Author Topic: Apophenia's Offerings  (Read 905304 times)

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2275 on: August 07, 2019, 04:27:01 AM »
Thanks folks.

Greg: I love William Pearce stuff! I used the Zeta on one of my Macchi variants. But the Delta was definitely the AMI's darling ... maybe they just had a lot of them stockpiled from wartime production? Dunno.

So, will we be seeing a Reggiane equivalent of the Fiat G.59?   I quite enjoy your evolution so far.

 ;)

Reggiane Resurgent? - The Re.2005 Nuevo

The Officine Meccaniche Italiane "Reggiane" also tried to resurrect the Re.2005 itself. Initially, the concept - the Reggiane Re.2005N (Nuevo) differed little from the wartime fighter. The Re.2005N faltered due to inadequate AMI stocks of Fiat RA.1050 Tifone inverted V-12 engines. As with Fiat's G.59, a redesign was undertaken to accomodate a Merlin engine - then in AMI service with both Spitfire and P-51 Mustang fighters. This aircraft was re-designated Reggiane Re.2020.

Merlin Reggiane - the Re.2020

The prototype Re.2020A/0 was fitted with a Rolls-Royce Merlin 66 (taken from a Spitfire F.Mk.IX) driving a 4-bladed Rotol propeller. It was intended that the production fighter would be powered by a Packard Merlin T.24-2 driving an Aeroproducts propeller. An alternative powerplant was a Rolls-Royce Merlin 500-20 driving a 4-bladed Rotol propeller. Later, when surplus USAAF Packard V-1650-7s became available in Europe, that Merlin - driving a Hamilton-Standard prop - became a third engine option.

With the adoption of the Merlin, all fixed armament had to be wing-mounted. Armament options are listed with the proposed Re.2020 lineage (below):

Re.2020 - Single-seat fighter or advanced fighter-trainer
 - Re.2020A/0: Prototype, 1 x Rolls-Royce Merlin 66 V-12
 -- 2 x synchronized 12.7 mm Breda-SAFAT mgs, 2 x wing-mounted MG 151/20 cannons
 - Re.2020A/1: (Project) Merlin T.24-2, 4 x 12.7 mm Breda-SAFAT mgs
 - Re.2020A/2: (Project) Fighter-trainer, 2 x 12.7 mm Breda-SAFAT mgs
 - Re.2020A/3: (Project) 4 x 20 mm Hispano-Suiza HS.404 cannons
 - Re.2020A/4: (Project) Export, 4 x 12.7 mm Browning machine guns
 - Re.2020A/5: (Project) Export, 4 x 20 mm Mauser MG 151/20 cannons
________________________________________________________________

BTW: The original idea for these Reggiane developments was for the Out-of-Africa GB but they got replaced by something more plausible. As with the Re.2010s, these sideviews sprang off from an Angelo Brioschi Re.2005 profile.
Froglord: "... amphibious doom descends ... approach the alter and swear your allegiance to the swamp."

Offline elmayerle

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2276 on: August 07, 2019, 05:36:07 AM »
Very nice!!  Shifting to a more Mustang-style radiator installation?  This promises to be an interesting set of developments and 'twill be interesting to see what models get exported and to what countries.

Offline kitnut617

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2277 on: August 07, 2019, 06:17:32 AM »
It would be interesting to see what that would look like with a raised cockpit, say about a foot higher ---  ;)

Offline Inactive

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Reggiane 2001 Delta - The Real Bird & Italian Wings/Sword Conversion Model
« Reply #2278 on: August 07, 2019, 09:21:22 AM »




Offline GTX_Admin

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2279 on: August 08, 2019, 02:33:01 AM »
What about a RR Griffon-engined variant?
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Offline Brian da Basher

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2280 on: August 08, 2019, 05:30:18 AM »


Very nice!!  Shifting to a more Mustang-style radiator installation? 
<snip>


It's like if you asked Sergio Leone to make you a Mustang!

Wonderfully imaginative, apophenia!

Brian da Basher
« Last Edit: August 08, 2019, 05:43:29 AM by Brian da Basher »

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2281 on: August 09, 2019, 05:18:59 AM »
Thanks folks!

Retired In Kalifornia - Excellent rendition of the Re.2001 Delta  :smiley:

What about a RR Griffon-engined variant?


Thought about that but then got distracted by the Out of Africa GB:
http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=8683.msg158222#msg158222
Froglord: "... amphibious doom descends ... approach the alter and swear your allegiance to the swamp."

Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2282 on: August 12, 2019, 07:33:34 PM »
Beautiful Merlin Reggianne!

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2283 on: August 13, 2019, 02:57:57 AM »
Cheers!  For Merlin and Griffon Fiats, see here:

http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=8683.msg158283#msg158283
Froglord: "... amphibious doom descends ... approach the alter and swear your allegiance to the swamp."

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2284 on: August 20, 2019, 04:45:18 AM »
This is an unbuilt project turned whif. The Bell Model 11 was a pursuit/interceptor concept of circa 1938-39. It seems to have been an unrequested submission to the USAAC but I'm not sure whether it was meant to answer a particular specification or not.

The Bell Model 4 Airacobra had been ordered as the XP-39 in October 1937 and a prototype was due to fly in April 1939. However, no series had been issued in late 1938 and perhaps Bell was getting nervous. Bell's object in designing the Model 11 must have been to offer a simpler, lighter alternative to the P-39. Overall, the Model 11 gives the feel of an American Bf 109 analogue.

The top view is based on Bell Aircraft's 3-view general arrangment Drawing 111/1001 of 06 July 1939. On the copy I have, the specs are hard to read but seem to say 1,040 hp (but probably 1,050 hp) Allison V-1710 V-12; weight 4,352 lbs (empty), 5,585 lbs (gross); length 26' ?"; wing span 30' 0"; wing area 160.5 sq ft; Section NACA 21-C3 (root), NACA 27-104 (tip). No details are shown for a retracted undercarriage ... so I guessed (based on the odd leg placement and a 'swollen' inner wing profile). There's no real indication of intakes for carb or cooling (I'm guessing P-39-style rads  buried in the wings, oil coolers may be in lower cowling, but carburettor ...?).

The bottom view is a Bell P-45B - my whif of what the Bell Model 11 might have looked like in service. Some changes have been incorporated from the XP-45 above. First, stability was enhanced by increasing wing diherdral [1] and balance improved by moving some of the consumable fuel into the wing. That was possible by relocating the coolant rads into a belly fairing (based upon that of the Curtiss XP-46). Armament has been increased to four .50-calibre Brownings - two synchronized and two in the outer wings. [2] A P-40-style carburettor intake has been added between the cowl guns for the V-1710-33.

I also modified the cockpit canopy in shape and to a sliding type. Partly this was to increase the opening size, incorporate a glass-armour windscreen, and to just look slightly more like an Airacobra ;)  Too late, I realized I'd created problems with the markings. Anyone care to guess what they are?
__________________________________________

[1] I've also rounded the tips Airacobra-style in place of the original Model 11's tips which were 'clipped' on an angle.

[2] I'm assuming that the original Model 11 would have had the usual pre-WW2 USAAC pursuit armament of one .30-cal and one .50.
Froglord: "... amphibious doom descends ... approach the alter and swear your allegiance to the swamp."

Offline elmayerle

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2285 on: August 20, 2019, 06:58:07 AM »
Beautiful!!  I can't help but wonder if the original concept drawing had the carburetor airflow coming from a NACA-scoop on the top cowling; it would work but it wouldn't necessarily be as efficient as needed.

Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2286 on: August 20, 2019, 09:41:05 AM »
Anyone care to guess what they are?

From a point of pure ignorance, I'm going to guess that you had to move the markings below the rear cockpit glazing back & up to get them off of the canopy rails.
"This is the Captain. We have a little problem with our engine sequence, so we may experience some slight turbulence and, ah, explode."

Offline Brian da Basher

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2287 on: August 20, 2019, 04:55:20 PM »
Anyone care to guess what they are?

From a point of pure ignorance, I'm going to guess that you had to move the markings below the rear cockpit glazing back & up to get them off of the canopy rails.

That'd be my guess too after confirming the number of rudder stripes (13) are correct. That's the most typical inter-war USAAC markings "miss".

What a beauty and it's not hard to imagine this on the flight-line! Well done apophenia! You always seem to top yourself with each new creation!

Brian da Basher

Offline jcf

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2288 on: August 21, 2019, 12:58:29 PM »
Diameter of the circle, thus the size of the star.
“Conspiracy theory’s got to be simple.
Sense doesn’t come into it. People are
more scared of how complicated shit
actually is than they ever are about
whatever’s supposed to be behind the
conspiracy.”
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Offline Small brown dog

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2289 on: August 21, 2019, 06:28:19 PM »
I have stumbled on to your stuff from time to time and never, until now, got a chance to say how much I admire it.

"Wingless Wonders" (Part 1)

Sensibly, Small Brown Dog doesn't sweat the technical details too much. I don't quite understand those details which are provided, so I've just made up my own ...


I will explain more in a new topic

PS, I screwed up the quote thing  - oops :(
« Last Edit: August 21, 2019, 06:41:06 PM by SBD »
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Offline Old Wombat

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2290 on: August 21, 2019, 11:27:05 PM »
It's cool, SBD, the "quote" thing can be a touch tricky on this site. For some reason it won't let me add a quote once I'm in the reply box but it will allow me to start a reply by clicking quote.

It's all too techmamologimacle for me! :-\
"This is the Captain. We have a little problem with our engine sequence, so we may experience some slight turbulence and, ah, explode."

Offline Small brown dog

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2291 on: August 21, 2019, 11:32:44 PM »
It's cool, SBD, the "quote" thing can be a touch tricky on this site. For some reason it won't let me add a quote once I'm in the reply box but it will allow me to start a reply by clicking quote.

It's all too techmamologimacle for me! :-\

hang on.... I think I got it - yeehaaaa
Its not that its not real but it could be that its not true.

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2292 on: August 22, 2019, 02:54:38 AM »
Cheers folks!

Evan: I like your NACA scoop intake idea. It may not have been as efficient, but it sure would've looked cool  :smiley:

Markings: I must admit that I didn't give too much thought to the exact placement of the fuselage roundel ... or a specified diameter. (I really must dig out my copies of Dana Bell's Air Force Colors books!)

I based my P-45B at Rekyavik sometime after the US took over the defence of Iceland in mid-1941. But the red 'dot' wasn't ordered removed from USAAF roundels until 28 May 1942  :P  I suspect that fuselage roundels may not have been worn at that time in any case ... fortunately, its a whif :)

SBD: Welcome aboard Small Brown Dog! I've admired your work too. And by 'admired', of course, I mean that I've stolen your concepts shamelessly  :-[
Froglord: "... amphibious doom descends ... approach the alter and swear your allegiance to the swamp."

Offline Small brown dog

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2293 on: August 22, 2019, 03:28:57 AM »
SBD: Welcome aboard Small Brown Dog! I've admired your work too. And by 'admired', of course, I mean that I've stolen your concepts shamelessly  :-[

I saw my name come up in a search actually because I was looking for some git on Flickr or something that has stolen a pic and renamed it but in so doing I found this place. I have no problem with "borrowing" as A: you give credit and  B: your skills and imagination are several light years ahead of needing to steal stuff. However, having gone off on your own story line re the tech I figured I best sort that out :)
I was building a website for all this but to be honest I can't be bothered because I have had a gut full of web development in the past. Besides, this seems like the ideal place to put the content ;)
« Last Edit: August 22, 2019, 03:32:11 AM by SBD »
Its not that its not real but it could be that its not true.

Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2294 on: August 24, 2019, 05:38:12 AM »
... I was building a website for all this but to be honest I can't be bothered because I have had a gut full of web development in the past. Besides, this seems like the ideal place to put the content ;)

It is indeed. And no need for SEO, we on the lunatic fringe are already here  ;D
_____________________

With this next one, I spun off on the idea of the Bell Model 11 being inspired by the Bf 109. That involved a  Messerschmitt-style main undercarriage (instead of Bell's odd-to-me landing gear approach). And, of course, nothings says Messerschmitt like an inverted V-12. So, in went the Continental IV-1430 'Hyper' powerplant.

The XP-45 Hypercobra' prototype shows a standard Continental IV-1430 engine with no armament fitted. Compared with my first go at a Model 11, this one has a more P-51A-style belly radiator. As shown, an updraught carburettor is fed by a chin intake flanked by twin oil coolers. Planned armament for the production P-45A was a 25 mm motor-cannon and twin synchronized .50-calibre machine guns. However, insoluable feed problems led to the abandonment of that cannon.

The production P-45B was armed with only the two machine guns. Although it's not tremendously obvious, the rear fuselage has also been extended - mainly to better balance that long nose. This fighter is having temporary, water-based paint 'Red Force' markings applied for the November 1941 Carolina Maneuvers. The red spinner tip is a squadron colour (for the 35th Pursuit Squadron) as is the fuselage Command Band indicating that this is the 'A' Flight Leader's aircraft.

Permanent national markings are as per Air Corps Board Specification 24114 of October 1940 - with less glossy roundels on the fuselage side, underside of port wing, and upper side of starboard wing. Tail stripes have been omitted. 'US Army' is painted on the wings' underside with Insignia Blue paint and Individual Aircraft Number ('4') and squadron designator ('31P') painted on the fins (albeit, in lo-viz black rather than the specified yellow).

Cannon armament would not appear until the P-45C model. There, the main armament was a 20 mm Browning M12 - a reinforced M2 gun firing 20 mm Oerlikon shells from necked .50-calibre cartridges.
Froglord: "... amphibious doom descends ... approach the alter and swear your allegiance to the swamp."

Offline Brian da Basher

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2295 on: August 24, 2019, 08:11:51 AM »
It's a great treat to see another chapter in this wonderful concept, apophenia!

I really like your alternate USAAC markings which I could see being used for war games (I think what passed for OpFor used red crosses IRL).

Don't be too surprised if you don't see me do a take on this in styrene some day.

Excellent art work and you've got me looking forward to chapter three!

Brian da Basher

Offline Small brown dog

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2296 on: August 24, 2019, 05:04:06 PM »

It is indeed. And no need for SEO, we on the lunatic fringe are already here  ;D

We must all do our utmost to stay away from being normal  ;)

Re the XP45.
I like this, it has a certain sleek horniness that appeals greatly.
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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2297 on: August 25, 2019, 02:19:09 AM »
I'm kind of surprised you didn't go for a 37 mm M4 cannon ala P-39.
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Offline apophenia

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2298 on: August 25, 2019, 07:10:22 AM »
Cheers folks! And Brian, I'd love to see any of the Model 11s (mine or those old-timey guys from Buffalo) rendered in styrene!

Greg: My first thought was the M4 too. But the Model 11 is quite a bit smaller that the Airacobra. To make the 37 mm gun work, the canopy had to be move quite far back. A rough version look okay but a bit too D.520 for my taste.
_________________________________

The Hype Around 'Hyper' Engines

It was fairly obvious early on that the Continental IV-1430 - and the 'Hyper' engine programme generally - was never going to match planners' expectations. The only realistic engine alternative was the bigger V-1710-37 from Allison. Unfortunately, this upright V-12 could not accommodate a motor gun. Armament was going to be a challenge.

The engine change dictated other changes compared with the P-45C and Bell took advantage of shared British intelligence on an early Messerschmitt Bf 109F-1 model shot down over the UK. Since the Allison engine would require a new coolant system, Of most interest was Messerschmitt's refined, wing-mounted radiators. These were copied and applied experimentally to a P-45B airframe. With the aerodynamic success of the wing radiator installation proven, these were adopted for the P-45G - the first Allison-powered model. With the original, underslung radiator housing removed, the P-45G could now carry a belly rack for bombs or an external fuel tank.

Armament for the P-45G consisted of four Browning M2 machine guns, all synchronized to fire through the propeller disc. Compared with the prototype XP-45G - a P-45B conversion - the production fighter suffered from weight increase due to added operational equipment. This was addressed with the P-45H which reduced armament to only two guns and had some equipment minaturized to save weight. It was not clear what the P-45H's role would be within USAAF strategy but it was decided to employ these somewhat unwanted fighters to replace Seversky P-35s in the Phillipines.

When war came, it turned out that the lightweight P-45Hs could better 'mix it' with Japanese fighters than could the offical favorite - the Curtiss P-40. As a result, Bell was asked to proceed with its planned improvement. These included yet another fuselage stretch - this one accommplished by simply shifting the rudder post aft. A more noticeable change addressed long-standing USAAF complaints about the claustrophobic hinged cockpit canopy. This was replaced by a new, slightly higher, sliding canopy matched with a more generous rear glazing.

With the appearance of the Allison V-1710-39 with a higher thrust line, Bell proposed that the twin gun armament be shifted to a low position on the cowling. The USAAF studied the concept as the P-45K but this proposal was not accepted. Bell Aircraft turned its attention to other projects and, ultimately, built large numbers of the successful P-51 Mustang under license to North American.


Froglord: "... amphibious doom descends ... approach the alter and swear your allegiance to the swamp."

Offline Brian da Basher

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Re: Apophenia's Offerings
« Reply #2299 on: August 25, 2019, 09:19:37 PM »
Those are some exceptional incarnations on the theme and bring to mind a far sleeker, more streamlined A-36 Apache.



Your work is always a delightful feast for the eyes, apophenia!

You've already got me looking forward to the next installment.

Brian da Basher