Vismod or Ergonomic Adaptation of Firearms

[dy031101]

As I mentioned in the Pimp My Gun thread, I've been thinking of how it might look like if a Saiga 100 .30-06 could be dressed up like a Tabuk DMR.

(The result might as well be like a sniper rifle if used in a military capacity since .30-06 is no longer a cartridge shared by other battle rifles or GPMG......)

Oh, and for those who haven't seen it, the Saiga 100 IMHO reminds people little (if any) of its AK heritage......

======================================================================

An AR-style chassis for Remington 700...... short-action variety only so far though.

Hum...... I wonder if ACIS .308 magazine can be used to feed .300 Winchester Short Magnum then......

======================================================================

It also makes me think that a PSG-1-style chassis for bolt actions would look danged cool. 

======================================================================

Of course the AICS itself is pretty interesting as it combines some of the Arctic Warfare's ergonomics with Remington 700 actions (both short and long actions can be used).

[apophenia]

Not sure if this fits here ... but it's a firearm VisMod.

A few years back I was playing with a concept for upgrading ANA Kalashnikovs (instead of moving to 5.56). Two possibilities were shown. Both have Polish FB Radom rails to mount EOtech sights. The top version has pretty much standard aftermarket AK upgrade parts. The bottom version is meant to be a Canadian-supplied upgrade incorporating Diemaco (now Colt Canada) C7A2 components.

[dy031101]

Sure!  :)

[apophenia]

Cool. From that same series ...

First is a least-mod upgrade for ANA AKs -- basically a Krylon spray and bolt-on affair.

Second is donated Czech CZ.858s. ANP  model, top, is stock other than 'peripherals' mount and optional M203 grenade launcher. ANA model, bottom, has upgrades similar to those of the proposed ANA AKs.

[dy031101]

Look at what I found.

[Maverick]

Interesting, although odd.  How they will get around the FG being unbalanced should prove a challenge.

Thanks for sharing.

John

[dy031101]

A race gun designed to fit entirely within a box of 225mm x 150mm x 45mm interior dimension.

I am not entirely sure about the differences between a ported barrel and a barrel with muzzle compensator.  Does being ported reduce the actual barrel length of a firearm?

[apophenia]

A ported barrel is a form of muzzle brake/recoil compensator. Generally, ported barrel refer to simple holes drilled at the appropriate angle (as opposed to muzzle vents or slots with their more complicated shapes requiring additional machining).

[Maverick]

Donny, as mentioned above, the 'porting' of a barrel is a mod to the weapon's barrel rather than an additional fitting, so the barrel length remains unchanged (unless as part of the modification that occurs, of course).  A weapon with a separate compensator will have its dimensions changed although there is debate as to whether the barrel length should include the compensator or not.

Regarding the pistols in the link, I'm a little confused as to why there's a specific 'box size' in the first instance.  Sounds like the guys at Revell-Monogram have gotten into the firearms biz.

Regards,

John

[dy031101]

Was just wondering if the holes drilled on the barrel are actually rendering any segment of the barrel irrelevant for the purpose of the gun ballistics and such.

====================================================

Regarding the pistols in the link, I'm a little confused as to why there's a specific 'box size' in the first instance.

I think the requirement of fitting into the given box size might be meant to place limits on gun used in the match, as "unlimited" race guns are dominated by those equipped with big "glass" sights and compensators.  Some competitions would ban guns not mass-produced "for combat purposes" altogether for the sake of not being completely "race-oriented".

Which brings an idea- could a hunting handgun (something like this) be built while incorporating the bulk-reducing features of the so-called "Modified Masterpiece"?

Besides, the smaller the size...... maybe the better the chance that it might fit into non-racegun holsters?  And then wherever that could lead to...... 

[Maverick]

I'd suggest the .460 Rowland conversion wouldn't be applicable to the Modified Masterpiece revamp as the large compensator is an integral part of the design.  Their website suggests that not using it isn't an option so it'd be a rather larger 'box size' than the others.

Regards,

John

[dy031101]

I was thinking of the possibility of a purposely-made ported barrel that can work with the cartridge rather than a straight forward adaptation of the conversion kit; assume that the ability to convert back to .45 is not being sought in this case.

That being said...

Their website suggests that not using it isn't an option so it'd be a rather larger 'box size' than the others.

... did they say that because they concluded that the muzzle brake is the only way to get the cartridge to work on a M1911 platform or because it is simply the way the conversion kit is made (it's designed as a drop-in kit after all)?

[Maverick]

A ported barrel wouldn't be as beneficial to felt recoil, etc as a compensated one.  I'd assume, therefore, that the ability to produce a ported barrel for the platform using that cartridge would be challenging to say the least.  This is one of the Q&A's they have put up:

Q:  Will you chamber my non-compensated barrel in 460 Rowland?  OR sell a barrel only (No Compensator) in 460 Rowland?
A:   No,  the compensator is necessary to prevent damage to your 1911 pistol.

With all of that, it would seem the compensator is a necessary part of the design.

regards,

John

[dy031101]

I see.  Muzzle compensator it'd be then......

See attachment for source of inspiration (though if one thinks it a stretch to even call it a Vismod, I understand).

[Maverick]

Well, it's definitely different from a stock 1911, so Vismod doesn't seem a stretch, although it's certainly more than 'skin deep'.

Regards,

John

[dy031101]

I couldn't help to think of that repainted racegun as something of a logical extension to this......

[Maverick]

Certainly looks the part, although one wonders how bulky a 15rd .45cal magazine would be?

Regards,

John

[ChernayaAkula]

<...> a hunting handgun <...>

Who came up with sh!+ like that?  Utterly, utterly senseless!  Why does anyone need to shoot animals with handguns when there are rifles suitable for the task?
I remember the story of some kid somewhere in the US who killed a record weight feral hog with a .50 revolver. He shot it multiple times and then chased it through the woods for a couple hours, before catching up and giving it the coup de grâce at close range. And they intended to eat it!    Shot multiple times and chased through the woods for hours, it would've been chock-full of adrenaline. Have fun eating that. It'll reek (let alone taste) like someone p!ssed on your steak. Yummy!  Bloomin' idiots!

Good thing hunting with handguns is forbidden here in Germany. I don't doubt there'd be enough people wanting to give it a try. Too many incapable hunters out there as it is.

Sorry for the rant!

[dy031101]

<...> a hunting handgun <...>

Who came up with sh!+ like that?  Utterly, utterly senseless!  Why does anyone need to shoot animals with handguns when there are rifles suitable for the task?

Or "weapons of Dirty Harry or Paul Kersey's world", if it works out better. 

[dy031101]

This reminds me of apophenia's entries:

[ChernayaAkula]

Cool beast! 

Now, is it an ARAK or an AKAR? 

[dy031101]

Now, is it an ARAK or an AKAR? 

I'd say AKAR as it's an AK at its core. 

An AK/Galil-based assault rifle engineered from the start to take AR accessories would be helluva idea, IMHO.

[dy031101]

Of all the AR-Pattern 12 gauge shotguns,

this

ought to be aesthetically the least-butchered one.

Prototype only AFAIK.

[dy031101]

How To Install & Operate The SLIDE FIRE

Hum...... can someone suggest an eccentric AR15 configuration to go with this one?  I'd love to but have been unable to do so.

[Maverick]

For my mind, that slide fire mod seems about the most ridiculous concept for a firearm I've seen in some time.  The idea that the weapon's firing is dependent upon moving the forepart of the weapon around rather than simply pulling a trigger seems odd to say the very least.  What sort of effect it must have on accuracy would be 'interesting'.

Regards,

John

[ChernayaAkula]

For my mind, that slide fire mod seems about the most ridiculous concept for a firearm I've seen in some time. <...>

That depends on how you look at it and, more importantly,  where you live.  You turn a semi-automatic rifle into a fully-automatic one - without modifying the action or the trigger. Legally, it's still a semi-automatic rifle as, technically, only one shot is fired by one pull on the trigger. The fact that this method bumps your finger into the trigger at the rate of a fully-automatic rifle makes the distinction largely academic, of course.

If you live in a state that allows fully-automatic weapons, then, yes, this is one of the most ridiculous things out there.
If you live in a state that only allows semi-automatic weapons, this stock is a handy - and legal (at least for the moment) - way of having a semi-automatic rifles firing as fast as a fully-automatic one.
It seems this is how they view it in the US. All other nations' mileage may vary.

[Maverick]

I suspect you're right there Moritz.  When considering full-auto firearms, I rarely think of civilian applications given that many civilian gun communities don't have access to automatic weapons.  Obviously some areas within the US are a different kettle of fish, but I'd still like to see someone put a meaningful amount of lead onto a target using that system, civilian or not.

Regards,

John

[dy031101]

Look Here

Okay, while that one has received lots and lots of flaks from those who think "Pieces of History" should be let the way they were, I personally see nothing wrong with it; I mean, com'on, reproduction Garands are still being made today, and that EBR-wannabe is probably built from a reproduction as well for all we know, so what's the problem when classic Garand is by no means close to extinction to begin with?

[dy031101]

Looks like that Garand EBR isn't just a one-off custom work.

[ChernayaAkula]

<...> I'd still like to see someone put a meaningful amount of lead onto a target using that system, civilian or not.

Yeah, a comparison would be really interesting to see. Going by the video, the muzzle didn't seem to wander all that much.

Look Here <...>

Fine with me!  :)

Funny to see those guys going off their rocker! 

[dy031101]

Funny to see those guys going off their rocker! 

Especially when they are whining and moaning about a drop-in (which means a non-permanent and perfectly-reversible modification; that EBR stock for Garand turns out to be one, too) stock.

I actually would love to see a Garand outfitted like one of the attached pics.

[elmayerle]

The latest issue of American Handgunner has an interesting report from the EUropean equivalent of the SHOT show, some one in Germany is making double-barreled M1911's, essentially two in parallel with a common trigger and slide.

[dy031101]

This one is not the first AR-15 platform that employs Grease-gun-style stock, but it looks better than every other attempt I have seen so far:

[dy031101]

Can, say, a Mauser Broomhandle or Colt Pocket Hammerless be "zero-timed"?

I heard that SAAMI pressure standards for old cartridges would adjust downward according to the metallurgical ages of the guns they were created for.  Is there a way to restore the old guns back to a state where they can safely handle the original loadings of their ammo?

[Story]

There are some SKS carbines around that have been vismodded to look like Chauchat automatic rifles.

[Gingie]

If you go on Deviant Art, have a search for Nerf Guns. Some fellas have painted them up to look very realistic, with theme colours such as District 9 and Aliens, as well as a fair amount of Steampunk conversions.

[Rickshaw]

Can, say, a Mauser Broomhandle or Colt Pocket Hammerless be "zero-timed"?

I heard that SAAMI pressure standards for old cartridges would adjust downward according to the metallurgical ages of the guns they were created for.  Is there a way to restore the old guns back to a state where they can safely handle the original loadings of their ammo?

Only by replacing their barrels, chambers, frames.

[Old Wombat]

Can, say, a Mauser Broomhandle or Colt Pocket Hammerless be "zero-timed"?

I heard that SAAMI pressure standards for old cartridges would adjust downward according to the metallurgical ages of the guns they were created for.  Is there a way to restore the old guns back to a state where they can safely handle the original loadings of their ammo?

Only by replacing their barrels, chambers, frames.

ipso facto rebuilding them from scratch (maybe you could keep the wood bits, if they're not too fragile).