Author Topic: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin  (Read 596 times)

Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« on: September 27, 2022, 12:04:48 AM »
A question to anyone in the know. 

Would it be feasible to place a Saladin turret on an M3/M5 Stuart light tank hull? 

Just going off what I know of the Stuart kits in my custody and the Tamiya Saladin kit that is squirreled away in my storage locker and out of reach at the moment I can not imagine there being too drastic of a difference in size between these two turrets when it comes to fitting a Saladin turret to the Stuart hull. 

If the Stuart turret ring is that much smaller then perhaps the M8 Scott 75mm Howitzer Motor Carriage might be the better choice. 
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Offline Frank3k

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2022, 10:23:41 AM »
Here's half of your question, posted on the.

M3 Stuart   1187 (mm, I assume)

Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2022, 11:08:07 AM »
M3 Stuart turret ring: 46.75" (118.7cm)

Unfortunately, after hours of searching I haven't been able to find the turret ring dimensions of the Saladin but it doesn't look to be too different.

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Offline Frank3k

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2022, 11:17:05 AM »
Same here - no info on the Saladin. The Saladin is 2.54 m (8 ft 4 in) wide and the M3 is 2.29 m (7 ft 6 in) according to Wikipedia, so the turret diameters should be close.- about 34mm for the M3.

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2022, 01:02:11 AM »
One could possible get a crude measurement using the below drawings with dimensions - not the ring is visible in the top view:




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Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2022, 01:17:58 AM »
Using that image I get a turret ring diameter of roughly 142cm (56")

So, actually, a fairly hefty 9.25" (23.3cm) difference.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2022, 01:25:33 AM by Old Wombat »
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Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2022, 05:23:10 AM »
I should have checked the turret comparability between the M5/M8 hull and the Saladin turret before I shipped all of those Saladin turrets off to Old Wombat/Guy.  Now I really must get over to my storage locker and dig out that ancient Tamiya Saladin kit just to see if it will fit.  :smiley: 
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Offline jcf

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2022, 08:29:28 AM »
1/72nd scale kit sprue shot:


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Offline Story

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #8 on: October 04, 2022, 05:00:07 AM »
Be right back

Offline Story

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #9 on: October 04, 2022, 06:03:28 AM »
Well, that was irritating - the TAMIYA Saladin box had three truck frames in it, while the TAMIYA Saladin collection was in a resin ELAND box.

Anyways, this is the turret from the later M113 FSV (so, nicer and better detailed) plopped onto a built /salvage M8 Stuart.


I'd say you're good to go, less any technical hickups of mating the English wiring harness to the American hull.

When I went hunting for technical specifications, I found this post which has a good point - engine deck clearance.
https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/alternative-history-armoured-fighting-vehicles-part-3.470632/page-317#post-23005630

The answer is easy enough - just build a spacer box for the turret race. Being a shot trap isn't going be such a big deal on such a thin skinned AFV.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2022, 06:08:31 AM by Story »

Offline jcf

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #10 on: October 04, 2022, 07:41:27 AM »
I'm not sure why you'd want to as the armour on the Saladin is thinner than the Stuart, .5" vs. 1".
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Offline Story

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #11 on: October 04, 2022, 08:00:00 AM »
I'm not sure why you'd want to as the armour on the Saladin is thinner than the Stuart, .5" vs. 1".

Depends on the hierarchy of trade-offs; ease of maintenance, ammunition supply and availability of parts vs armor thickness.

Offline Jeffry Fontaine

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Re: Turret Ring Size Question - Stuart and Saladin
« Reply #12 on: October 04, 2022, 01:32:58 PM »
I'm not sure why you'd want to as the armour on the Saladin is thinner than the Stuart, .5" vs. 1".
Just an idea on how to improve on the M8 75mm HMC by replacing the open top turret with something of similar size and capability.  Neither the Saladin nor the M8 have much room to start with so perhaps the kit bash with these two subjects might be worth exploring. 

The M5/M8 hull has already been modified by fitting the VVSS from a Tamiya Grant/Lee including the drive sprockets and bogey wheels.  So swapping out the turret was just one more option to consider for this what-if. 

Well, that was irritating - the TAMIYA Saladin box had three truck frames in it, while the TAMIYA Saladin collection was in a resin ELAND box.

Anyways, this is the turret from the later M113 FSV (so, nicer and better detailed) plopped onto a built /salvage M8 Stuart.
<snip>
I'd say you're good to go, less any technical hickups of mating the English wiring harness to the American hull.

When I went hunting for technical specifications, I found this post which has a good point - engine deck clearance.
https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/alternative-history-armoured-fighting-vehicles-part-3.470632/page-317#post-23005630
<snip>
The answer is easy enough - just build a spacer box for the turret race. Being a shot trap isn't going be such a big deal on such a thin skinned AFV.

Thank you for sharing the link and images.  I suspected the Saladin turret would be a simple drop-in without much needed to make it fit but it is always nice to see it before committing to the cutting of plastic. 
Other turrets under consideration are the DELCO turret from the LAV-25 (ESCI kit).  It fits the M5 Stuart without any real modification. 
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