Author Topic: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration  (Read 136825 times)

Offline elmayerle

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2013, 03:40:42 AM »
I'd have to check between F-20 and A-4 kits, but I suspect the A-4Kahu radome would work just fine.  If Im not mistaken, the A-4AR uses a very similar shape (well, it does use the same radar).

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2013, 03:47:43 AM »
Yep.  Just grey:

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Offline M.A.D

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #52 on: April 11, 2013, 06:38:58 PM »
What about a dedicated air defence A-4 with air-air radar, after burning engine etc...

IIRC the USN had a trial with some A-4Cs with nose radomes off ?Cougers for operation from the escort carriers. I always thought it was a good idea

Edit - just checked - 3 Anti-submarine Fighter Squadrons  VSF-1,2, and 3 had A-4s. They tried the nose off an F-11 Tiger on an A-4B (BuNo145002) in 1966 but it wasn't successful.

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #53 on: April 12, 2013, 01:55:16 AM »
Hmmm...interesting.  Maybe do an updated, dedicated ASW variant...
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Offline Daryl J.

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #54 on: April 12, 2013, 02:09:51 AM »
Quote
Hmmm...interesting.  Maybe do an updated, dedicated ASW variant

Just another reason for another TA-4F kit.   Underwing Anti-FloatyThing Greeblies.  Mmmmm ;D
« Last Edit: April 12, 2013, 10:38:01 AM by Daryl J. »
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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #55 on: April 12, 2013, 02:33:22 AM »
I was thinking more of a OA-4M - lots of room for extra equipment + Underwing Anti-FloatyThing Greeblies...
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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #56 on: April 12, 2013, 02:33:59 AM »
Random Idea:  Norwegian A-4 in winter camo + Penguin ASMs...
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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #57 on: April 12, 2013, 04:53:59 AM »
SA-4M anti-floaty things version with torpedos from SV-22 kit.  make it an anti-underwater-floaty things version with a centerline store of a buddy refueling pod modified to deploy and stow a MAD sensor.  I can see one of these working with a Brazilian S-2T as a hunter-killer team.  Alternatively, a modernized one with dry F404/RM12/F414 doing the same with a SV-22.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2013, 06:34:11 AM by elmayerle »

Offline M.A.D

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #58 on: April 12, 2013, 08:02:01 AM »
I was thinking more of a OA-4M - lots of room for extra equipment + Underwing Anti-FloatyThing Greeblies...

Agree!!

M.A.D

Offline Daryl J.

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #59 on: April 12, 2013, 09:54:43 AM »
 My rationale for the TA-4F:   I like the 1:48 Hasegawa kit and can add dorsal, nasal, lateral, caudal, and ventral greeblies partly from kit components, donor kits, and Evergreen stock more easily than finding and rescribing the Monogram OA-4M. 


« Last Edit: April 12, 2013, 10:37:42 AM by Daryl J. »
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Offline Daryl J.

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #60 on: April 12, 2013, 10:52:11 AM »
Could Penguins ride beneath a -B or would theY need something like a  -M or Kahu?
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Offline AGRA

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #61 on: April 12, 2013, 11:31:09 AM »
Could Penguins ride beneath a -B or would theY need something like a  -M or Kahu?

Penguin was designed to replace the Bullpup and use existing Bullpup interfaces so it’s probably very likely it could have been used by the A-4B. But you would not be able to get the advantage of its all weather use, degree of target discrimination and programmable courses without a radar and INS based nav attack system (like in the F-104G it was designed for). But potentially you could use it like a Bullpup with a bit more range (18 vs 10 NM) and fire and forget and sea skimming attack. Significant advantages.

So in Whiff world you could have the pre Junta Peron government of Argentina buying a license or a block of them for Air Force use and provide a significant counter to some other Whiff world strengthening of British air defences in the Falklands War. So you’ve got AEW and Sea Cat 2 well we’ve got Skyhawks with Penguins and so on.

A quick check of the Flight International archive to see if Kongsberg had tried to market the Penguin for Skyhawks didn’t turn up anything. But that the Penguin via BAC was strongly considered by the SAAF in 1970 when the then new UK conservative govt. announced in would allow maritime use only weapons sales to South Africa.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2013, 12:46:06 PM by AGRA »

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #62 on: April 13, 2013, 02:19:24 AM »
So in Whiff world you could have the pre Junta Peron government of Argentina buying a license or a block of them for Air Force use and provide a significant counter to some other Whiff world strengthening of British air defences in the Falklands War. So you’ve got AEW and Sea Cat 2 well we’ve got Skyhawks with Penguins and so on.

Hmmm...interesting.
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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #63 on: April 13, 2013, 01:42:13 PM »
Aéronavale A-4(FN) with Agave radar in nose and Exocet missile on centreline.
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Offline Daryl J.

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #64 on: April 22, 2013, 04:01:17 AM »
TA-4x with two extended range Sea Eagle missiles.   Non-American service.
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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #65 on: April 22, 2013, 04:49:47 AM »
TA-4x with two extended range Sea Eagle missiles.   Non-American service.
Definitely need a drop tank on the centerline.  By "extended range" do you mean "with a booster added" or "lengthened for greater fuel tankage" since the Sea Eagle uses a jet engine?

Of course, the same configuration in JASDF service carrying two ASM-2's or extended range versions thereof instead of the extended range Sea Eagles.  'Twould look good in the same blue scheme as F-2's use.

Offline Daryl J.

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #66 on: April 22, 2013, 05:03:36 AM »
Yep.   Centerline drop tank.   Lengthened for greater fuel capacity.   Had thought of placing them in the Mediterranean Sea for control of communist forces, perhaps in Greek use or some Alternate African mapline.
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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #67 on: April 22, 2013, 05:27:44 AM »
Yep.   Centerline drop tank.   Lengthened for greater fuel capacity.   Had thought of placing them in the Mediterranean Sea for control of communist forces, perhaps in Greek use or some Alternate African mapline.
Well, if things had gone differently several centuries before the Christian Era (say, Aeneas and Dido had remained on good terms and a Rome-Carthage axis and alliance had developed),  perhaps in the service of the Carthaginian Republic?  This country would encompass much of what we consider North Africa and would definitely be a long-time power.

Offline Cliffy B

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #68 on: May 27, 2013, 10:37:59 AM »
Just saw this posted over on Secret Projects: http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,19573.0.html

Quote
Found this drawing in "Douglas A-4 Skyhawk" by Jim Winchester.  Drawing dated Aug. 28, 1973.  Very little information is provided and the book states not much is known about this, no designation number is provided. Engine used was J52-P408 vs. J52-P8 used in A-4F.  Wing span approx. 55ft.  On station time approx. 3.2 hours. 




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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #69 on: June 13, 2013, 02:06:14 AM »
Interesting...
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Offline Weaver

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #70 on: June 13, 2013, 07:43:13 PM »
Could probably do that with a 1/72nd Skyhawk and the Tamiya 1/100th Viggen....
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Offline M.A.D

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #71 on: June 13, 2013, 08:44:30 PM »
Those look like mini-Viggens!   :)

Did someone talked about mini-Viggens?




Forget the Viggen-type intergrations
What about a simple 'Kfir' canard-type integration into the basic Skyhawk (especially that of Israeli Air Force Skyhawks!!)

Skyhawk with canards!!
Greater lift, without need of increasing main wing area!
Better manoeuvrability (important for those navy's operating it from earlier gen aircraft carrier)
Better angles of attack!
Slower landing speed!
Better STOL performance!

I like it!!

M.A.D
« Last Edit: May 15, 2018, 09:33:46 PM by M.A.D »

Offline Weaver

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #72 on: June 14, 2013, 12:55:28 AM »
Forget the Viggen-type intergrations
What about a simple 'Kfir' canard-type integration into the basic Skyhawk (especially that of Israeli Air Force Skyhawks!!)

Skyhawk with canards!!
Greater lift, without need of increasing main wing area!
Better manoeuvrability (import for those navy's operating it from earlier gen aircraft carrier)
Better angles of attack!
Slower landing speed!
Better STOL performance!

I like it!!

M.A.D

You might get some "interesting" votex interactions over the tailplane with high-mounted canards (i.e. on the top of the air intakes). What might work is a low, fixed  canard in the position of the gun blast deflectors, whose tip-vortex re-energises the longest-chord bit of the wing, and at high AoA it would be almost like a fixed leading edge slot....
"I have described nothing but what I saw myself, or learned from others" - Thucydides

"I've jazzed mine up a bit" - Spike Milligan

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Offline elmayerle

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #73 on: June 14, 2013, 01:48:05 AM »
How about high-mounted canards in conjunction with a change to low-mounted tailplanes?  I quite agree that high-mounted canards and tailplanes on teh vertical tail are going to have "interesting", and likely not beneficial, interactions.

Offline Daryl J.

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Re: Douglas A-4 Skyhawk Ideas and Inspiration
« Reply #74 on: July 29, 2013, 08:01:34 AM »
One of the criticisms leveled at the Monogram A-4E/F kit is that the clear canopy parts are misshapen being to squat.   It's most obvious when one looks at the windscreen framing.   But given the generally inexpensive nature of the kit, its relative ease of building, and today's world of restricted luxury time, it just seems like a great kit to redo its ''face'' and put an armored, much more squared up windscreen.   Yes, it would be shorter than the Mike but that's just fine.   Scab on some external armor like one saw on the Skyraider and Skoshi Tigers, do a light duty rescribe and toss it into either USAF or US Army service in Vietbam. 
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