Republic P-47 (and derivatives) Ideas and Inspiration

[elmayerle]

Kora Models does a 1/72 P-47G-15 "Double-Bolt" conversion.

[TurboCoupeTurbo]

For a COIN P-47, would it be wise to delete the turbo-supercharger setup to free up weight for additional ordinance/fuel? 

Or would that remove the power to lift said additional ordinance/fuel?

[elmayerle]

For a COIN P-47, would it be wise to delete the turbo-supercharger setup to free up weight for additional ordinance/fuel? 

Or would that remove the power to lift said additional ordinance/fuel?

I'd leave the turbo-supercharager setup in because A) the cost in time and engineering to remove it would be excessive and B) it would help "hot and high" COIN operations.

[TurboCoupeTurbo]

Sold!

My original thoughts were to leave the turbo-supercharger, but I wanted a double check from some folks in the know.

Its in primer right now, expect pics probably next week. 

[jcf]

No, you would want to ditch the turbo-supercharger as, unlike automotive systems, it's use was to retain sea level
power output as the altitude increased rather than a straightforward increase of horsepower like a car. It would be of little
use in a COIN situation as at low levels pretty much all the R-2800 engines had approximately the same power rating
(2000/2100 hp at 2700/2800 rpm at 1500 ft) turbo and non-turbo. The turbo-supercharger on the P-47 (like all
turbo-supercharged USAAC/USAAF aircraft) functioned as a second aka auxiliary stage, so dumping it and changing
the size/speed of the engine mounted first stage to match the operating profile would be the likely change.

P-38s used for air-racing post-WWII dumped the turbo-supercharger system, and even during the war mechanical
two-stage multi-speed supercharged aircraft locked out a stage/speed or used a cropped impeller when used for
dedicated low-level work.

http://www.enginehistory.org/P&W/R-2800/DoubleWaspIndex.pdf

[elmayerle]

It depends on where you're doing COIN work.  As I said "hot and high" environments would require it.

[The Big Gimper]

Found on Facebook. Canadian/Alaskan/Russian/Scandinavian  use cases:

[Logan Hartke]

I wonder if there's a frozen lake on earth that could take the weight of a Thunderbolt on it.

Cheers,

Logan

[perttime]

Found on Facebook. Canadian/Alaskan/Russian/Scandinavian  use cases:

Skis...
In real world, at least Finland gave up on the idea of using skis on fighters, during WWII. Too much loss of performance, too much trouble to make them retractable.

I wonder if there's a frozen lake on earth that could take the weight of a Thunderbolt on it.

Cheers,

Logan

I don't think the weight would be a problem. Strong ice can be really strong.

[Logan Hartke]

I wonder if there's a frozen lake on earth that could take the weight of a Thunderbolt on it.

I don't think the weight would be a problem. Strong ice can be really strong.

Oh, I'm well aware, but I don't pass up an opportunity to make light of Republic's overweight (and underappreciated) fighter.

Cheers,

Logan

[Kerick]

A diorama opportunity. A P-47 on skis with one ski broken through a thin spot in the ice!

[Old Wombat]

Oh, Gawd! Where does my brain get these from?


I just had an image of a P-47 sitting next to a hole in the ice, through which a whale has emerged & is smooching up to the P-47.

[Kerick]

Now build it!!!

[Old Wombat]

Do I look like a masochist?

[Daryl J.]

No turbo-supercharger.
Fabric covered wings.
Fabric covered aft fuselage.
3 blade prop.
British desert markings.

[GTX_Admin]

[GTX_Admin]

Turbocharger system of a P-47:

[Old Wombat]

Almost bigger than some fighters on its little lonesome!

[kitnut617]

Thanks for posting that Greg, I needed to see what it really looked like because I'm thinking of a MB5 with a Centaurus where I could keep the radiator duct. A variant of the Centaurus that was planned for the Vickers Type 'C' bomber which would have had a supercharger and turbocharger.

[upnorth]

I'm forming (possibly fermenting) an idea for a civil aircraft based on the P-47, or possibly a civilian variation that branched off the ancestral design at the same time as the P-47.

While it's still all in my head, though I will do some drawings at some point, the idea is too build it without the turbocharger and the associated "gut" that goes with it. The goal is to have an aircraft where the wings and belly are smooth with each other and more dynamic lift can be generated with the undersurface.

Keeping the width of the P-47, I'm envisioning a 4 to 5 place cabin and some stowage space

I'm also thinking that once the turbocharger, guns and other military specific gear is gone, that the R-2800 engine might be a bit of overkill for the lightened aircraft.

At that, I'd like to pick a few brains here:

I was thinking that an R-1820 Cyclone might be a good fit when I look at some of the single engine types it was applied to.

Any other ideas?

[finsrin]

Gee,,, good concept and question.  Yes, lot of weight loss without 8x50cal ammo feeds, armor, etc.....
Still like R-2800 for speedy transport and takeoff power.  And don't have to change engine mounting, cowling, fuels lines, electric lines, and the rest.

[GTX_Admin]

What about something similar to the T-28R-2 Nomair II?  This was a commercial derivative of the T-28 Trojan trainer and was able to carry a pilot at front and two pairs of seats for four passengers. The canopy was fixed and there was a door on the port side of the cabin. The first production model flew in February 1962 and a total of ten were built.



The P-47 is about the same size as the T-28 (if anything, the P-47 is slightly larger) so if you were to take the turbocharger and associated ductwork out you might have quite a bit of useable space.

Another option might also be to try to bash the cockpit/cabin of the AD-5 (4 seat version) into the P-47:

[upnorth]

Interesting suggestions and I'll definitely consider them.

My initial visualisations for the finished aircraft were something along the lines of a Spartan 7W:



I have a spare AZ Models 1/72 Let L-200 Morava that I'm going to see if I can make the cabin area fit to a Revell P-47 I've also got sitting around:



The Morava cabin would give me a nice mid to late 50s 5 place arrangement and the Morava kit also has some nice other bits, like wing tip tanks, that I could use.

[M.A.D]

Turbocharger system of a P-47:

Cool Greg, thanks!
It gives a real appreciation of the P-47's turbocharger, it's size/bulk and contributor to the overall P-47's dimensions.

M.A.D

[M.A.D]

Very effective chart!

Thanks Greg

M.A.D