Anti-Aircraft: SPAAG/SAM Ideas and Inspiration

[Rickshaw]

Generally, most SPAAG's are reloaded from trucks.  While they have prestigious rates of fire from their guns, they tend to fire in short bursts.  Few if any of them would be able to fire their sustained rate of fire without melting the barrels.   A few have reloading "cassettes" which allow their ammunition supply to be reloaded in one, quick hit.   However, that generally requires rear access and large hatches.   As most SPAAG are conversions from other vehicles, they often have to be reloaded through small ammunition hatches on the turret/hull top.

Most SAMs have specialised reloading vehicles - usually truck mounted, equipped with cranes to handle the large, heavy usually awkwardly shaped missiles.   The Soviets were very good with that, having specialised vehicles in first, second and third line which were designed to speedily allow the reloading on the launchers and their supply vehicles.

[GTX_Admin]

Some photos of a Tunguska loading ammo:

[dy031101]

First two: examples of the expedient mounts on trucks and APCs.

Second two: Nile 23, perhaps a representation of what it would look like to give the expedient mounts a shelter (and maybe some powered traverse and elevation, for guns that don't have those).

[Gingie]

sustained attack, they would very quickly run out of ammunition wouldn't they. 

Sustained attacks don't really happen, its pretty much a pop-up, roll, and attack run. Typical burst from the twin 35's was 1.5 seconds. Combat bursts, 2.5 seconds, were for incoming ARM's.

ADATS troops of 4 carried 32 missiles ready to fire, and could be resupplied from the 10 ton HLVW or even other ADATS that didn't fire (it would be unlikely to have 2 ADATS covering the same arcs apart from some overlap) 

The Canadian Army is standing up the Air Defence project. I heard they were going around asking for old AD Gunners, as we haven't run a course in many years since giving up that combat function.

[kitnut617]

Except in Iraq, I read the attack went on for a couple of hours ----   

[Gingie]

OK, guess I was wrong.

[dy031101]

First three: SWS-2, an export SPAAG from the PRC, with one 35mm gun and four TY-90 missiles.  Although what caught my eyes isn't the turret weapons but the AFV-like chassis- in this case, in two different styles- rather than the logistics truck style that systems like this are often displayed with.

Bottom: FK-1000, an export SAM system from the PRC, with 12 Chinese counterparts to the 9M311 missiles and two 23mm cannons. A poor man's Pantsir-S.

[M.A.D]

Some photos of a Tunguska loading ammo:

I can't help but be impressed by the Russian/Soviet emphasis on simplicity and efficiency when it comes to maintenance and replenishment in the field!   

M.A.D

[dy031101]

Apart from those and possibly some truck mounted temporary installations, I am not aware of any dedicated applications.

I would prefer all-weather accommodations, but going one-lower, I was reminded of the style of the Flakpanzer 38(t)...... I'm inclined to wonder if the AMX-13 chassis would have enough room to accommodate the KAA gun(s) installed in that manner...... or even a T-54......

[dy031101]

The original successor to the Chaparral- the Chaparral Chassis Service Life Extension Program.

Sharing chassis with the LAV-25, six hardpoints, at least two of which can carry rocket pods or Hellfire missiles instead of the Chaparral missiles.

[Marderman]

Hello,
no idea, no inspiration, real scratch-build:

M 1047: I saw only 2 photos from this real vehicle in the jap."tank-magazine" and thought, I must build it. The model is a conversion with the M 730-Chaparral(AFV-Club)turret on the LAV (Italeri). I build it in 1995.




M 1108: Only 2 photos from this real vehicle in the Japanese "Tank" magazine and thought, I must build it. The model is a conversion on a longer made M 730-Chaparral (AFV-Club) and the cabin from the MLRS. I build it in 1996.





M727: I built this vehicle in 1994 using the M548 from AFV Club. The rocket launcher is the old Revell model which I built in 1983. I adapt it on my scratch-built conversion. I´ve built it after I saw only two photos in the Squadron magazine. But today a real kit from Dragon.





M 975 Roland: The US version of the Roland was only a prototype, I believe. I built the model 1994 with an old M 109 and the Resin turret of HP model and scratched parts.






Didi

[Jeffry Fontaine]

@ Mardemrman - Great work on all of your air defense vehicles!  Also quite an accomplishment to build some of those based on just two images and get the results you have achieved. 

[GTX_Admin]

Inspired work there

[Gingie]

Good read on Bradley Linebacker. I just picked up a Meng M3A3 and plan to do a Whif of a current Linebacker assuming it had gone through 20+ years of upgrades.

https://forums.eugensystems.com/viewtopic.php?t=47122

[dy031101]

This M167 can relocate under its own power.

I still think the Israeli TCM-20 mod. to be better-looking, but performance-wise can two old Oerlikons beat a single Vulcan?

[dy031101]

Random thought:  M167 Vulcan Air Defense System (VADS) (see below) used in purely ground role (i.e. used against enemy ground forces not aircraft)......

Speaking of which, the Japanese JM167A2 "VADS-1Kai" is the only modification that I know of with equipment conducive to ground combat (even though the "VADS-1Kai" is still intended as an AA gun) in the form of an electro-optical sensor addon to the fire control.

Then throw in the Mk149 APDS for added firepower against light armoured vehicles.  I don't know how much of the Vulcan cannon used on Phalanx 1B is different from the stock M61A1 outside the barrels, but if the gun swap is straightforward enough, you can use the more-potent Mk244 ELC......

[GTX_Admin]

Hmmm..diorama idea:  trench with M167 embedded in a horizontal firing position with normal troops on either side.

[dy031101]

South Korea also came up with an upgrade to their VADS in the form of a thermal camera, the display for which appears to be added directly behind the existing gun sight.

I used to be under the impression that the E/O sensor on the JM167A2 is trainable instead of just elevating with the gun, but, come to think about it, I don't know for sure.

[Rickshaw]

A new Chinese 10x10 SPAAG vehicle, apparently armed with a 75mm autocannon.

[The Big Gimper]

Looks like a new toy from Mega Bloks!

[GTX_Admin]

Interesting vehicle.  Mind you, what is the camouflage supposed to be merging with?

[Rickshaw]

The Chinese have become rather digital cam crazed over the last few years.  I understand the vehicle is in service with the PLAAF, which explains the use of the blues...

[GTX_Admin]

I understand the vehicle is in service with the PLAAF, which explains the use of the blues...

Just like the RAAF's uniforms (below - glad I got out before this), I have to wonder what they are thinking - camouflage against the sky perhaps?   Seriously?  maybe only of use as the vehicle (or person) tumbles out of the sky...

[Rickshaw]

Could be worse, Greg.  You could have been in the RAN and had a grey cammed uniform with day-glo stripes on the arms and legs... 

[tankmodeler]

Or the similar US Navy camo uniform, because, dayum, when I've been tossed into the sea because my ship sank, I want to be hard to find.

Beyond comprehension stupid.