is the new nose and a decal sheet so you need the Hobbycraft kit to use it on.  Or in your case -- not

Offline The Big Gimper

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2012, 02:01:35 AM »
Okay. The CT-142s are very rare.

There is a LE kit on Ebay right now but it is not cheap.  $21.00 and climbing. Keep me in the loop on your experiment. If it works, I would buy another Dash-8 and update it.

Carl
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Offline Silver Fox

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #7 on: February 16, 2012, 07:08:07 AM »
CE-125 Dominie ECM mods, based on the EC-117 conversion... as witnessed by a Black Knight member who knew 'Sir Cedric' (the Knight's name) personally.

Common to early or late fit:
Delete APU, you need the aft weight allowance to fit a chaff dispenser.
Fit chaff dispenser. :)
Large scale Sqdn marking, the tiny unit marking used by 412 in the transport role don't cut it.

Early Era (alongside CF-100 Clunks/CT-133 T-Birds):
One extra VHF antenna, one extra UHF antenna. These support the EW Officer's communication set as well as comm jamming.
One 'T' antenna upper, one lower. These support the fore-aft radar jamming. The T's are airframe colour except for the tips (silver) and the emitter window (clear).
Red/Black rudder stripes.
Paint should be the gloss white used in the Transport role, but worn (except Sqdn markings). The A/C are treated as tactical assets, not transport. Marks left on panels by dirty gloves are not uncommon.
One pax window (starboard/aft) partially obstructed by EW console. Cabin windows are not polished as they are in Transport Sqdns.

Late Era (alongside EF-101 Electric Jet/CT-133 or CE-133 T-Birds)
As for Early Era, except:
More advanced chaff dispenser fitted, smaller exterior chute.
Delete lower T antenna.
Fit lower EW system panier (canoe).
Paint could be as per Early Era, but Gloss Black was actively pursued. If white, wear patterns more advanced than Early Era. If black, paint should be well maintained and most dirt smudges cleaned off. Markings should be the red-pattern markings as per EF-101 101067.
One forward window at front of cabin, portside, blocked by crewseat of EWO. Two starboard windows, forward and opposite of crewseat, blocked by enlarged EW panel.
Main landing gear doors should be open if A/C is parked. Preflight/Postflight Inspections require wheelwell entrance, the Falcon was modified with a ground access switch in the nosegear bay. There's no reason to believe the same wouldn't have happened to the Dominie, but safer... Dominie doesn't snap the nosegear doors when you flick the switch!

Interesting tidbit, if the Dominie is supported by 412 Sqdn in heavy maintenance, then there is a good chance that a Dominie right out of maintenance would wear 412 Sqdn markings in place of 414. This was a regular occurence on EF-101 '067 (In that case it was 416 markings). Pristine, clean and polished would be the order of the day in that case.

Diorama suggestions:
Groundcrew fitting pods. 'Tactical Start', on deployment it wasn't uncommon for a single groundcrew member to act as the startcrew (instead of the normal 2 person). In that case leave the airstairs open and run a comm line from inside the cabin to the single startcrew member. Post start the crewman will throw the nosewheel chock aside and the board the A/C.

Loadout: Chaff tanks (early era only) or ALQ pods.
Plumbing the hardpoints is a waste, EW Dominie isn't going to need the range.
I wouldn't fit an AAR probe, overspray will damage the upper T forward emitter window.
Puking F-15 'Ego' driver on the ramp beside the plane. It wasn't uncommon to see big, tough fighter pilots get motion sickness when deprived of visual cues during a flight inside the cabin. Almost guaranteed if some sadist of a Tech-Crewman and the EWO have a sortie-long conversation about how bad an idea it was to qualf down draft beer and chili in the Club the previous night. Air quality was 'sometimes' an issue, when it got real bad some joker of a pilot would turn on the 'No Smoking' light.

Of course, that's the realistic conversion. In the WHIF-World pretty much anything is acceptable. :)

Offline apophenia

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2012, 06:24:26 AM »
... Of course, that's the realistic conversion. In the WHIF-World pretty much anything is acceptable. :)

Seems nigh on impossible! I had a look at the MasterDetails website but there's no sign of a "Puking F-15 'Ego' driver on the ramp beside the plane" figure. What is wrong with these accessory producers?!
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Offline kitnut617

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2012, 06:33:00 AM »
A few Air-Britain magazine issues back, there was an article all about the Dominies which gave all the histories of the RAF aircraft.  Lots of pics too, and the T.1's had an extended fairing below the fuselage and forward of the wing which housed two or three different radars and such.  There's also a couple of pics of two Dominies fitted with Sea Harrier FA.2 radomes.

Offline The Big Gimper

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #10 on: February 20, 2012, 05:26:27 AM »
CE-125 Dominie ECM mods, based on the EC-117 conversion... as witnessed by a Black Knight member who knew 'Sir Cedric' (the Knight's name) personally.

Common to early or late fit:
Delete APU, you need the aft weight allowance to fit a chaff dispenser.
Fit chaff dispenser. :)
Large scale Sqdn marking, the tiny unit marking used by 412 in the transport role don't cut it.

Early Era (alongside CF-100 Clunks/CT-133 T-Birds):
One extra VHF antenna, one extra UHF antenna. These support the EW Officer's communication set as well as comm jamming.
One 'T' antenna upper, one lower. These support the fore-aft radar jamming. The T's are airframe colour except for the tips (silver) and the emitter window (clear).
Red/Black rudder stripes.
Paint should be the gloss white used in the Transport role, but worn (except Sqdn markings). The A/C are treated as tactical assets, not transport. Marks left on panels by dirty gloves are not uncommon.
One pax window (starboard/aft) partially obstructed by EW console. Cabin windows are not polished as they are in Transport Sqdns.

Late Era (alongside EF-101 Electric Jet/CT-133 or CE-133 T-Birds)
As for Early Era, except:
More advanced chaff dispenser fitted, smaller exterior chute.
Delete lower T antenna.
Fit lower EW system panier (canoe).

Of course, that's the realistic conversion. In the WHIF-World pretty much anything is acceptable. :)

I like the canoe idea. Any pointers as to where I can source such a beast. And Mountain Equipment Co-OP is not a supplier.  ;D 
Work in progress ::

I am giving up listing them. They all end up on the shelf of procrastination anyways.

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Offline Silver Fox

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #11 on: February 20, 2012, 08:23:57 AM »
The 'canoe' is a simple shape, it can be seen under the fuselage in the pic on airliners.net of CC-117 '507. You should be able to fashion one with a little bit of spare sprue and some grinding. Not clear is the can at the bottom of the canoe. I've blown up and enhanced the area in question to clarify.

'507 is seen fitted with the later EW fit and the ground safety switch for the gear doors already installed. Brings back memories... this was a great airshow!

http://www.airliners.net/photo/0253686/L/

Offline kitnut617

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Re: Hawker Siddeley HS 125 as a (R)CAF CE-125A ECM A/C
« Reply #12 on: February 20, 2012, 11:51:23 PM »
And Mountain Equipment Co-OP is not a supplier.  ;D

 :D ;)

I like the canoe idea. Any pointers as to where I can source such a beast.

It looks like you could fashion one of those from a Harrier gun pod