German Equipment in Post WW2 and Cold War Service.

[Jeffry Fontaine]

German Equipment in Post WW2 and Cold War Service.*

Something I learned this evening while surfing the internet for something else.  Turns out the Norwegian Army used a small number of Panzer III tanks post war until replaced by more modern armor.  A few of the tanks then had the turrets removed and placed on Tobruk style bunkers. 

Article at this link: Norwegian Panzers by Thorleif Olsson

The one black and white image that is included with the article does not give you much to work with with but it is interesting nonetheless.  The only other use of WW2 German armor that I know of is the French operating a few Panthers until they were eventually replaced. 




*Topic title changed from German Panzers in Post WW2 and Cold War Service to German Equipment in Post WW2 and Cold War Service.

**Edit to adjust format of OP.

[Rickshaw]

Spain operated a large number of Panzer IV Ausf H, into the 1950s, these were then sold to Syria, which operated them against Israel.  The Syrians also received a number of Panzer IVs from Bulgaria.

The Yugoslavs operated various WWII German weapons up till the 1970s.   Primarily artillery pieces though.

The Norwegians IIRC operated Panzer III Ausf N and Ms.

The French operated some Panthers (numbers have never been made clear) up till the early 1950s.   None despite Internet Myth ever served in Indochina.

The British had several Panthers and Tigers actually manufactured just after the war by the factories which produced them during WWII, which were in their Occupation Zone.  However, these were purely for trials and more than likely only constituted a handful.  Some can be seen in the movie, "Theirs is the Glory".

[Jeffry Fontaine]

Forgot about the Syrian use. 

[Logan Hartke]

Romania operated 13 Panthers until 1950. Bulgaria, likewise, used considerable numbers of PzKpfw IIIs, IV, and StuGs postwar. The Czechs, obviously, used Jagdpanzer 38(t) and other variants postwar, and the Swiss and Swedes obviously built their own vehicles on that chassis postwar, too.

Cheers,

Logan

[raafif]

Spain had a few Stug-IIIs too (modified one with a (big) rocket launcher).
Syria had Stug-III, Jagdpanzer-IV Lang, a Hummel & a few modified French Lorrains.
Egypt used a few panzers including one Bison-II which was repaired from the 1943 battles in Nth Africa.

Czechs used BergePanthers into the 1950s.

Experts like Steve Z acknowledge that one French Panther was trialed in Indochina but was a failure (too heavy) so M-10s were sent. France also used SdKfz-251 & KM-8 half-tracks there.

The JagdPanther in Bovington is one of the postwar 1945-manufactured ones.

Denmark also used captured panzers for a few years - primarily to tow rollers made of concrete to explode mines left by Germany.

Sweden got a running Porsche KingTiger for trials but quickly broke it & then cut it up.

[Rickshaw]

I just remembered one big user was Finland.  They had large numbers of Panzer IVs and Stug IIIs which lasted into the 1950s until replaced by Soviet vehicles.

[Rickshaw]

The JagdPanther in Bovington is one of the postwar 1945-manufactured ones.

Interesting.  I wasn't aware of that.

I know the British manufactured Panthers and surprisingly, Tiger Is and IIs.   The Panthers and Tiger Is appear in the movie "Theirs is the Glory", which I cannot recommend enough, if you're interested in period depictions of a WWII battle, in this case Arnhem.   Indeed, it was made so close after the war the bridge hadn't been rebuilt (they use clever matte techniques to make it appear intact) and there are still a couple of wrecked Tiger IIs in the town, they "fight" around.   Made only 2 years after the battle, many of the survivors and local inhabitants took part in the filming.

[raafif]

if "Theirs is the Glory" is the movie I'm thinking of, many of the "actors" were in fact the actual guys who fought in the battle !!  Believe quite a few were held back from de-mob to do it.

[Frank3k]

Full movie:

Theirs Is The Glory - 1946 (HD)

[Logan Hartke]

Sweden got a running Porsche KingTiger for trials but quickly broke it & then cut it up.

True, but not entirely fair. I can't imagine it was too hard to "break" a King Tiger. Funny enough, the Swedes bought four Shermans to evaluate at the same time and before it was cut up, the King Tiger claimed one last Sherman, probably the last in its career. After the King Tiger broke down, the Swedes tried to tow it with an M4A4. As we all well know, until the advent of the NASA Crawler, mankind had not really built a vehicle that could reliably tow a King Tiger, and this was no exception. The effort ruined the M4A4's engine and it was sent to the firing range and eventually scrapped, just like its King Tiger nemesis.

Cheers,

Logan

[raafif]

yes, I reckon there was probably a manufacturing fault with that KT as the rear right bogie-axle broke while the tank was turning.  I think it was simply too big for Sweden's needs anyway so wouldn't have gone into service with them.

The venerable German RSO was copied by Russia & went into civil use as a tractor with a small tilt-tray.  Equipped with a bucket on the front, it was sold for farming & logging until the 1970's as the TDT-40 & TDT-55m.

Britain copied the German KM-8 half-track to be used for arty-tractors, converting all nuts & bolts to imperial sizes & building a small number by Bedford with tests carried out in UK & Germany but better wheeled trucks proved the way to go.

[perttime]

Not directly related... but in places and times where stationary coastal artillery was feasible, tank turrets were used for that purpose.

T-55 turrets used as coastal guns:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_56_TK

[GTX_Admin]

The Czechs, obviously, used Jagdpanzer 38(t) and other variants postwar

Slight nitpick:  the Panzerkampfwagen 38(t), upon which the Jagdpanzer 38(t) was based, was originally a Czech tank so in a way, it was simply returning to Czech use...

[Logan Hartke]

Hence the "obviously". The Jagdpanzer 38(t) and many other wartime variants didn't serve with the Czech army until postwar, though. That's why I'd certainly consider them to be German AFVs. They were part of "Greater Germany" at the time they were developed and constructed.

In fact, to nitpick your nitpick, the TNHPS (LT vz. 38) didn't actually enter service before the Germans annexed Bohemia and Moravia in March 1939. So, outside of the TNHPS prototype evaluated by the prewar Czechoslovak Army, the LT vz. 38s and 40s operated by the army of the Slovak Republic puppet state, and the vehicles operated during the Slovak and Czech uprisings in 1944-45, the postwar Czech use of the 38(t) variants was the first official use of the LT vz. 38 family by the Czechoslovak Army.

Cheers,

Logan

[dogsbody]

Though not about re-used Panzers, I do remember watching the news during one of the various Balkan Troubles back in the 90's and seeing a T-34/85 rumbling down a street. Not sure which of the various little factions was using it, but there it was.



Chris

[arkon]

Came across this the other day, figured here was a good place to post it.http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-paul-allen-panzer-20140912-story.html

[GTX_Admin]

Romania operated 13 Panthers until 1950.

Photo showing some:

[Kerick]

I wonder how they got the parts to keep those things running.

[Logan Hartke]

Romania operated 13 Panthers until 1950.

Photo showing some:

Also note the Hummel in the background--not often mentioned.

Cheers,

Logan

[GTX_Admin]

Good catch!

[GTX_Admin]

It may be a stretch of the theme but nevertheless it is still German Equipment in Post WW2 and Cold War Service...

[GTX_Admin]

Romania operated 13 Panthers until 1950.

Photo showing some:

Also note the Hummel in the background--not often mentioned.

Cheers,

Logan

I was reading some more re this.  Apparently Romania received one Hummel from the Red Army after the war ended. This was assigned to the 2nd Armoured Regiment with the registration number U069009. It was officially known as the Hummel TAs self-propelled gun in the army inventory. The gun couldn't be used because it was missing the lock.

[Rickshaw]

It is also interesting that the Romanians are operating at least two distinct marks of Panther.

[Jeffry Fontaine]

Instead of starting another topic in the forum devoted to marine and naval subjects (sea child board) I am including it in this discussion. 

The German Schnell Boot (S-Boot)/E-Boat have a bit of history in use post-war with several nations including PRC, Norway, Denmark, the UK, and West Germany. 

Odd that France is not on that list of post-war users but it is not too far off the path of reality to imagine that Frank3K's S-Boot in French service operating in IndoChina post war could have happened.   

[GTX_Admin]

It is also interesting that the Romanians are operating at least two distinct marks of Panther.

Romania received 13 Panther tanks from the USSR.  The tanks were different models: Ausf A, Ausf D and Ausf G.

[GTX_Admin]

Odd that France is not on that list of post-war users but it is not too far off the path of reality to imagine that Frank3K's S-Boot in French service operating in IndoChina post war could have happened.   

Hmmm…I like your thinking.

[Rickshaw]

Jagdpanzer IV in Syrian service ~1967: