Lockheed P-3 Orion Ideas and Inspiration

[Rickshaw]

Are there any pictures of RAAF P-3s carrying that much iron around?

[GTX_Admin]

I have seen at least one photo - can't find it though.  Probably saw it during RAAF days.

[GTX_Admin]

I have often thought of doing a RAAF AEW P-3 based on this:



…which was originally a RAAF P-3 anyway.

[GTX_Admin]

Some by SC:

[GTX_Admin]

The Kiwis have to have the coolest (in every sense of the word) operating location for their Orions:

[The Big Gimper]

The Kiwis have to have the coolest (in every sense of the word) operating location for their Orions:

Is that Mt Erogenous in the background? 

[GTX_Admin]

Errr…I think you might mean Mt Erebus

[The Big Gimper]

Errr…I think you might mean Mt Erebus

Just checking if you are paying attention.   

[GTX_Admin]

oh, don't worry…any mention of Erogenous zones will get my attention

[Daryl J.]

At the model show put on by IPMS Pearson Modeleers in Vancouver, WA several years ago, we got talking about the Orion.  I shared something a high school friend of mine had done in Orions to flush subs.  This man literally jumped up and sternly ordered me to stop talking and never say that again startling the buhjeezus out of us.   It turns out he was an Orion Captain and I had just spilled something no one is to know about. 

But, conversation switched from 'I wonder', 'I've heard' and 'I suppose' to all kinds of Orion facts. What a machine!  It was a great hour.   

And now back to regular programming.

[GTX_Admin]

Oh, the stories I could share re Orions…if only allowed.

[GTX_Admin]

KP-3B I did ages ago:

[Volkodav]

The Orion was a bit of a missed opportunity for the RAAF.  We had the B airframes and a need for AEW, tactical tanking, additional fisheries surveillance (now Border Protection) training and additional transport.  The Bs could have filled all of those roles from the mid 80s onward and then gone on to be replaced by similarly configured 737s, ah what could have been.

[GTX_Admin]

A bit of an interesting one here - mention of possible Vietnamese P-3 Orion…

US eases arms embargo on Vietnam amid China's maritime expansion
ATSUSHI TOMIYAMA, Nikkei staff writer
October 4, 2014 5:33 am JST

HANOI -- The U.S. government on Thursday relaxed an arms embargo on Vietnam, which likely lobbied for the move to boost its naval capabilities as territorial disputes with China heat up.

No details have been confirmed on the specific weapons Vietnam will acquire from the U.S., but state-owned media here has suggested the P-3 Orion surveillance planes, among other equipment and devices.

The Chinese navy owns about 10 times as many vessels as its Vietnamese counterpart. For example, China owns almost 70 submarines, while Vietnam counts just two.

In addition, over 95% of Vietnam's weapons are Russian-made and generally inferior to those manufactured in the U.S. and other Western countries. Many outdated models are still in commission as well, and modernizing equipment had become a pressing issue for its military.

Vietnam is also concerned that Russia, its biggest arms provider, is pivoting toward China as relations with the West break down over the Ukraine crisis.

But many note that Vietnam does not yet have the capability to use advanced weapons. It likely plans to first import weaponry related to maritime security and train personnel on highly advanced Western equipment, then branch out to other armaments such as fighter jets and helicopters.

he U.S. has not exported arms to Vietnam in about 40 years. The partial lifting of the embargo could signal further developments in their relations, which have improved steadily since they normalized ties in 1995. The Southeast Asian country is also a potential ally in the Trans-Pacific Partnership, a planned economic framework headed by the U.S.

Vietnamese President Truong Tan Sang had told former U.S. President Bill Clinton in July that easing the embargo would be an important demonstration of mutual trust and the full normalization of bilateral ties.

Hanoi has also invited U.S. President Barack Obama to visit next year for the 20th anniversary of the bilateral accord, and could be preparing policy measures to attract U.S. investment in the country.

Source

[elmayerle]

KP-3B I did ages ago:

Nice!  two pods, 1 under each wing?  If you were only going with one refueling drogue, I'd mount the pod in the weapons bay with only the drogue out in the airctream.

[GTX_Admin]

Agreed.  This one envisaged a pod under each wing.

[elmayerle]

Agreed.  This one envisaged a pod under each wing.

removeable auxiliary tank in the weapons bay for added capacity?  You'd add a touch of weight with the plumbing that would stay with the aircraft, but everything else would be removeable.

Thought for a simple P-3 whif upgrade, the same props and engines as the C-130J and C-27J.

For a nasty bit of SEAD, some of the EP-3E's sensors (you might not want the "M&M" antenna mounted in the weapons bay, but the other fairing would work) combined with suitable ARMs.

[GTX_Admin]

Thought for a simple P-3 whif upgrade, the same props and engines as the C-130j and C-27J.

That's basically what was proposed with the "Orion 2000":

 

I recall discussing such options with the LM FSR back when I was with 92WG.  I still recall him saying that after the 'fun' experienced with the C-130J (e.g. the vicious stall characteristics etc), they were extremely wary of trying such a "simple engine/prop change" with the P-3.

[elmayerle]

Hmm, I can understand that.  Oh, BTW, the picture isn't showing.

Still, in the whif-verse it's perfectly plausible.  The Lockheed P-7 was supposed to be a stretched and improved P-3 with new engines; only the stretches ended up turning it into an entirely new aircraft and the cost went well above what the USN had signed for, so that program was cancelled.  I wonder if the propulsion portion (GE T407 turboprops driving 5-bladed propellers) of that could be applied to a "stock" P-3.




Note: A bit more googling shows that an improved version of the T407 is the GE38 that will power the CH-53K (roughly a 25% increase over what was intended for the P-7A).  I could see a flat-rated version of that engine and a more modern propeller used to upgrade P-3s, particularly variants that need more power than the T56 supplies.

[jcf]

The pic from Greg's post:

[Gingie]

We're sending some CP-140's to Kuwait to spy on ISIL....would be an interesting WHIF in desert cam and maybe armed with something more than optics.

[Volkodav]

A gunship with a turreted 20, 25, or 30mm rotary cannon in the weapons bay would be nice.  Along with a brace of Griffon and SDBs

[GTX_Admin]

Maybe like those done by SC a while back - see Reply # 28 of this thread.

[Volkodav]

Thanks for that now you've reminded me I remember seeing them before.  What I was thinking of was a removable gun pak for the weapons bay

Always thought the Orion airframe would have been great used for a variety of roles in addition to its primary MPA.  AEW as discussed earlier would have been a no brainer and perfect for the RAAF as would the other specialised versions developed over the years.  A tactical tanker transport version would have been interesting, airborne command post.  A maritime attack bomber probably carries on from MPA but I wonder if a stand off land attack bomber would be possible too, especially in the 60s.

[Kerick]

We're sending some CP-140's to Kuwait to spy on ISIL....would be an interesting WHIF in desert cam and maybe armed with something more than optics.

A rack full of Hellfire missiles in the weapons bay would be effective.