Beyond The Sprues
Modelling => Completed GBs => Group and Themed Builds => Floaty/Ship/Naval GB => Topic started by: LemonJello on February 02, 2015, 10:15:35 PM
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I promised myself that I'd take part in at least a couple of the Group Builds this year, so I'll cast off from the pier with this project:
I'm starting with a Revell 1/72 Elco PT Boat as the base kit. It is going to be scale-o-rama'd into a 1/35 brown water/littoral gunboat. I'm looking at two options: 1) the Spec-Ops support vessel with grenade launchers/heavy machine guns, modern comms/navigation and room for a SEAL/MARSOC/SAS team to be carried in/out, or 2)A heavily armed river/littoral shipping interdictor armed with an M242 (LAV-25 turret), armored bridge and Hellfire/Brimstone-type missile armament. I'll have to play with some parts to see what looks as though it works best.
I'll post pics when there's been some progress. All ideas, suggestions and comments are, as always, extremely welcome.
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Scale-o-ramaed to @ 1/35 the ELCO measures out just slightly larger than the Seafox, so the SEAL route would
definitely fit. Evidently some were used as 'unoffocial' patrol boats off Lebanon in the early '80s.
There were Vietnam era proposals for riverine patrol craft of approximately the same dimensions @36'+ ~ 40'+ LOA, @ 9'6"+ ~ 13'+ BEAM, so again the scaled ELCO falls in the range.
One interesting proposal was for a larger 85' river patrol hydrofoil with shallow surface-piercing fixed foils, so foils of that sort
on an ELCO based 40' might look pretty cool.
Do you have Friedman's U.S. Small Combatants? Loads of inspiration in that book.
Jon
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Scroll through the list of boats here. Full of ship's boats, harbor craft, landing craft, and riverine craft. Should get some light bulbs lit :)
http://www.hnsa.org/resources/manuals-documents/single-topic/boats-of-the-united-states-navy/ (http://www.hnsa.org/resources/manuals-documents/single-topic/boats-of-the-united-states-navy/)
There's info and drawings for each. Some on one page, others on 2 or more.
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OK. Some small progress made, so I'll post a few rough photos. Comments and suggestions welcome, as always.
The kit:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0276_zps7bdb5505.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0276_zps7bdb5505.jpg.html)
The deck out of the box, notice the short shot on the forward deck - that's going to need some work!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0277_zpse24e8e29.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0277_zpse24e8e29.jpg.html)
So, I sanded/ground all the details off with the trusty dremel to get to this point. I'm going to clad the entire deck with sheet styrene to give me a uniform base to start with. Here is the armament I'm going with right now, just mocked up to see what works/doesn't work. I had also played around with using the remote weapon station from my Boxer on this.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0278_zpsc733ebc6.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0278_zpsc733ebc6.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0279_zps59507da6.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0279_zps59507da6.jpg.html)
This is going to need a lot of additional supports after all the cutting I've done.
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Just my $0.02 worth. How about raising the turrets up a half inch or so? Might improve the fields of fire.
A Bradley turret would give you TOW missile capability.
This is a very interesting idea, I'll be watching!
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Just my $0.02 worth. How about raising the turrets up a half inch or so? Might improve the fields of fire.
A Bradley turret would give you TOW missile capability.
This is a very interesting idea, I'll be watching!
Thanks, I was pondering raising the turrets, I've got to get the superstructure worked out between them...but I agree, raising them up from the deck will help.
Unfortunately, no Bradley turret (or kit) in the stash here. I was also looking at the LAV-50 Mecar 90mm and the AVGP Cougar turrets as options.
I do have some 1/35 AH-1W TOW tubes in the spares...maybe I can work something with those?
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If the boat is to be still capable of getting up on plane, you won't want to put the turret too far forward.
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Keep building :-*
38.9ft as 1/35
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Armor adding weight would start to be an issue. Its a whiff, so build it as you like it!
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Instead of continuing to sand away details, can't you just flip the deck over and then clad with styrene?
For turrets, if you don't mind scratchbuilding, there are a few free tank and AFV paper models that can be used as templates for a styrene version.
Here's a District 9 AFV with a smallish turret: http://myhobbycraft.blogspot.com/2011/12/mnu-apc-135-district-9.html (http://myhobbycraft.blogspot.com/2011/12/mnu-apc-135-district-9.html)
SA vehicle with a 30mm gun: http://myhobbycraft.blogspot.com/2011/08/mbombe-135.html (http://myhobbycraft.blogspot.com/2011/08/mbombe-135.html)
Bionix tank with a good turret: http://myhobbycraft.blogspot.com/2011/03/bionix-ifv-135.html (http://myhobbycraft.blogspot.com/2011/03/bionix-ifv-135.html)
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Instead of continuing to sand away details, can't you just flip the deck over and then clad with styrene?
For turrets, if you don't mind scratchbuilding, there are a few free tank and AFV paper models that can be used as templates for a styrene version.
The underside...that probably could have worked. File that away under "The More You Know."
Those paper models are amazing! I want a plastic Rooikat, but I may have to download the files for that one and see about converting/scratch building it.
It's not that big of a deal with the donor turrets I'm considering right now - the kits that they come from are all going to be WhIffed with different turrets anyway, so these are surplus.
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As it's a whif, you don't have to go with fully armoured turrets.
Perhaps just the frontal plates fully armoured, with the sides, top & underneath being lighter plate types.
Most turrets are designed that way, anyway, but you could have them more substantially lightened.
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Physically, it doesn't seem like much, but here is the deck, plus the bulkheads for the superstructure.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0280_zps1e454ec1.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0280_zps1e454ec1.jpg.html)
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I'm going to file this under "do one of these myself pretty soon".
IIRC the Finish Navy had some sort of close to shore warships with interesting camo schemes.
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I've already got 2 planned. ;)
Plus a standard Tamiya PBR. :)
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Here's what I was thinking of.
(http://forsvaret.dk/danex-noco2012/nytogpresse/PublishingImages/06_STORM/STORM.jpg)
(http://forsvaret.dk/danex-noco2012/nytogpresse/PublishingImages/06_STORM/FNS-PORI.jpg)
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Two pictures are cool 8)
Please - you guys build those PBR types mentioned.
After swap meet buys am back to progress on Aurora Moscow.
Enjoying floaty build as doer and viewer.
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Latest update from LemonJello Electric Boat Works.
Another mock-up:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0281_zps004e157c.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0281_zps004e157c.jpg.html)
Forward turret:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0282_zpscddad3e5.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0282_zpscddad3e5.jpg.html)
Aft turret:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0283_zps1487b529.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0283_zps1487b529.jpg.html)
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Otay, from yer layout I guess yer going for a heavy STCAN type vessel, slower speed 'punch-it-out' displacement hull type
versus the higher speed ASPB planing hull type.
BTW, the Sikorsky prototype for the ASPB II mounted a 105mm gun turret amidships on a planing hull along
with a whole lot of bar armour.
;)
(http://www.sikorskyarchives.com/images/ASPB.gif)
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Looking good! In pic 1, if the forward most bulkhead were narrower the forward turret would have a wider field of fire. Don't know what the rest of the superstructure will look like so just my $0.02 worth. How about an amidships TOW launcher?
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In pic 1, if the forward most bulkhead were narrower the forward turret would have a wider field of fire. Don't know what the rest of the superstructure will look like so just my $0.02 worth.
Gotta agree with that.
Maybe angle the front bulkhead back at about 15° to 30°, & about the same width as the rear of the front turret angling out to the 2nd bulkhead (can be less if you want your bridge further forward) & I'd reduce the height fo the front bulkhead & angle the roof up to the bridge. That should give you about 270° of traverse, maybe a touch more.
I'd look at angling the sides of the superstructure, too, as all these angled surfaces will give you better ballistic protection &, possibly, reduce the radar signature a little.
Looks like she's going to be a pretty mean beast whichever way you build her, though! :)
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Angling back the sides of the superstructure would up the coolness factor. Angled plates provide better protection with less weight. Saving weight would be good on a boat.
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Thanks for all the the constructive ideas, gents. I played around with raking the front bulkhead back at about a 60 degree angle. I still may go that route, but I want to work through some other issues before I decide one way or another. Also, the sides of the superstructure ARE sloped, I just realized that all of my mock ups don't really show it, though. I took the shape from a spare Stryker ramp/hatch in the spares. I was going to use the actual part as a bulkhead, but instead I used it as a template for the other walls and for ideas on hatches into the interior spaces.
Keep the comments coming.
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I looked back at the pic from Feb 8 and now I see what you mean about the bulkheads. Just one thought, could you use the Stryker hatch maybe on top of the superstructure as am ammo loading hatch or something? Looks too cool to hide inside the boat.
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I looked back at the pic from Feb 8 and now I see what you mean about the bulkheads. Just one thought, could you use the Stryker hatch maybe on top of the superstructure as am ammo loading hatch or something? Looks too cool to hide inside the boat.
Actually, I'm not using it at all now. Since my design needs 2 hatches, I figured it would be better to make them both from the same materials and add my own details. There will be some additional hatches added to the deck for provisioning of the boat and access to the engines.
I am thinking of narrowing the front face of the #1 bulkhead and seeing what that does to the overall shape of the superstructure.
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This build is sooooo interesting to follow :)
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I almost bought a PT-109 yesterday after reading this.
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I am thinking of narrowing the front face of the #1 bulkhead and seeing what that does to the overall shape of the superstructure.
Try it in card 1st, just to see how you like it. Then use the card as a template for the styrene if you decide to go for it. ;)
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I almost bought a PT-109 yesterday after reading this.
Love this scale-o-rama bash to 1/35. I bash kits into 1/72. Find this just as interesting.
FYI in case someone needs bit more room doing similar build: using Lindberg 1/64 PT boat provides almost 5ft more length as 1/35.
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That extra 5 scale feet would be nice - I could probably add another weapon station with that. Oh,well.
Here's a mock up of the changes to the forward structure. I'm liking the look alot more than the original idea.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0284_zps7c6ada06.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0284_zps7c6ada06.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0285_zps756e776b.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0285_zps756e776b.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0287_zps4617b8fd.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0287_zps4617b8fd.jpg.html)
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I like the forward structure, but the front turret is going to block much of the driver's view. Plus that turret's going to be heavy and well forward of the CG. Can you swap the two turrets?
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The CG issue depends on where the engines are placed; if they're towards the stern a bit, they plus the mass of the smaller turret should be enough of a balance.
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That looks great! Just needs a bridge looking over the forward turret.
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In my head, the engines are pretty far aft, probably under the aft turret to the stern, so hopefully that would aid in balancing out the boat. I just really like the look of it with the LAV turret on the front.
I really wanted to add a TOW/Hellfire system, but there just isn't the room on this hull, guess I'll save that for the 1/35 Elco I hope to someday acquire.
That looks great! Just needs a bridge looking over the forward turret.
I have intentions of adding a flying bridge on top of the forward structure for better visibility during normal operation, but the all of the crew would be under armor for the "interesting" parts of the mission profile. I also need to add a mast and an E/O system along with nav radar/radio antennas.
I'm thinking I'll have to build a trailer for this one, for display purposes. But first, I have to complete this.
Please keep the comments coming, I really do appreciate them.
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If you need a RWS (with optics) the AFV M151 kit is great: http://www.perthmilitarymodelling.com/reviews/vehicles/afvclub/afv35157.html (http://www.perthmilitarymodelling.com/reviews/vehicles/afvclub/afv35157.html)
Not only do you get a really nice, easily modified RWS with your choice of a very well done M2 and Mk.19 but you also get a ton of spare Stryker parts, including flat hatches. The spare parts have been really handy in other builds.
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Nice work. Looks like an interesting build
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Not trying to make too much work for you (well, maybe a little ;) ) but small boats are extremely space limited & having two bridges is wasteful.
So, how about armoured shutters around the bridge? ???
That way the bridge is always the bridge but has a better view when people aren't shooting at you. :o
When the shutters are closed you could either use a remote sensor suite or the old fashioned slits in the armour system ... or both.
(Note: Remote sensor suite includes the simple concept of periscopes, or the complex concepts of thermal/IR/visible spectrum cameras & VR displays, depending on how modern you're going.)
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Sure, sure, "it's for my own good." I'm starting to realize how limited this hull is, space-wise. Too many ideas, not enough room for them all...
Here's what I was thinking for my flying bridge - a large, armored hatch on the roof with the basic controls in armored, recessed boxes and a spray shield/windscreen around it. I don't want it to get too tall, but I do need to give the pilot/driver better forward visibility over the turret.
For sensors, I'm thinking of a few armor-type periscopes and an E/O ball, since you'd need a way to see if/when the E/O gets shot up...
I'm thinking it has a crew of 6 - pilot, navigator, engineer/mechanic and the 3 weapons operators.
I had pondered bar/slat armor, but I think that's a bridge too far for this build.
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I know turrets look cool but how about RCWS such as Typhoon and or Mini Typhoon with Javelin or Spike. Maybe a box of Spike ER NLOS as well, RBS 70 or Stinger, even an Avenger turret.
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I know turrets look cool but how about RCWS such as Typhoon and or Mini Typhoon with Javelin or Spike. Maybe a box of Spike ER NLOS as well, RBS 70 or Stinger, even an Avenger turret.
I'm strongly considering picking up another 1/72 Elco and making it all remote weapons, maybe a small VLS cell for NLOS-type missiles and a 4 man crew compartment. The current one is more of a brute, the next will be the sleek, fast one?
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Sure, sure, "it's for my own good." I'm starting to realize how limited this hull is, space-wise. Too many ideas, not enough room for them all...
Welcome to the joyous world of boat/ship design and the problems inherent in 'scaling' a given design. ;D
Halving the external dimensions results in a vessel with only 1/8th the original volume, doubling has the reverse result. ;D
If you are thinking that your engines are right aft, are you considering using V-drives or Z-drives for the propellers?
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If you are thinking that your engines are right aft, are you considering using V-drives or Z-drives for the propellers?
A little google-fu tells me that I will be using z-drives for my build. Learning has occurred. Awesome!
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Similar in size. I built LCO in 1/72. Same kinda build could be done 1/35.
http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=3922.msg61077#msg61077 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=3922.msg61077#msg61077)
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Sure, sure, "it's for my own good." I'm starting to realize how limited this hull is, space-wise. Too many ideas, not enough room for them all...
Ha! Check the measurements for a 1/72nd S-boat converted to a 1/35th PBR - long & very, very skinny! :-\
That's one of the hulls I'm working with. My answer is to widen it ... I think ... somehow ... because I want to fit it with a Vulcan ADS turret (from a M-113) & a quad-50 turret, too.
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Vulcan and quad 50? That's a lot of hurt you'll be bringing. Need another boat just for ammo.
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Sure, sure, "it's for my own good." I'm starting to realize how limited this hull is, space-wise. Too many ideas, not enough room for them all...
Ha! Check the measurements for a 1/72nd S-boat converted to a 1/35th PBR - long & very, very skinny! :-\
That's one of the hulls I'm working with. My answer is to widen it ... I think ... somehow ... because I want to fit it with a Vulcan ADS turret (from a M-113) & a quad-50 turret, too.
Airfix or Revell kit?
My first inclination would be to go to a semi-Sea Sled configuration, or split-hull catamaran.
http://spoonercentral.com/knappseasleds/sled.html (http://spoonercentral.com/knappseasleds/sled.html)
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Airfix &, yep, that was my 2nd idea. :)
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That Sea Sled is a pretty neat configuration. Lots of possibilities there.
Not to derail my own topic, but I was pondering future builds on my morning dog walk - instead of getting another Elco, I'm thinking of acquiring one of the 1/144 scale LCAC kits from Trumpeter and scaling it up to a 1/35 armed hovercraft. This one would have the remote weapon stations and VLS cells. It could be an escort for the big LCACs as they land the heavy equipment or transit still contested waters from ship to shore.
Back to the current project - I hope to get a little bit more done over the weekend and will post photos. I also have begun preliminary planning for the trailer - I think I have all the needed parts in my spares and styrene shape stockpiles.
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Trailer like this?
(http://www.iwaarc.com/minicar/military/images/SWARD/SWARD1500/IMG_3299.jpg)
(http://blog.hemmings.com/wp-content/uploads//2010/03/XM376_01_1000.jpg)
(http://olive-drab.com/images/id_m8_transporter_700_01.jpg)
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRoh7kanlsrWj4VEKIQR6I6_FMXTTv6zGMy4ZQWWHlrh8BPj65Q)
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No, nothing quite that impressive, though I do have a partially constructed Dragon Wagon in the stash and want to add the M1070 HETS at some point. I'm thinking just a bigger version of a standard boat trailer. Then I'd just need an MTVR to tow it. It never ends, does it?
Those photos are awesome. I'd buy a kit of just about any/all of them if they were available in 1) plastic, and 2) 1/35 scale.
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Not to derail my own topic, but I was pondering future builds on my morning dog walk - instead of getting another Elco, I'm thinking of acquiring one of the 1/144 scale LCAC kits from Trumpeter and scaling it up to a 1/35 armed hovercraft. This one would have the remote weapon stations and VLS cells. It could be an escort for the big LCACs as they land the heavy equipment or transit still contested waters from ship to shore.
Nice idea, problem is the 1/144 LCAC is weensy. Here it is with a, long delayed :-X, 1/35 M3A3 with Vulcan project.
(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/BTS/LCAC_1-144_01.png)
(http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/BTS/LCAC_1-144_02.png)
One of the biggest problems is that the skirt, vinyl moulded in the 'inflated' state, is only about half an inch deep
which means only about 17.5 inches deep 'in scale', really too low.
:icon_fsm:
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Wow, thanks for those pics of the 1/144 LCAC. That's a lot smaller than I had it in my head. it would make a neat little hovercraft, but it definitely wouldn't be the size I was thinking. I think you could go with a single M151 (or similar remote station) and a VLS cell of small, short range missiles.
Guess I'll have to see if I can find a steal on eBay for a 1/72 one. Though the 1/144 offering may be a better testbed. Decisions, decisions.
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Wow, thanks for those pics of the 1/144 LCAC. That's a lot smaller than I had it in my head. it would make a neat little hovercraft, but it definitely wouldn't be the size I was thinking. I think you could go with a single M151 (or similar remote station) and a VLS cell of small, short range missiles.
Guess I'll have to see if I can find a steal on eBay for a 1/72 one. Though the 1/144 offering may be a better testbed. Decisions, decisions.
The Trumpeter 1:144th scale LCAC in JMSDF markings (kit number 106) (http://store.spruebrothers.com/product_p/trp00106.htm) is still the cheapest of the two versions available at Sprue Brothers. Just have to make a large enough purchase to benefit on the low price and free shipping. MSRP: $38.00/Sale Price: $21.49.
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IIRC someone made a model of a hovercraft of some sort by making the inflated skirts out of epoxie putty. There is AVES epoxie sculpt or the stuf you can buy at the hardware store.
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<...> ([url]http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/BTS/LCAC_1-144_02.png[/url]) <...>
Oh yeah!
(http://25.media.tumblr.com/aea61d53b441b01d4c24cd658d659151/tumblr_mg2p7xfCBA1rn7bzro1_500.gif)
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A combination of cold temps at LemonJello Electric Boat Division, a 1:1 scale closet renovation and a flu-ridden CinC Home have put a temporary halt to physical work on this project, but I am still working through options and details in my head.
Hope to have some progress photos soon to share.
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<...> ([url]http://i729.photobucket.com/albums/ww291/joncarrfarrelly/BTS/LCAC_1-144_02.png[/url]) <...>
Oh yeah!
([url]http://25.media.tumblr.com/aea61d53b441b01d4c24cd658d659151/tumblr_mg2p7xfCBA1rn7bzro1_500.gif[/url])
Calm down Moritz, it aint' happening, the LCAC hull is simply too small. :icon_fsm:
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Update: progress has been made.
Aft superstructure/turret:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0290_zps7a4df191.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0290_zps7a4df191.jpg.html)
Hatch to forward superstructure:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0291_zps30bea2bf.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0291_zps30bea2bf.jpg.html)
Both structures in place (minus roof on forward area):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0292_zpscb7164f1.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0292_zpscb7164f1.jpg.html)
Where the project stands so far:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0293_zps9ca7eb3e.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0293_zps9ca7eb3e.jpg.html)
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Am on a week road trip. That posting gives me serious model bench withdrawl symptoms. Can compensate by shopping Ebay.
If therez anything that should be changed, I don't see it :)
Waiting for next update.
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Looking great!
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Update: Mast and sensors
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0298_zpsdqf3qxcg.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0298_zpsdqf3qxcg.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0297_zpsarlgl4la.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0297_zpsarlgl4la.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0295_zpspixyv326.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0295_zpspixyv326.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0294_zpsdyaugf0w.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0294_zpsdyaugf0w.jpg.html)
Comments and suggestions welcome.
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Mast and sensors: Right on !
Like to mimic in 1/72 builds.
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It's looking really good. The sensor box looks realistic and I like the AN/COKETOP low profile helical search/nav radar.
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Looks great! Nice bottle cap radar!
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One last photo for tonight:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0299_zps11zrrn00.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0299_zps11zrrn00.jpg.html)
I've mocked up the hatch, ventilator, SATCOM and FBCB2/Blue Force Tracker antenna. I'll be adding several VHF whip antenna as well.
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Nice job on the rails and hatch handles. Did you bend them using a tool or are they from a kit?
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Very, very slick
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Nice job on the rails and hatch handles. Did you bend them using a tool or are they from a kit?
Frank, no special tool, just a pair of needle-nose pliers and some K&H wire I picked up a long time ago.
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I didn't accomplish much of anything tonight, except to second guess adding another weapon system - so I put it to this august assemblage:
Option 1: two individual fixed position box launchers at the stern, each pointed off the center axis and slightly above the horizontal - but not in the line of fire from the aft turret.
Or,
Option 2: a four cell vertical launch box in the bow- my concern here is keeping the 25mm clear of the launchers if the gun is center/forward.
I'm thinking of NLOS-type missiles to give this boat a little more punch in the harbor/shipping interdiction role.
What do you think? Too much?
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Mmmm, well making real world design observations here.
Yes, overkill, as those turrets are already pushing the carrying ability of the hull and the raised mounting position
of the aft one is a metacentric height horror-show waiting to happen in anything besides a still mill pond.
As to a vertical launch system in the bows, I guess you're talking some small missiles as you really don't have much
'real world' space between the keel and deck. On the 80' Elco the deepest point forward, measured from the baseline
which was 6" beneath the keel, was 130", so for your half-size vessel it's 65", from baseline, 59" actual and that's an
outside moulded dimension, by the time you factor in structure and sheer you'd be lucky to get 48" vertical space
at the deepest point ... but that is at the centreline, you quickly lose room as you move out.
Take the dimensions on the following and halve them for your boat.
(http://www.pt103.com/images/PT_Boat_Elco_103_Class_Hull_Profile_Stitched.jpg)
(http://www.pt103.com/images/PT_Boat_Elco_103_Class_Hull_Lines_Plan_3000_Frame_Stations_Corrected.jpg)
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I have to agree. I just don't see the space for what you mentioned. Maybe a pintle mount for an M-240 amidships for close in defence but that's about it. Its looking awesome the way it is.
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Thanks, gents, for the input and reference info. I had to push the good idea fairy off my shoulder so she'd stop whispering in my ear. I'll leave the missiles for a future project (maybe the 1/35 Elco?).
With that decided, I just have to close up a couple of holes in the deck and she'll be ready to go into the paint barn.
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I think you are on a great path here. Lots of small details will make it pop.
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Great project!
Following closely to gather some inspiration ;)
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The weather decks have had non-skid applied prior to final assembly, so it's time to turn our attention to the hull. Should I go with water jet(s) or ducted propellers? I think I can make a decent representation of either, but which would be more appropriate to a fast, heavily armed strike vessel such as this?
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The PBRs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrol_Boat,_River) used water jets and they were only slightly smaller than this boat. The only tricky construction would be the thrust reversers.
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Water jets sound good to me. Should work well close in to shore.
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Well, in between "honey-do's" and daughter's soccer game, I practiced my google-fu and ran across this:
http://www.contrapel.com/page7.html (http://www.contrapel.com/page7.html)
Now, I'm no engineer, nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night, but I do think I could replicate a pair of these in plastic, for the stern of this project. Progress is occurring!
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In service the PBRs turned out to not be as fast as hoped and were maintenance intensive.
There were several programs in the late/post-Vietnam era that tried to come up with a new generation
of patrol/attack craft and propulsion was one of the big problem areas. Waterjets and tunnel drive designs
were part of the research, but at the end of the day it was determined that two to three large outboards
would be the best solution.
Of course, once they had come to this understanding they promptly cancelled all the development programs.
;D
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SNAFU
The contapel looks interesting.
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Outboard jets are an option,
http://outboardjets.com/ (http://outboardjets.com/)
but, as the site points out, water-jets won't pull as well or go as fast
as a properly matched propeller.
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Just a little update:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0302_zps6kyzpft6.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0302_zps6kyzpft6.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0301_zpshijj2hhf.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0301_zpshijj2hhf.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0300_zps7zazhrr9.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0300_zps7zazhrr9.jpg.html)
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That is looking really good. What did you use for the non slip surfacing?
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That is looking really good. What did you use for the non slip surfacing?
It's Rustoleum Multi-color textured paint (spray can). I really like their Terracotta spray paint for non-skid in both 1/35 and 1/48, but I haven't found it lately at Lowes or Home Depot. This is a pretty good substitute, though.
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Sweet !! More and more white plastic !!
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Some master naval architects in this GB.
Nice woork
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Wow! :D
My build looks so clumsy in comparison. :icon_crap:
Love to see yours & mine side-by-side one day! :)
(Don't have the faintest idea how that will ever happen, but I'd love to see it! ;) )
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Wow! :D
My build looks so clumsy in comparison. :icon_crap:
Love to see yours & mine side-by-side one day! :)
(Don't have the faintest idea how that will ever happen, but I'd love to see it! ;) )
Funny, I have the same feeling when I see your build, Old Wombat! It would be cool to have the two sitting side by side, you planning any trips to the Outer Banks of North Carolina?
My daughter's soccer schedule is eating up all of my spare time, but I just need to finish up the propulsion system, close up a couple holes and build the turrets and it'll be time to put some paint on this one. Hope to get a little time on it tonight or Sunday.
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Update time! With this update, the vast majority of construction is complete. Final assembly begins this morning with photos to follow later today.
I had to just stop and call the propulsion system "good enough" otherwise it was going to bog down and wind up in the unfinished projects pile.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0305_zpsihxwnm3k.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0305_zpsihxwnm3k.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0304_zpsaoutubaj.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0304_zpsaoutubaj.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0303_zpsrzo5e2dn.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0303_zpsrzo5e2dn.jpg.html)
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Progress on Final Assembly:
Fore:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0310_zpsqkfoghuf.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0310_zpsqkfoghuf.jpg.html)
Port:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0309_zpsab9ctfn2.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0309_zpsab9ctfn2.jpg.html)
Starboard:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0313_zpscmozkdyr.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0313_zpscmozkdyr.jpg.html)
Aft:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0307_zpszxytafug.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0307_zpszxytafug.jpg.html)
Just need to let some glue dry and then I'll mate the hull to the topsides. Meanwhile I have a couple of turrets to complete.
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Last Update (for tonight)
She's all put together. I need to apply a little PSR to some rough spots, but otherwise, she's ready for the paint barn.
A couple of beauty shots:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0314_zpstmj8a5mj.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0314_zpstmj8a5mj.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0315_zpsddnh0cki.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0315_zpsddnh0cki.jpg.html)
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That looks awesome!! 8)
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Did well with plastic card stock, mast, hatch, deck, cleats, turrets and all :)
Like to see it with paint !
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Wow! :D (Again! ;) )
Now if only I'd gone for an enclosed cockpit! ::)
(The fiddly bits are slowing me down, as usual. :icon_crap: )
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Thanks for the compliments, now to decide on a paint scheme...
Now if only I'd gone for an enclosed cockpit! ::)
O.W. I had originally planned to have a full cockpit, then went with a fully enclosed (read: hidden) interior to avoid falling into the abyss of detail OCD. As it is, I had to stop fiddling with the props and call it done or it wouldn't have gotten to this point.
(The fiddly bits are slowing me down, as usual. :icon_crap: )
I feel your pain. I want it to be as detailed as possible, but where do you draw the line and move on?
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Terrific !!!
great work
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Update from the paint barn:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0316_zpse6bjeifr.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0316_zpse6bjeifr.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0317_zpsn0ogmovx.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0317_zpsn0ogmovx.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0318_zps13wgphe5.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0318_zps13wgphe5.jpg.html)
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Great work so far.
Ed
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Calling this one done. I may go back and add a wash and some other minor weathering, then again, I might not. So here she is:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0319_zpsbdonto3b.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0319_zpsbdonto3b.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0320_zps3psqtwse.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0320_zps3psqtwse.jpg.html)
Some close ups:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0322_zpsggp6qj77.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0322_zpsggp6qj77.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0324_zpsmwhtjspu.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0324_zpsmwhtjspu.jpg.html)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/jjmj94/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0325_zps9igmqjh2.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/jjmj94/media/Riverine%20Assault%20Support%20Craft/IMG_0325_zps9igmqjh2.jpg.html)
Thanks to everyone for the suggestions and support. I had a lot of fun with this one!
Now, does anyone need any 1/72 PT Boat parts? I seem to have quite a few that didn't get used...
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Not knowing very much about 'boats & ships', do these type of vessels not have markings of any sort or something ----
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Not an expert myself, but the few I've worked around/with didn't have anything - maybe a hull number or Small Craft Company's RUC stenciled in a couple of places.
I'll dig through the decal spares and see if I have any that may be appropriate.
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Give it a state civil registration number and see if anybody notices. ;D
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Give it a state civil registration number and see if anybody notices. ;D
Good idea - I like it :)
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Definitely needs a hull number and some "CAUTION" AND "WARNING" stencils.
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Wasn't sure about rear turret However, you got it spot on with two smaller guns. Adds flexibility of engagement too.
Grab rails, viewing ports, cabin door, mast, and the other various items all look like they belong :)
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Great build.
From where you started to here was indeed an interesting and edifying trip
Terrific
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Great job, mate! :)
And finished, too - which always helps. ;)