Author Topic: Hawker Havoc  (Read 279 times)

Offline Kerick

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Hawker Havoc
« on: August 06, 2022, 08:24:21 AM »
From ysi-maniacís cyber drawing of a straight wing Hunter I have commenced to build something similar. A salvaged Matchbox Hunter fuselage, some wings from an F-86 donated by Ron from IPMS Duneland, an old 1/32nd scale F-16 centerline drop tank, (where would we be without drop tanks!) a Jaguars tail and junk box parts should be able to do it. Further inspiration was found in the Boeing Skyfox aircraft proposed back in the 80ís. Iíve mentioned this in a couple other threads but I figured it was time to start a real thread.
My stumbling block right now is what should the two engines look like? Is there 5000+lb thrust dry British engines from the 80ís or earlier that would work mounted A-10 style? Iíve been looking around and havenít found anything that would look right except for some 1/100th scale A-10 engines.
The concept here is Hunter airframes with previously undiscovered wing cracks are recalled from everybody that ever bought them and rebuilt with straight wings to reinforce the Harriers in their ground attack missions. This is from a build up of events leading to the war in 1984. See the novel ww3 1984.
So if anyone has suggestions about engines Iíd love to hear them while I sand putty for awhile.

 First is the starting pile of junk.



Not all of this will be used, just different options.
Here's some parts glued up after paint stripping with Easy Off oven cleaner in the yellow can.



I've added the old F-16 fuel tank cut close to the original Hunter fuselage length. Also the tapered end of a gas bag for a Harrier style laser nose.
This is an overall shot of the future configuration.





I don't know if I should square off the F-86 wings or leave then the way they are. They will receive winglets pretty soon. I replaced the first Jaguar tail with a different one that had the ECM gear already on. The engines are from the old box scale Hustler from God knows when. Very brittle plastic. I cut off much of the front and rear of each pod and glued extra plastic on to have something to shape into an inlet and exhaust. I'll have to do something with the canopy as a very small portion of the rear edge was short shot. Probably fill it and paint something over it. With the laser nose I'll add some GBU laser guided bombs and/or a couple of Mavericks. Landing gear is going to be a problem. The original main gear wouldn't work with the F-86 wings and I don't have the wheel well covers anyway. The nose Gear I can work around as the gear doors are pretty simple but for the main gear I'm thinking something that retracts forward like the A-10. I'll have to see what else I have in the junk box.

Here's a couple of pics of the Skyfox so you can see some of my inspiration.





https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_Skyfox

Offline raafif

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2022, 11:56:19 AM »
 :smiley:  T-tail please.

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2022, 12:31:30 PM »
That will probably happen! Glued the wings on and tail strakes.

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2022, 03:19:12 PM »
Spent most of the evening making wing pylons and landing gear. The nose gear will be as standard Hunter as I can make it while the main gear will not be. The F-86 wing is nearly solid and would not line up with the Hunter gear wells anyway so Iím trying to make it something A-10 style with the legs retracting forwards into wells made from an old pair of missiles. Iíll see how this goes and if it will be acceptable. At least it will fit between the pylons and allow more whizz bang stuff under the wings. I donít recall ever seeing a Hunter with a center line pylon. Much too close to the ground Iím sure. Maybe Sidewinder rails offset left and right of center like some Starfighters.

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2022, 01:52:42 PM »
A little more progress on the Havoc. I've epoxie puttied over the old intakes. Some JB Weld stuff that's been laying around too long. It hardened up ok after 24 hours. Really too old to use any more. Anyway, I tried to follow the Skyfox example and make space that in a real aircraft could be used for fuel or other gizmos.



I also added eight pylons under the wings. The outer ones will hold Sidewinders.



The slipper tank looking add ons will be the A-10 style wheel wells. I painted on some acrylic white for a primer over the epoxie putty just to seal it a little. I'm working on a new speed brake, either similar to the original one or "flipper" style like an F-16 on the notch behind the green wing roots. Still not quite happy with the engines. I wish I could find some biz jet stuff without ordering a kit for $30. I'll think of something.

Offline finsrin

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2022, 07:32:14 AM »
Nice - look forward to more pics  :smiley:

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2022, 05:19:55 AM »
I tried an experiment last night. I havenít been happy with my attempt at engines for this project. A friend from my model club donated several small scale airliner engines to the cause. Unfortunately he only had singles instead of pairs. I disassembled one that looked the closest to what I was thinking of and cleaned it up by sanding all the paint off. The exhaust cone I was able to duplicate by cutting off a (guess what!) drop tank. The halves of the engine I coated in WD40 and covered with JB Weld epoxy to make a pair of molds. Fortunately the WD40 worked as a mold release agent and everything came apart as planned. Now I just have to wait for a sunny day to fill them with UV resin. Too cloudy today no UV to speak of so maybe tomorrow.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 01:02:12 PM by Kerick »

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #7 on: Yesterday at 01:00:31 PM »
Here's the pics I promised. I filled in the areas around the new main gear wells and tacked together the engine and horizontal stabilizers in a semi T tail arraignment. Some adjustment may be required.







Here's a low horizontal stabilizer arraignment. I'm leaning to the T tail at the moment.







Here's how the air brakes will look. I'll add the spreader and piston tomorrow.



These are the UV resin cast engine parts I copied from the plastic engine. Lots of clean up required. The WD40 worked for releasing the plastic parts from the JB Weld molds but not as well on releasing the UV casting from the molds. I'll have to remember to use a heavier oil next time.



Once I get them cleaned up by course sanding I can glue them together with CA glue. A little PSR on the outside to clean them up too. I might have to pin them to the fuselage for extra strength.

Offline finsrin

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #8 on: Yesterday at 04:27:17 PM »
Quite a project.  Like conversion of old intakes into classy wing strakes.  Everything looking right !

Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #9 on: Yesterday at 10:30:07 PM »
T-tail definitely looks the way to go! :smiley:

I'd be interested to see an engineer's report on the effects of those air-brakes on the air-flow into the engine intakes. ;)
"This is the Captain. We have a little problem with our engine sequence, so we may experience some slight turbulence and, ah, explode."

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #10 on: Today at 12:05:55 AM »
The lip of the intake is ahead of the air brakes so should work ok. If this was RW a problem would be airflow into the engine at high angle of attack. But thankfully this is whiff world so no worries.
« Last Edit: Today at 02:30:21 AM by Kerick »

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #11 on: Today at 01:29:07 AM »
Looking good
All hail the God of Frustration!!!

You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it.

Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #12 on: Today at 10:15:00 AM »
The lip of the intake is ahead of the air brakes so should work ok. If this was RW a problem would be airflow into the engine at high angle of attack. But thankfully this is whiff world so no worries.

This is just me being an incomplete uni physics student, so don't concern yourself too much with it, but the JPN (Joyless Physics Numpty) in me tells me that you're going to get a high pressure zone between the engine & the wing forward of the air-brake which will, quite quickly become a funnel channelling pressurised air directly over the wing into the engine intake; therefore, the top plate of the air-brake will become less effective whilst the engine will begin providing more thrust, leading to a rather sudden pitch-down of the nose (unless the pilot throttles back on opening the air-brakes & pulls back on the stick to keep the nose up - which will then lead to your high angle of attack issues).

You will notice that the A-10's air-brakes are in the outer wings (split ailerons / decelerons).




I still think it's a great build, by the way, it's just this annoying, nagging little part of my brain that won't shut up. :smiley: :smiley:
« Last Edit: Today at 10:17:47 AM by Old Wombat »
"This is the Captain. We have a little problem with our engine sequence, so we may experience some slight turbulence and, ah, explode."

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #13 on: Today at 11:16:12 AM »
You are probably right but I had to put some air brakes somewhere but itís whiff world so no sweat. I appreciate the input. I could just put speed brakes that fold downward in the current position and under the fuselage. HmmmmmÖÖ

Offline finsrin

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #14 on: Today at 11:25:25 AM »
BTW -- Liking them speed brakes.

Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #15 on: Today at 11:26:44 AM »
Don't sweat it, mate! As I said, it's just the JPN in me being annoying. ;) :smiley:
"This is the Captain. We have a little problem with our engine sequence, so we may experience some slight turbulence and, ah, explode."

Offline Kerick

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Re: Hawker Havoc
« Reply #16 on: Today at 11:50:32 AM »
I might put some under the fuselage anyway. Or there is the four petal system around the butt end of the fuselage like the F-105. As I recall it worked well and had no effect on the control of the aircraft. Something to think about. A little like the Buccaneer but with four petals. Or maybe three?