Author Topic: Bristol Bergen I  (Read 15704 times)

Offline Acree

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Bristol Bergen I
« on: February 20, 2017, 05:59:30 AM »
This is my second Floaty GB project, and much more complex than the Pelican, so it may take till the end of the GB. 

In 1936, government officials in Norway were beginning to become concerned over rising tensions within Europe, and set in place an armament build-up scheme which included new aircraft for both the Army and Navy.  Naval air leaders were well aware that a new torpedo bomber and patrol aircraft was needed to replace the Douglas DT-2 and Hover MF-11 biplanes that then constituted the striking power of the Naval Air Arm.  Having studied several designs, and weighing capability, cost, and availability, they eventually contracted with Bristols to purchase a manufacturing license for a naval floatplane variant of the then-new Blenheim bomber.  The new development was renamed the Bristol Bergen and included twin floats and other naval equipment, and the ability to carry one Mk XI aerial torpedo, or 1200 pounds of bombs. 

Bergen1 by cacree, on Flickr

Bergen2 by cacree, on Flickr

Offline kitnut617

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2017, 07:12:36 AM »
some inspiration for you, I started one some time ago before I had a house move, it's still packed away somewhere

Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2017, 07:26:55 AM »
thanks Kitnut.  I had all these photos, but the drawing will be very helpful.  Mine is, of course, based on a Mk I, and the floats are not Edo's, but I do want to emulate the strut layout from the Bolingbroke floatplane. 

FYI, my floats are from a Ju 52/3m See, but will portray Norwegian-designed original floats

Offline kitnut617

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2017, 07:52:39 AM »
here's the other part of the drawing for you, I got these from John Adams of Aeroclub

Offline apophenia

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2017, 07:54:35 AM »
Great concept. Watching with interest  :)
Froglord: "10,000 years has the world stood still, awaiting the frog
Arise from the swamp and become what you are, amphibian god."

Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2017, 09:31:12 AM »
Making some slow progress here.  The closing up of the main undercarriage openings is complete (at least until primer shows me otherwise)...
Bergen3 by cacree, on Flickr

I'm having serious difficulty with the nose glazing.  Having read reviews and seen completed builds with beautiful noses, I was VERY disappointed to find one of the nose transparencies badly warped...
Bergen warp by cacree, on Flickr
Since this photo was taken I have soaked the offending part in boiling water and bent it into a shape that will fit the port fuselage portion, but when I try to put the two sub-assemblies together, the fit is terrible.  I'm still working out how to fix it.  Any suggestions would be welcome...

Offline kitnut617

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2017, 11:05:36 AM »
Contact Airfix maybe ---  ???

Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2017, 04:06:18 PM »
Well, I snapped it!

I have sent an e-mail to Hornby USA, but there is a big notice on their website: "If your enquiry is regarding parts and spares please note we do not currently hold stock of any Airfix spare parts."  So, I'm not especially hopeful.  In the meantime, I have ordered a new Blenheim I, and if I get a spare part, I'll use it to replace the one I raid from the new kit.   If not, I'll figure out a more radical WHIF for the new kit that involves a new nose (trimotor Blenheim, maybe?).




Offline tankmodeler

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2017, 02:47:17 AM »
Got any friends with vacuforms? They could make you one lickety split.

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2017, 02:48:35 AM »
You could also change the concept to a solid nose from glazed. Put several 20mm canon in there and go with a pilot released torpedo. Not unlike an avenger or Devastator.

Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2017, 02:57:48 AM »
That would work if it was based on a Mk IV nose, but this is a Mk. I, so the nose is the pilot's windscreen.  I do have a new kit on the way, though, so, problem solved, at least until I start sussing out what to do with the new kit with a bad nose!  I have a sneaky little idea rattling around in my head for that, related to the upcoming retro-futuristic build (hint - laser-equipped Blenheim, anyone?). 

Offline apophenia

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2017, 05:51:17 AM »
Well, I snapped it! ... I'll figure out a more radical WHIF for the new kit that involves a new nose (trimotor Blenheim, maybe?).

Ouch  :o  Does anyone know if the Falcon vacuform canopy for the old Frog Mk.I (Clear-Vax set 8 ) would fit the new Airfix kit?

I do like your trimotor Blenheim concept, though  ;)
« Last Edit: March 03, 2017, 12:10:34 PM by apophenia »
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Offline kitnut617

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2017, 07:12:56 AM »
ok one of the Falcon canopy sets has a Mk.1 canopy. I'm fairly sure they have it seperate too,
« Last Edit: March 03, 2017, 08:00:09 AM by kitnut617 »

Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2017, 07:34:30 AM »
thanks, Kitnut!  I'll check into that.  Even if I had to modify the kit significantly, I am willing to do that for a future build, so well worth the try. 

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2017, 08:09:35 AM »
Falcon set #8, RAF bombers part #1

Offline apophenia

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2017, 12:11:48 PM »
Falcon set #8, RAF bombers part #1

Thanks for that kitnut ... if I'd proofed my post, I'd have noticed my 8 + ) code glitch  :P
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Offline kitnut617

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2017, 07:37:14 PM »
Falcon set #8, RAF bombers part #1

Thanks for that kitnut ... if I'd proofed my post, I'd have noticed my 8 + ) code glitch  :P

No worries, I had missed what you had posted too  -----

Mind you, that Airfix Mk.1 looks quite tasty ---- might have to pick one (or two) up if I see them at the LMS. I've got the Modelcraft ex-Frog Mk.1 kit which actually has two complete kits in the box (which is why I know there's a vacuform canopy for it, the ones on the box are not very good)
« Last Edit: March 03, 2017, 07:40:17 PM by kitnut617 »

Offline apophenia

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #17 on: March 04, 2017, 03:47:52 AM »
There seems to have been a lot of re-issues/re-brandings of that ex-Frog Mk.1 (an excellent kit for its day).

No doubt someone has plans for a vacuform canopy for the new Airfix kit(s). Of course, that doesn't help Acree in the short-term ... go trimotor Blenheim  :)
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Arise from the swamp and become what you are, amphibian god."

Offline Claymore

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #18 on: March 04, 2017, 04:52:45 PM »
How's about doing something like this with the second canopy-less Mk I model, with a Hurricane or Spitfire on top?

« Last Edit: March 04, 2017, 10:39:18 PM by Claymore »
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Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #19 on: March 05, 2017, 01:52:05 AM »
VERY interesting idea!!  Thanks!

Offline Claymore

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #20 on: March 05, 2017, 01:58:07 AM »
VERY interesting idea!!  Thanks!

You are most welcome.  Really looking forward to seeing the Bergen come to life.
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Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #21 on: March 07, 2017, 01:30:07 PM »
The Bergen is back on track!  My newly ordered Blenheim IF kit arrived yesterday and I lost no time checking and assembling the nose parts. I'm quite happy with the look, though there is a very slight ridge to the nose where there is a very minor mismatch in pieces.  But I think it will be easily remedied during final finish and paint. 
Bergen 5 by cacree, on Flickr
Bergen 5 by cacree, on Flickr
Bergen 5 by cacree, on Flickr

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #22 on: March 09, 2017, 04:27:21 AM »
If it's not already glued into place, you could mount the two halves of the windscreen so as to eliminate the step (which it likely to be a b!tch to get rid of otherwise) and then use some .005" - .010" strip to fill the small gap at the back of the cockpit.

Paul

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #23 on: March 09, 2017, 04:34:22 AM »
BTW, are you thinking of using a pair of narrow struts and bracing wires as with the actual floatplane version or a mono-strut float with no wires? The latter will be a lot cleaner aerodynamically.

Also, you could semi-recess the torpedo in the underside. That would produce a really slick looking and purpose-built torpedo bomber.

If you had a spare Defiant turret laying about, that wold really make it look like a purpose-built variant.  ;)

Paul

Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #24 on: March 09, 2017, 08:00:09 AM »
BTW, are you thinking of using a pair of narrow struts and bracing wires as with the actual floatplane version or a mono-strut float with no wires? The latter will be a lot cleaner aerodynamically.

Also, you could semi-recess the torpedo in the underside. That would produce a really slick looking and purpose-built torpedo bomber.

If you had a spare Defiant turret laying about, that wold really make it look like a purpose-built variant.  ;)

Paul

I plan on a float mounting very similar to the Bolingbroke's (though not exactly the same).  I will externally mount the torpedo, thus preserving the bombay for use with regular gravity bombs. 

Although I like some of your ideas, I am not creating an "improved" Blenheim, merely a straight adaptation to Norwegian torpedo bomber needs. 
That being said, I am enjoying this kit so much (despite the warped canopy) that I am considering all sorts of mods (e.g., French license built version with French engines... maybe even inlines).  And I am definitely doing the "Mistel" equivalent Claymore suggested.  If it fits the rules, I'll do that for the drone/UAV GB. 

Thanks for the suggestions - I really appreciate them, even if I don't use them right at the time. 

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #25 on: March 10, 2017, 01:52:07 AM »
I plan on a float mounting very similar to the Bolingbroke's (though not exactly the same).  I will externally mount the torpedo, thus preserving the bombay for use with regular gravity bombs. 

If a torpedo was mounted semi-recessed, the recesses could also hold bombs instead of retaining the bomb bay, just line them up one behind the other. It would also allow larger bombs to be carried than could fit in the existing bay.

Quote
Although I like some of your ideas, I am not creating an "improved" Blenheim, merely a straight adaptation to Norwegian torpedo bomber needs. 
Given that the Bolingbroke on floats didn't go into production and was a Canadian prototype, one could easily surmise that Bristol Aircraft, in England, might have gone with a more unitary float if it went into production.

Form your point of view as the modeller, I was looking for a rational excuse to use a single strut float as it's bound to be easier to build and get even than a canted and wire braced set of floats.  ;)

Quote
Thanks for the suggestions - I really appreciate them, even if I don't use them right at the time.

No problem. I got all kinds of ideas that I give away for free. I hardly ever think anyone will use them.  ;D

Looking forward to how this will turn out.

Paul

Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #26 on: March 10, 2017, 06:34:14 AM »
A single-strut (pylon) float attachment would certainly be easier from a modelling standpoint, and I LOVE the look (ever since I first saw a photo of an N-3PB). But I think the multi-strut arrangement is more in line with my vision for this particular WHIF, and I am looking forward to the challenge.  I think I have figured out how to make it "easy" (relatively speaking) - we'll see if that bears out!  I will post photos and comments as I go.

 

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #27 on: March 10, 2017, 11:01:21 AM »
Some time ago I bought a couple of packets of this product, it would greatly help you with the struts and such

https://www.aviationmegastore.com/struts-tube-rod-for-the-smaller-biplane-con004-contrail-models-pl4-various-conversions/product/?action=prodinfo&art=5508

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #28 on: March 10, 2017, 07:08:41 PM »
Some time ago I bought a couple of packets of this product, it would greatly help you with the struts and such

https://www.aviationmegastore.com/struts-tube-rod-for-the-smaller-biplane-con004-contrail-models-pl4-various-conversions/product/?action=prodinfo&art=5508


I just checked the Contrails online store and this product is nolonger listed/available.
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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #29 on: March 10, 2017, 07:32:48 PM »
Some time ago I bought a couple of packets of this product, it would greatly help you with the struts and such

https://www.aviationmegastore.com/struts-tube-rod-for-the-smaller-biplane-con004-contrail-models-pl4-various-conversions/product/?action=prodinfo&art=5508


I just checked the Contrails online store and this product is nolonger listed/available.


I looked there but I didn't get it from them, I'm sure I got it from Aeroclub who used to produce it. It was acquired by John Adams from the original Contrail Models (note no 's' on the end of Contrail)
« Last Edit: March 10, 2017, 07:35:32 PM by kitnut617 »

Offline The Big Gimper

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #30 on: March 10, 2017, 07:46:57 PM »
Some time ago I bought a couple of packets of this product, it would greatly help you with the struts and such

https://www.aviationmegastore.com/struts-tube-rod-for-the-smaller-biplane-con004-contrail-models-pl4-various-conversions/product/?action=prodinfo&art=5508


I just checked the Contrails online store and this product is nolonger listed/available.


I looked there but I didn't get it from them, I'm sure I got it from Aeroclub who used to produce it. It was acquired by John Adams from the original Contrail Models (note no 's' on the end of Contrail)


Bad grammar on my end Robert. I forgot the apostrophe.  :(
Work in progress ::

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Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen - Finished
« Reply #31 on: March 25, 2017, 02:47:29 PM »
I ran into a few setbacks along the way, but overall I am quite happy with how it turned out.  Enjoy!

Bergen by cacree, on Flickr
Bergen by cacree, on Flickr
Bergen by cacree, on Flickr
Bergen by cacree, on Flickr
Bergen by cacree, on Flickr
Bergen by cacree, on Flickr
Bergen by cacree, on Flickr

Offline Claymore

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #32 on: March 25, 2017, 03:51:38 PM »
Nice, very nice indeed!  :)
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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #33 on: March 25, 2017, 06:41:00 PM »
Wow what a stunner! Sure looks great up on floats and those neat Norwegian markings are the cherry on top!

Well done!

Brian da Basher

Offline AXOR

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Re: Bristol Bergen - Finished
« Reply #34 on: March 25, 2017, 07:56:29 PM »
I ran into a few setbacks along the way, but overall I am quite happy with how it turned out.  Enjoy!
You have reasons to be satisfied,this is an excellent result !
Alex

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #35 on: March 25, 2017, 09:04:45 PM »
Got to echo everyone else's comments ---  :) :) :)   that looks terrific!

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #36 on: March 25, 2017, 09:10:35 PM »
Bad grammar on my end Robert. I forgot the apostrophe.  :(

No worries Carl, it's actually two different companies. Contrail Models was a vacuform kit outfit way back when (1970 with owner the renown Gordon Sutcliffe), the outfit that calls itself Contrails Models is a newer one. I've dealt with them a couple of times.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2017, 12:36:34 AM by kitnut617 »

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #37 on: March 26, 2017, 12:26:58 AM »
Great build & the markings are very different! :) :)
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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #38 on: March 26, 2017, 03:52:20 AM »
Damn fine work!
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Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #39 on: March 26, 2017, 10:20:49 AM »
Thanks, all!  I truly appreciate the encouragement!

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #40 on: March 26, 2017, 08:13:23 PM »
A wonderful WHIF!!!
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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #41 on: March 28, 2017, 12:11:45 AM »
Id does look the business, to be sure. The floats all lined up well, too. That must have been tricky.

Offline Acree

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #42 on: March 28, 2017, 03:27:14 AM »
Id does look the business, to be sure. The floats all lined up well, too. That must have been tricky.
Properly aligning the floats was one of my biggest concerns.  I built a cardboard jig to hold the plane and the floats in proper alignment.  But I found this to not be a workable solution for two reasons: first, I could not keep the cardboard rigid enough to stay aligned - I really needed to build it out of something more rigid like glued plastic or word or even metal (like an Erector set). Second, Once the parts were in the jig, I could not get my fat hands in there to place the struts. 

So, I in the end, I carefully marked the 16 places where the strut met the airframe or floats and cut strut-shaped holes.  I then put the struts in without glue, and manipulated everything until I got the position I wanted, then added gap-filling CA glue that flowed into the joints.  Once the first float was permanently mounted in this way, I did the same thing with the other float - getting the alignment by a combination of measuring and "eyeballing" them. 

 

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #43 on: March 28, 2017, 04:45:44 AM »
Nothing beats the Mark 1 eyeball for detailed work like this.
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Offline KiwiZac

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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #44 on: March 29, 2017, 03:54:04 AM »
I do enjoy, very very much! Gorgeous work!
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Re: Bristol Bergen I
« Reply #45 on: March 29, 2017, 10:41:42 PM »
Properly aligning the floats was one of my biggest concerns. 
See??? That's why I suggested the mono-strut!   ;D

Really, you did a great job on that tricky task.

Paul

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Re: Bristol Bergen - Finished
« Reply #46 on: March 30, 2017, 06:51:17 AM »
I ran into a few setbacks along the way, but overall I am quite happy with how it turned out.  Enjoy!

Oh my! I was expecting great things but that is truly lovely  :-*
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Arise from the swamp and become what you are, amphibian god."

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Re: Bristol Bergen - Finished
« Reply #47 on: March 30, 2017, 09:42:39 AM »
I ran into a few setbacks along the way, but overall I am quite happy with how it turned out.  Enjoy!

Oh my! I was expecting great things but that is truly lovely  :-*

One of those 'just right' builds