USA, A OK! or America 46

[taiidantomcat]

I've been thinking of making this thread for quite some time, but first a bit of a long winded intro, and some general thoughts on What-ifs and modeling in General. I am an American, no hiding it. But I didn't really tend to build anything with US markings. Lots of US designs (Abrams tanks, F-14 Tomcats) but usually wearing anything but US schemes! I suppose that is is the fun of whiffery. We have seen it as it "should be" plenty, but what else is out there?

It took me a while to get interested in US and some allied alternate designs from the past. I think some this is just pure familiarity, so I don't think I really gave a lot of these things a 2nd or 3rd look, Olive Drab too is not exactly always the most exciting color. it pales in comparison to some of the very intricate and fascinating paint and camouflage patterns displayed by the Axis powers which I really think attracts a lot of modelers to them. The desperation of the Axis as the tide turned also created fantastical and radical designs that sparked the Luft46 craze.  but slowly I began to really enjoy and like and appreciate the subtlety of a lot of American World War II and cold war designs. they have a utilitarian nature, but are not as "raw" as say designs from the USSR. A Hamilton standard propeller may not look as exotic as a Luftwaffe spinner prop complete with spiral markings, but it has it own charm.

There are also many American paint schemes and markings that are downright interesting and attractive. I think the US Navy collection of Blues known as "4 tone" or "3 tone" is one of those whiffery "cheats"-- a paint scheme that looks good on anything. plenty of American aircraft designs are unique, interesting, and even iconic. There is simply no mistaking a Corsair, or a P-38 for anything else.

So the purpose of this thread is to explore US themed aircraft (and the occasional ally if I can manage it) from the 1920s to now with lots of mixing and matching and madness. This is going to be an ongoing thread and I will warn beforehand that some these things may just be small, one off experiments that never actually get finished. so I apologize in advance if you are looking forward to finally seeing that one model "done" because it might never happen. My shelf of doom has projects that have been in need of finish for decades, and I'm not afraid to add to it. To me the joy of What-if modeling is the escape from Pressure. it doesn't have to be "right," and recently I just enjoy "tinkering" with models. It occurred to me "who says it has to be right?" can also be "who says it has to be done?"

I have more models than I have years left to build them, and I have more ideas than I have models. so not all of it will be finished, and I'm fine with that. I am investing in some sketchbooks and trying to improve my digital work so I can flesh out some ideas that way as well. I plan to post in this thread as often as I can, and hopefully create some inspiration, new ideas, and fun for others.


So just to get things rolling, here is a years old (over 10 years at least) Green Zinc Chromate WWII F-14 Cockpit of a forever in progress WWII F-14:









 

[apophenia]

A OK! Looking forward to this 

[Kerick]

I’m sure you’ve seen the WW2 patterns on USAF A-10s for instance.
https://www.reddit.com/r/aviation/comments/n5oe4p/a10_gets_world_war_ii_heritage_paint_scheme/

https://d1ldvf68ux039x.cloudfront.net/thumbs/photos/2105/6630464/1000w_q95.jpg

I was at the Oshkosh airshow last summer and there was a T-38 in SEA pattern.

And an F-16.
https://www.nationalguard.mil/News/Article-View/Article/573122/colorful-f-16-represents-90-years-of-history/

Lots of opportunities!

[taiidantomcat]

A OK! Looking forward to this 

I can't tell you how happy this post made me.  hope to have fun stuff to show here soon.

I’m sure you’ve seen the WW2 patterns on USAF A-10s for instance.
https://www.reddit.com/r/aviation/comments/n5oe4p/a10_gets_world_war_ii_heritage_paint_scheme/

https://d1ldvf68ux039x.cloudfront.net/thumbs/photos/2105/6630464/1000w_q95.jpg

I was at the Oshkosh airshow last summer and there was a T-38 in SEA pattern.

And an F-16.
https://www.nationalguard.mil/News/Article-View/Article/573122/colorful-f-16-represents-90-years-of-history/

Lots of opportunities!

I have been "geeking out" on these retro schemes to an unhealthy degree it has been wonderful to see so many of these happening, and they seem to be a regular staple now! even the US army has gone back to the "pinks and greens" service uniforms of world war II vintage. life is truly stranger than fiction! LOL hugely inspirational and very much the "spirit" of this thread. I have an "America 46" folder and it grows by the day   

Speaking of, I want to clarify that nothing here will be of any "connection"-- its not a set story or timeline. I've discovered that the more I focus on "back story" the less I get done and the more paralyzed I become in terms of building. not going to worry about it :) its all just one big "fantasy world"

I'm going to post a few in-progress pics. a few inspirational pics. And then I wanted to ask: Where are all the cool kids going for photo hosting these days? i still have a flickr but it might be maxed out and I might have to start another unless someone has a better recommendation. 



Photo posted from the personal collection of a sailor working on the movie "The Final Countdown" I don't recall ever seeing the "kill" markings in the film, but they were apparently applied!






great concept F-14 and F-18 from Ariel Alvarez (the best place to find him is on instagram @arielalvarezart --that is the spot he keeps most "current", though he has an artstation and a webpage as well)



This one is from Clave! who (was?) a regular on these forums. I modified his profile by making the phantom a Navy-style Short nose with some easy copy and paste from a Mark Styling Profile.

I'm just fascinated with this idea of a "fleet defender' in world war II.

Onto some plastic, I'm sorry this is dull but the little things must be done before the big things develop:



^^^^Front landing gear doors in the "closed" position for some revellogram F-14s in 1/48. ^^^^ The plastic was very thin .010, so I knew I was going to mangle some of them. I wasn't really using an ideal tool setup so I made a lot of them and then crossed my fingers. The overall goal here was to use legos (because they are very user friendly) to create a model where the gear bays are "closed" on the model so I can swoosh it around the room, but also when my arms get tired and my sound effects run out,  that I can plug in some undercarriage for when I want to set it down. This has lead to some experimentation. I didn't like the first idea, so I took about a 1 hour "penalty stroke" and had to fill them and sand them, and try try again. basically removable landing gear.



I think I have found a really solid set up that will not be too difficult to replicate. Hope to share that soon with the next post.

[Kerick]

That first drawing looks like a Sea Vixen shacked up with a Tigercat. Like I need more ideas.
The second looks like a couple of Mustangs ran into an F-18. Both are super cool but I think the second one should be in Army colors as it has inline engines which the Navy seemed to reject at first glance.

[ramiroelliot]

interesting idea worth looking forward to   

[taiidantomcat]

interesting idea worth looking forward to   

thank you, and welcome aboard!

That first drawing looks like a Sea Vixen shacked up with a Tigercat. Like I need more ideas.
The second looks like a couple of Mustangs ran into an F-18. Both are super cool but I think the second one should be in Army colors as it has inline engines which the Navy seemed to reject at first glance.

I had the same thought on the engines! I think from a looks perspective the hornet having smaller thinner engines fits with the look of the original F-18.Has my wheels turning on modifying a P-38 in some way, or as you suggest a couple P-51s thrown onto the end of some cut down hornet wings.

from a buliding perspective it seems to make equal sense to start from either a heavily modded P-38 made to look like an F-18, or taking an F-18 and modding it with WWII parts...

[Kerick]

It would be quite a kit bash however we did it. Something to ponder.
“Pinky, are you pondering what I’m pondering?” Pinky and the Brain.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v-xrnIXQ3iQ

[taiidantomcat]

It would be quite a kit bash however we did it. Something to ponder.
“Pinky, are you pondering what I’m pondering?” Pinky and the Brain.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=v-xrnIXQ3iQ

what a great compilation. LOL

 One idea I had for a WWII modified F-18 Hornet was to just throw a big giant radial (large enough to cover the twin engine exhausts) in the tail with a pusher prop after cutting the rear fuselage down a bit to maintain the same size and layout. from there, add some world war II style fins and wings borrowed from another wwII plane(s) for the proper look. One could take it a step further and chop the whole back end aft the wing off and then add canards up front for a Kyushu J7W Shinden look. (I plan on doing a japanese WWII F-18 Using this exact plan)


I keep telling myself though, that I am going to stay on target... but so many temptations 

  I will not get distracted.
  I will not get distracted.
  I will not get distracted.



 

[perttime]

And lots of .50 or 20mm guns in the nose?

[Kerick]

And lots of .50 or 20mm guns in the nose?

And one of those 37mm guns too.

[Ramba]

Cool idea with the F-14.

Japan was still using the two tone blue camo on their F-4's. Here is an F-4EJ KAI in that blue camo.
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5iHwfnofZ_o/YFCBaPJ09WI/AAAAAAADK2A/PISepTuMtEU_MGe_3p7mprUtnD0tNg1sQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1280/Fine%2BMold%2BF-4EJ-19%2B%2B%25283%2529.jpg

They still use it on their Mitsubishi F-2's.
https://i.redd.it/vco40m5nfdib1.jpg

[taiidantomcat]

And lots of .50 or 20mm guns in the nose?

And lots of .50 or 20mm guns in the nose?

And one of those 37mm guns too.

Help! Moderators! I'm being "bullied" into something I desperately want to try! 

Cool idea with the F-14.

Japan was still using the two tone blue camo on their F-4's. Here is an F-4EJ KAI in that blue camo.
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5iHwfnofZ_o/YFCBaPJ09WI/AAAAAAADK2A/PISepTuMtEU_MGe_3p7mprUtnD0tNg1sQCLcBGAsYHQ/s1280/Fine%2BMold%2BF-4EJ-19%2B%2B%25283%2529.jpg

They still use it on their Mitsubishi F-2's.
https://i.redd.it/vco40m5nfdib1.jpg

yes! thank you  its funny you should mention that! When I got this idea back in May (not an original idea, BTW but it finally "clicked" with me)  I started searching around the web to see what I could find of "blue Tomcats" sure enough the Japanese F-14 in JASDF Blues is almost its own sub genre. There is apparently a die-cast or at least metal version that can be purchased outright, and there have been a few models constructed as well. I don't know who came up with the original whif, but it has apparently the F-14J become very popular!









I always try to give credit where I can, but these are all just quick saves from the net, and I don't know where they came from unless it already noted on them. it been a great help in terms of getting an idea of a WWII style F-14

[Buzzbomb]

What a great topic and some terrific images on the topic

[taiidantomcat]

quick sidetrack.

I wish I had taken a "before" picture of this. it started out as a small block of wood. I cut it with a miter saw and it was basically a disaster. it looked like a dilapidated asymmetrical diamond, nothing was even or level. I went after it for about 30 minutes with some heavy grit sand paper and eventually tamed it into this:





What is "this"?





I was super happy I was able to make it look not only much better than I hoped, but something that could be confused as "aeronautical" looking LOL. Tomcat nose assembly is from the Hasegawa kit. I don't have much experience with wood, so this was new and pretty fun. Thank you Paul Budzik.





very rough mock up using the Monogram P-61 (1/48)

I plan on doing  2 of these. one with wings out and can be zipped around and one with wings folded as if on a Carrier deck/hanger. I don't know If I want to use the wood piece as a male mold for vacuforming (never done that before) or just use the wood and the 2nd version will have a different method for doing the same thing.

I was curious to see how much work it was going to take to make things look right, but its not nearly as bad as I thought it would be. (famous last words, there is still a lot that needs to be done)

Anyway thank you for looking and I'm glad I could show the semblance of a model LOL

[Kerick]

This is a very interesting design! I definitely want to see more of this. 

I don't know how the pointed end on the wood block would work with a vacuform. I'd be afraid of it poking through the plastic. This could be done with a silicone mold and some UV resin pored and cured a little at a time to create a hollow shell. Just thinking out loud. Or just sand down a second piece. I'd try balsa wood.

BTW, I think the two tone blue Japanese pattern is cool and probably pretty effective over water.

[Old Wombat]

Given that they'll be behind the main wheels, I'd try to use it as a vac-forming buck or, alternatively, as a frame around which to shape strips of styrene into the rough shape (then sand that down to the final form).

This will prevent the need to find a similar mass to add to the front of the build to keep its nose down.

[Kerick]

The balance will be an issue no doubt. Maybe the vacuform could be done in two pieces. Or the balsa.

[finsrin]

Intriguing - looking forward to more pictures.

[taiidantomcat]

Given that they'll be behind the main wheels, I'd try to use it as a vac-forming buck or, alternatively, as a frame around which to shape strips of styrene into the rough shape (then sand that down to the final form).

This will prevent the need to find a similar mass to add to the front of the build to keep its nose down.

The balance will be an issue no doubt. Maybe the vacuform could be done in two pieces. Or the balsa.

I am trying to view all models as "experiments" that way I avoid the terrible project killer of perfectionism.

the points about the weight were things I had no considered. I have never vacuformed before, but I have a little vacuformer I bought decades ago. So after a few youtube Videos it was time to jump in and see how it went.

I don't know if it was beginners luck, or what but I managed to make a couple servicable little doodads. after a couple "close" but no cigar attempts.

The problem is that they were paper thin and I mean paper thin. I still don't know how I managed to not have it break through.

so my "solution" (disaster actually) was to pour a mix of Super glue and nail powder (the stuff they use at salons to just make it a kind of rock. This failed however and it broke through, warped, and cracked the parts. Which is disappointing but it was an experiment afterall. I will probably just end up going with the wood parts and luckily they are not too heavy. I might drill out some of the insides as well.

I don't think its anything that will be too impossible to add enough weight up front to keep things from tail sitting. (am I being Naive? we will find out! some of these WWII boom planes need nothing short of a chain to keep the nose down)







anyway, I had fun. vacuforming has a kind of magic about it, and I hope to work on it and do better. not bad for a first try.

Meanwhile something pretty to look at:




The world of colors are endless, so I grabbed some legos to compare the 3 tone (technically 4 tone) USN/USMC blues. Rather than be overwhelmed with options this is a way to look at a few basic color combinations. Lego generally has very eye-pleasing colors.

sorry for the long time between updates. I still have a few more posts to catch up on. Hoping to post more updates in the coming days. Thank you everyone for the feedback, and well wishes.

[Kerick]

Yeah I've tried vac u forming a long time ago and that's pretty much what I experienced. I think the mold was too tall and too pointed. If it was cut into halves it might work better.
Drilling out the wood mold to add weight might be a good solution too.
Carry on! This is too good to stop now!

[The Rat]

Keep going with this. We see a crapload of napkinwaffe all over the modeling community, but, in my opinion, not enough Allied46.