M551 Sheridan Ideas and Inspiration

[Rickshaw]

With wheeled vehicles, you lose substantial amounts of hull volume because of the turning requirements of the wheels, to turn the vehicle.  You can counter that by using skid steer like the AMX-10RC does, however, that comes at substantial costs in the tyres needing to be frequently changed because of the amount of rubber they lose with each turn.  The British experimented with a skid-steer vehicle, the 6x6 Rhino and decided against it, when they were developing the Saracen/Saladin.   Apparently it provides a wild ride but economically doesn't make much sense.   I remember watching the local RAEME Squadron playing with their old Saracen "recovery aide".   It's turning system was shot so the only way they could get it around corners was to skid steer.   No one was allowed to ride in it but watching from outside was scary enough.

So, unless you have a substantial loss of hull volume, you shall need to skid steer it, Greg.   

[Crbad]

Are you talking about a Sheridan turret on a wheeled vehicle or putting wheels on the M551 chassis? Putting wheels on the Sheridan hull would be difficult for all the reasons mentioned above. Putting the turret on wheels would also be tough. The recoil of the 152mm was... Excessive. Being in the driver's seat during a gunnery table is a little like being in multiple car crashes in one day. It was enough to raise the front road wheels off the ground whilst firing. I'm not sure how that would translate to a wheeled vehicle. It might be cool to see it on a AMX 10 or Centauro.

[Jeffry Fontaine]

3D printed MGM-51 Shillelagh missiles for the MBT-70, M60A2, and the M551 Sheridan are now available at Shapeways. 
Click on this link to view the product: 1/35 Shillelagh Missile Set MSP35-032 Made By Mike's MS Productions

Read about the MGM-51 Shillelagh: Wikipedia > MGM-51 Shillelagh Missile

[Rickshaw]

Are you talking about a Sheridan turret on a wheeled vehicle or putting wheels on the M551 chassis? Putting wheels on the Sheridan hull would be difficult for all the reasons mentioned above. Putting the turret on wheels would also be tough. The recoil of the 152mm was... Excessive. Being in the driver's seat during a gunnery table is a little like being in multiple car crashes in one day. It was enough to raise the front road wheels off the ground whilst firing. I'm not sure how that would translate to a wheeled vehicle. It might be cool to see it on a AMX 10 or Centauro.

When the Australian Army tested the early M551 Sheridan for use in their airmobile Division organisation they found the vehicle was too light for the gun.  With the brakes hard on, firing fore/aft the vehicle would still move about a metre.   They weren't willing to fire it athwarts more than once,  it rocked off it's nearside track and in their opinion was in danger of turning turtle.    The Australian Army liked the idea of the M551 and indeed, in their "Division" training pamphlet (manual) it featured as being the standard equipment of the Division reconnaissance squadron for about 8 years before it was reprinted.

[GTX_Admin]

Are you talking about a Sheridan turret on a wheeled vehicle or putting wheels on the M551 chassis? Putting wheels on the Sheridan hull would be difficult for all the reasons mentioned above. Putting the turret on wheels would also be tough. The recoil of the 152mm was... Excessive. Being in the driver's seat during a gunnery table is a little like being in multiple car crashes in one day. It was enough to raise the front road wheels off the ground whilst firing. I'm not sure how that would translate to a wheeled vehicle. It might be cool to see it on a AMX 10 or Centauro.

Bah!  Reality!

[Crbad]

Are you talking about a Sheridan turret on a wheeled vehicle or putting wheels on the M551 chassis? Putting wheels on the Sheridan hull would be difficult for all the reasons mentioned above. Putting the turret on wheels would also be tough. The recoil of the 152mm was... Excessive. Being in the driver's seat during a gunnery table is a little like being in multiple car crashes in one day. It was enough to raise the front road wheels off the ground whilst firing. I'm not sure how that would translate to a wheeled vehicle. It might be cool to see it on a AMX 10 or Centauro.

Bah!  Reality!

:) Right. Thinking cap off; imagineering fez on... The first thing to do would be to raise the ground clearance. Standard clearance is about a foot and a half (roughly half a meter), so unless you wanted to use automobile tires, it has to be lifted. You could try adding a V shape hull like an MRAP. That would raise it and give room for the wheels to turn (theoretically... I'm not an engineer). Or you could try putting the wheels outside the hull, but that seems pretty awkward.
 If you're just talking about kitbashing, then maybe try swapping the entire lower hull out with a 6 wheel job. AMX 10 seems like a good candidate. Saladin is probably too small. Maybe a German Fuchs or a Japanese type 87? Both have affordable kits out there...

[Gingie]

I'm thinking XM-800 wheeled version with a Sheridan turret.

[Rickshaw]

I'm thinking XM-800 wheeled version with a Sheridan turret.

How about the XM-808?



Might need 8x8 to make the ground pressure acceptable...

[M.A.D]

Sounding very AMX 10RC like

M551 chassis with a AMX 10RC...sounds straight forward... I like it.
Still to this day I've never understood the US Army's inability/unwant to simple substitute the ridiculous and limited 152mm gun/launcher, and yet continued to deploy it....

M.A.D

[ysi_maniac]

Ares 75mm gun for M551. IMO much better than that 152mm launcher. At least, crew members look happy

[GTX_Admin]

I like.

[M.A.D]

I like.

I second that GTX, considering the US Army had no issues with the reliability/maintenance of the M551's chassis/running gear/engine...
One would naturally think this combination of Ares 75mm gun in place of the woeful 152mm gun-launcher and it's heavy/bulky ammunition would make M551 inherently lighter - hence allowing for more much needed armour to be added = better survivability!🤔👍

MAD

[jcf]

76mm gun M32




This was to use a combustible case round.




Fitted with the larger gun/launcher intended for the MBT70.

[apophenia]

Cool! With that 90 mm M41 mounted, the Sheridan reminds me of the Swedish IKV-91 

If the 105 mm M68 was "installed by the Naval Surface Weapons Center", does that imply potential use by Marine Corps tank companies?

[Jeffry Fontaine]

Attached images showing M41 turret with modifications to make it compatible with the M551 Sheridan hull. 

The M41 turret ring was removed in its entirety from the turret.  The M551 Sheridan turret ring was cut away from the rest of the Sheridan turret and attached to the M41 turret.  This in turn allows the M41 turret to fit comfortably on the Sheridan hull and it will rotate freely and is not held in place with the small retaining tabs which I removed from the ring before mating the parts together. 





***Edit to add additional information on the modifications made to the turret. -- jjf

[ChalkLine]

That's awesome.

I've got a bunch of barrels here for my M41 but evidently the turret needs serious changes to fit most things. This shows just how streamlined the turret was.

[Jeffry Fontaine]

That's awesome.

I've got a bunch of barrels here for my M41 but evidently the turret needs serious changes to fit most things. This shows just how streamlined the turret was.

I have already destroyed one Tamiya M41 turret while trying to improve the commander's position.  My focus was on removing that odd looking feature entirely to replace it with something more fitting such as the cupola from an M113 or the "Urdan" style cupola adoped for use on the M48A5 and reminiscent of the cupola seen on early production M48 and M103 tanks. 

Will try to do the same modifications again with another turret but this time making sure of what I remove before going all out and cocking up another one. 

One of the AFV Club M41 kits included a metal barrel but the muzzle brake was plastic.  Can not recall if it is the M41 that originated with Skybow or the AFV Club kit but all in all, the AFV Club/Skybow kits are a much nicer kit as it should be considering what the price is for the damned things.  Tamiya is the path of least expense and easy to come by in comparison. 

[ChalkLine]

Like you that cupola is something I want to change, the standard cupola is non-rotating which is very 1950s. I'll be following what you do there so you can navigate the minefield first :)

Whatever I put in I want a rotating pintle, the fixed pintles evidently were a headache. I thought about making it an offset one but really it's still naff.

The commander's gunsight is the fixed-forward sight in front of the cupola. I was serious considering unzipping it and putting in the early hunter-killer sight off the Leopard I.