Author Topic: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread  (Read 24404 times)

Offline Weaver

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Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« on: March 25, 2016, 07:07:48 AM »
Post any and all inspiring photos, drawings, ideas, cave-paintings etc... of sideways mayhem that might be relevent to the Gunships GB, or the denizens thereof, herein.
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Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2016, 07:29:07 AM »
Okay as moderator I won't be taking part in the GB, so here are all the gunship ideas I've had. Please feel free to use/abuse any of them as you see fit. I may get around to making some or all of these one day, but don't hold your breath.

1. A Victorian steampunk airship with side-firing Gatling guns. Colonial policing role.

2. A Heyford with a manned gallery of side-firing guns under it's belly. Colonial policing role.

3. A Ford Trimotor with Maxim or water-cooled Browning guns in it's windows and/or doorway.

4. A Noratlas with side-firing guns used by the French in Algeria and/or Indo-China.

5. A DH Dove or Heron with an improvised side-firing gun in the doorway, using in a local war in Africa or Central America. (A Dove fitted with a 0.50 cal ground gun on it's tripod was used in Biafra for real).

6. An An-12 Cub with side-firing guns used by the Soviets in Afghanistan.

7. An An-72 Coaler with side-firing guns used by the Soviets in Afghanistan.

8. An An-26/32 Curl/Cline with side-firing guns used by the Soviets in Afghanistan or Indian Air Force.

9. A Canadair CL-215/415 used as an amphibious gunship (France/Thailand?)

10. A Dornier Do-28 with side guns used just about anywhere in Africa or Central America.

11. A Bristol Freighter with side guns used by the RAF in a Britain-in-Vietnam scenario.

« Last Edit: March 25, 2016, 07:49:52 AM by Weaver »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2016, 07:33:34 AM »




"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2016, 07:36:08 AM »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Kerick

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2016, 09:23:44 AM »
The article said the developer could fit a similar system into a Spartan. Hmmmm........

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2016, 10:32:33 AM »
The article said the developer could fit a similar system into a Spartan. Hmmmm........



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Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2016, 10:34:40 AM »
How about a Uninhabited Gunship - see details here:

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Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2016, 08:47:26 AM »
Here's an idea I had a few year ago when considering the vulnerability of traditional gunships to modern AA weapons and the consequent desire for greater stand-off:

The Vertical Gunship.

This is a converted transport plane similar to a classical gunship, but the difference is that it only has one high-velocity gun, mounted to fire downwards at the centre of gravity, in a limited-traverse mounting. The aircraft has a large optical sensor turret on it's nose, similar to the usual EO turrets but much larger and with greater magnification, and a control room with a operators and a ballistics computer. With all the volume available in a transport type, you should be able to design a system that lets the gun have a long barrel that retracts or swings out of the way for landing. My default mental picture is of a ball turret in the floor through which the gun barrel can slide. The hydraulic rig that moves the breech around can slide backward in the airframe, thus giving it more room to retract the barrel completely inboard for landing.

The modus operandi is that the the aircraft stays at about 15,000ft, well out of the envelope of MANPADS and portable AAA. When it finds a target, it flies towards it, and the ballistics computer, which also takes inputs from the aircraft flight control system, computes the correct moment to fire the gun. The ammunition has LED tracer in it, which is picked up by a second EO sensor mounted near the gun, and tracked to correct subsequent bursts (effectively a passive version of the closed-loop spotting used by Phalanx).

Why not just drop a bomb? Because a high-velocity cannon shell will be much less susceptible to wind drift and therefore more accurate.

Okay, so why not drop a guided bomb/missile? Because they're disproportionately large and expensive for small/low value targets. The aircraft can also carry way more shells than anybody can afford missiles.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 08:52:22 AM by Weaver »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline kitnut617

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2016, 08:58:50 AM »
I've plans to do something like this only I don't think I can get it done in the GB time period, the base/donor kit will be a Transall and some V-22 wings
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 09:01:11 AM by kitnut617 »

Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2016, 10:04:20 AM »
I've plans to do something like this only I don't think I can get it done in the GB time period, the base/donor kit will be a Transall and some V-22 wings

It'd be interesting trying to find a field of fire for the guns when the rotors are in the horizontal position... ???
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Kerick

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2016, 10:59:01 AM »
I read a story once about aerial resupply during WW2 where the Germans had AAA along a tree line parallel to the approach to a drop zone. I don't recall why but the drops were low level and transports were getting shot up. Finally resorted to using bombers which fired all their guns sideways at the tree line. B-24 gunship anyone?

Offline finsrin

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2016, 11:16:36 AM »
B-24 high wing does lend to building gunship version.
Korea and SEA come to mind !

Offline Volkodav

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2016, 11:19:35 AM »
US Civil War hot air balloon gunship with Gatling guns, sharpshooters and grenadiers in a long, rather than square basket.

Offline Tophe

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2016, 07:28:07 PM »
Sometimes, without side-guns, there are pivoting guns, and gunship name, does this qualify for here?:

Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2016, 11:08:29 PM »
Sometimes, without side-guns, there are pivoting guns, and gunship name, does this qualify for here?:

No, sorry. If you look at the definition in the rules thread, I deliberately made it fairly tight around AC-130-style things to avoid confusion with helicopter gunships, normal bombers firing their turrets sideways, bombers fitting with noses full of guns and sci-fi things that bring their own definition of 'gunship'.
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Tophe

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2016, 11:13:46 PM »
All right, I will follow these rules, no problem. :)

Offline kitnut617

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2016, 11:45:41 PM »
I've plans to do something like this only I don't think I can get it done in the GB time period, the base/donor kit will be a Transall and some V-22 wings

It'd be interesting trying to find a field of fire for the guns when the rotors are in the horizontal position... ???

Having heard a V-22 while flying at the Yuma Airshow a couple of years ago, I noticed it had a distinctive sound, just as C-130's have their sound which can be heard for miles before you actually see them. So my plan is to have a turret (or two) under the fuselage instead of all the side firing guns so the first attack would be a head-on attack with the turrets facing forward.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2016, 11:49:56 PM by kitnut617 »

Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #17 on: March 28, 2016, 10:51:50 AM »
Here's another thing to think about: gunships don't have to be big.

I can't find a useful picture, but a handful of Cessna O-1 Bird Dogs were converted in Vietnam to have a side-firing M-60 in place of the rear seat. At least one of them was christened 'Little Puff'. That's got to be the smallest manned gunship ever conceived.

I believe there was also a Helio Stallion and/or a PC-6 Turbo Porter converted to have side-firing guns too, and I seem to recall a Cessna O-2 version (Rhodesian?) too.
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #18 on: March 28, 2016, 11:10:46 AM »
The PC-6 gunship version was the Farichild AU-23A Peacemaker, evaluated in Vietnam by the USAF and later suppied to Thailand:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairchild_AU-23_Peacemaker







It'd be easy enough to do a What If version of this: how about a Dornier Do.28 or an Antonov An-2?


"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #19 on: March 28, 2016, 11:55:24 AM »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2016, 03:20:54 PM »
The PC-6 gunship version was the Farichild AU-23A Peacemaker, evaluated in Vietnam by the USAF and later suppied to Thailand:

...

It'd be easy enough to do a What If version of this: how about a Dornier Do.28 or an Antonov An-2?
Soviets had an experimental high-altitude meteo version of An-2 designated An-2ZA, and later An-6 Meteo. Only one example is built and never entered production. It had additional cockpit in front of vertical stabilizer and it just cries for a gunner...  ;)

There was also a version An-2NAK, later An-2F, an artillery observation variant with twin tale. Still, my vote goes to An-6...
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or take me as I am,
for I shall not change...
never...

Offline kitnut617

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #21 on: March 28, 2016, 10:00:38 PM »
By Harold's definition of a gunship, I don't think this qualifies but here's an idea.






Offline taiidantomcat

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #22 on: March 29, 2016, 12:51:49 AM »




Harvest Hawk
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Offline Weaver

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2016, 01:15:16 AM »
I've often wondered how practical it would be to fire missiles sideways from a gunship. If it was a tube-launched weapon with a high launch velocity like HOT or AT-6 Spiral, and you fitted it so that was nothing immediately behind it (like the tailplane) it should work. I envisages a pallet of side-firing AT-6s sliding out of the tail door on an An-72 to complement it's GSh-30-6s...

Another interesting avenue would be recoilless weapons. You might imagine a 106mm RR fitted with a extension tube on the back which carries the recoil-compensating back-blast out of the opposite side of the aircraft. The tube would slide back to allow reloading. Hard to see how you'd make it trainable though: maybe only in one axis (elevation)?

For a smaller machine with one or two fixed guns, the Rheinmetal RMK 30 recoilless autocannon offers some interesting possibilities. You could fit a light aircraft with a much greater calibre of weapon than it could otherwise stand the recoil of.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rheinmetall_RMK30
« Last Edit: March 30, 2016, 01:29:43 AM by Weaver »
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

"I'm a general specialist," - Harry Purvis in Tales from the White Hart by Arthur C. Clarke

Twitter: @hws5mp
Minds.com: @HaroldWeaverSmith

Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Gunships GB Inspirations Thread
« Reply #24 on: March 30, 2016, 03:14:48 AM »

All hail the God of Frustration!!!

You can't outrun Death forever.
But you can make the Bastard work for it.