Beyond The Sprues

Current and Finished Projects => Profiles and Pixels => Topic started by: Tophe on December 12, 2011, 02:46:58 AM

Title: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 12, 2011, 02:46:58 AM
Well, I have twin-boomers and Mustangs elsewhere, but I wanted to participate here somehow, so it could be a place for miscellaneous drawings, not precise profiles nor colour realistic drawings but simple sketches, my favourite way.
Here is the P-47 Thunderbolt and unknown derivatives (actually built! in my mind)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_m.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on December 12, 2011, 03:43:31 AM
Nice to see you and your work here.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: sotoolslinger on December 12, 2011, 07:36:41 AM
What he said. MOAR weird stuff ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 12, 2011, 10:53:44 AM
Brian da Basher worked recently on my drawing of his model "4-engined P-38", and I sent him a coloured big size view, more easy to work on than the first sketch on my site of fantasy Lightnings (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit ). This is a twin-boomer, yes, but I include it here anyway, as already posted on my site (far smaller).
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairB_zzzv2c2.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on December 13, 2011, 03:39:53 AM
Wow you're off to a great start here, Tophe! I always thought P-47s were ripe for "changes" and of course, you managed to take it to the highest level!

A biplane tail on a Thunderbolt? Only from your amazing imagination!

Tres magnifique!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 13, 2011, 12:46:50 PM
Thanks for your indulgence: my dreamy imagination is lacking technical wisdom anyway. I have to correct the design concerning the tail to become credible, almost...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_o.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 14, 2011, 01:20:53 AM
The Thunderbolt cockpit could move forward or rearward, the supercharger under the nose can be discarded, and a Yak-15-like jet could be fitted:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_q.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on December 14, 2011, 04:39:37 AM
Mon dieu! Yet more to amaze!

The T-bolt with the canopy far to the rear and the jet engine reminds me of early Soviet Yak fighters. If you added small fuselage windows to the one with the canopy far out front, you could turn it into a transport, much like the early Lockheed Orion.

Your work is a constant inspiration, mon ami!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 14, 2011, 12:33:57 PM
Oh, yes, I had forgotten these ones: the Repubrian dB-Aircraft Co U-47 A & B:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_r.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 14, 2011, 05:28:40 PM
That top one looks very similar to an idea I was playing with (and gave up on) a few months back!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 15, 2011, 02:34:57 AM
Funny similarity, GTX...
Inspired by JP's jet-Mistels (at http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=15.0 ), I add here a P-47-Mistel:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_u.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on December 15, 2011, 04:27:43 AM
Thanks to you, Tophe, it looks like I know have my own aircraft company.

I'll have to source a P-47 in 1/72 one of these days and see if I can recreate your magic in three dimensions.

Outstanding!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on December 15, 2011, 05:35:37 AM
Great idea with the U-47s!  :want:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 15, 2011, 12:03:29 PM
I forgot to say: while the Repubrian factory mass-produced the U-47 (in thousands copies), the M-47 Mistelbolt was produced by the famous North Amebrian factory. And it had no intermeshing propellers, one propeller (thanks to elongated shaft spinner) being in front of the other:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_w.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: sotoolslinger on December 15, 2011, 12:19:16 PM
Tophe we love you here at the home of the abnormal :D :in-love:
Brian, I may have some 1/72 Jugs at the house. If so I'll get them to you :in-love:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 16, 2011, 04:02:06 AM
From the Mistel M-47 came the Observation O-47 still with pylons to hold engine above, but here this gives a free nose for observers:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_X.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on December 16, 2011, 04:21:51 AM
This is one of your most interesting P-47 permutations yet, Tophe! I bet it would also make a great flying boat with a hull on the bottom.

Mon dieu!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on December 16, 2011, 06:10:39 AM
Only one word for that. Woah!!!  :slow:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 16, 2011, 01:13:47 PM
I bet it would also make a great flying boat with a hull on the bottom.
"would"? Do you know dream of the Consolibrian PB-47? Officers of propaganda Official Historians have always claimed it never existed for Real!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_y.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on December 20, 2011, 06:04:59 AM
When I least expect it, you go and take it to the next level! Outstanding! I really like how you kept the "glass" nose. This baby would be perfect for some sightseeing down the River Meuse.

Your work and imagination is a constant delight, mon ami!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on December 27, 2011, 04:19:27 PM
Very good Tophe! :)  Lauhof
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 29, 2011, 03:12:48 AM
Thanks lauhof, I will try to see what you posted here also (I just have a million mails to check before, as I come back from holidays)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 03, 2012, 01:30:59 AM
Well, I must deserve my reputation, with at least one double plane here... (a Thunderbolt inspired by the P-38: Lighterbolt - and asymmetric low-weight derivative):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_zi.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Doom! on January 03, 2012, 02:09:56 AM
I bet it would also make a great flying boat with a hull on the bottom.
"would"? Do you know dream of the Consolibrian PB-47? Officers of propaganda Official Historians have always claimed it never existed for Real!
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_y.jpg[/url])

 
Tophe, this is just way too cool! I love it  :in-love:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 03, 2012, 08:10:03 AM
Well, I must deserve my reputation, with at least one double plane here... (a Thunderbolt inspired by the P-38: Lighterbolt - and asymmetric low-weight derivative):
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_zi.jpg[/url])


The top one would be a beast!!!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on January 05, 2012, 08:30:05 AM
The top "Lighterbolt" reminds me of the P-68 Black Widow, minus the rear gunner/recon station. Now that bottom "Lighterbolt" is what the famous Blohm & Voss observation prototype wishes it could be.

Your wonderful ideas never fail to delight me, Tophe!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 05, 2012, 12:03:21 PM
Thanks BdB to have smile with me about douple-planes and asymmetric ones, but let us be serious now: let us talk about... SPATS!
The Republic design bureau has been very wrong selecting a retractable landing gear for the P-47, this device being heavy and complicated (with crash of the airplane if there is any problem!!). No, the Spatterbolt (below) was the good one, but which: tail-wheeled or nose-wheeled?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_zo.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on January 05, 2012, 12:23:55 PM
But of course !
Its been waiting for me to envision it all these years and I never did - the four engine P-38.
Thanks so much for the enlightenment.

Bill
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 05, 2012, 12:59:14 PM
Bill, several 4-engined P-38 are on my site http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit)
(two of them have been built in plastic, ask with Ctrl-f: P-38T then LR-38M)

Concerning the P-47 with spats, I think the main reason is this argument for Republic towards USAAF: "if you want streamlining with few hp, buy those anemic Mustangs of yours, but with a huge engine and much hp vitamins, we don't care about streamlining: big nose, no spinner, spats, yes, all is different, better!"
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on January 05, 2012, 01:39:19 PM
Took a look and am dizzy with P-38ish images.
Struck me that with the attached P-38, you could do a push/pull on center section for an eight engine P-38.
The center could be push only which leaves nose open for guns.  Perhaps that is best.
The Spider Venom is a relative of your P-38s.  But you have inspired me to likely build some kind of P-38 variation after finishing the unorthodox twin engine jet bomber in work now.  Will find at least one P-38 in some scale and see what kind of variation in 1/72 final scale I come up with.  May borrow ideas from your images.

Bill
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Maverick on January 05, 2012, 09:10:30 PM
For me, the flying boat variant has a 'Porco Rosso' feel to it.

Regards,

John
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Stargazer2006 on January 06, 2012, 12:34:49 AM
As has been said previously, your work is inspiring!

I love these, in particular:
- Repubrian dB-Aircraft Co U-47 A (maybe will get photomanipulation treatment...)
- Observation O-47
- Consolibrian PB-47
- Spatterbolt 2 (should have been done in real life!!)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 06, 2012, 02:44:59 AM
Now, there is a Finsrin chapter at the end of http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit)
(that's your own fault Finsrin :) )
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairB_zzzw.jpg)
Thanks for the other comments too!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: RussC on January 06, 2012, 06:14:43 AM
Now, there is a Finsrin chapter at the end of [url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit[/url] ([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit[/url])
(that's your own fault Finsrin :) )
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairB_zzzw.jpg[/url])
Thanks for the other comments too!


   That reminds me, next time I take a trip in the wayback machine -time traveller, to buy up more Hamilton Standard Stock shares.  :serious-business:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on January 06, 2012, 06:42:18 AM
Now, there is a Finsrin chapter at the end of [url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit[/url] ([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit[/url])
(that's your own fault Finsrin :) )
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairB_zzzw.jpg[/url])
Thanks for the other comments too!


Absolutely delightful and magnificently whimsical! The only thing it's missing are spats.

Outstanding, Tophe!!!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on January 06, 2012, 10:30:59 AM
Yes look at that, a good thing gets even better.  Is tempting to build the seven engine version and place guns in nose.  Paint in USAF Thunderbirds scheme?  Because of your inspirational drawings, do plan to base next build on one or two or three P-38 kits then browse thru my stash and see whatever parts donner kits pop out at me.  Start with no plan and let it happen.

Bill
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 06, 2012, 01:20:47 PM
Thanks Brian, this is another chapter at the end of http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit) featuring the famous Brian da Basher himself, yes (precious help for the Lockheed designers)...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairF_kp.jpg)
PS. Have you seen the P-47 with spats on a previous page here, Stargazer selected the #2 and you Brian Spat-man, expert?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 06, 2012, 01:31:49 PM
corrected drawing with long minor landing gears (to keep guard for the propellers, not two-blade locked horizontal for Take-off & Landing)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairF_kr.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on January 06, 2012, 04:49:31 PM
A Beauty Tophe! :meaw:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on January 07, 2012, 05:14:59 PM
Brilliant --- fixed landing gear simplifies construction, maintenance, lowers cost !
With one or no engines in outer pods there is room be fitted with a gun turret.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 07, 2012, 06:29:49 PM
but let us be serious now: let us talk about... SPATS!
The Republic design bureau has been very wrong selecting a retractable landing gear for the P-47, this device being heavy and complicated (with crash of the airplane if there is any problem!!). No, the Spatterbolt (below) was the good one, but which: tail-wheeled or nose-wheeled?
With the jet age coming, the P-47 Spatterbolt (now F-47) kept spats of course: no need of streamlining when a so huge power is available!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_zq.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Stargazer2006 on January 07, 2012, 07:02:52 PM
Lower one is very clean and pleasant!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on January 09, 2012, 06:34:52 AM
Oh my such lovely spats, mon ami!!! I may need to dowload these for, um, a more "in-depth" analysis...

Your work never fails to delight and inspire, Tophe!

Brian da basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on January 09, 2012, 06:48:13 AM
You guys are onto something big. 
With all the power they have --- F-22 and SR-71 can save retractable landing gear complexity/costs and do the same !
Bill
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 09, 2012, 11:17:05 AM
Mach 3 spats? Wow! :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 14, 2012, 10:55:36 PM
Much inspired by the Falke marvel of RussC (for instance at Deviant Art’s http://fav.me/d4kma3t (http://fav.me/d4kma3t) ), I have imagined a similar Lightning. The main differences in mine are the removal of canards into a flying wing and the addition of SPATS to explain (on a little drawing) why such a rear boom.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairF_kx.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on January 15, 2012, 12:17:47 AM
My what lovely spats you have!
 :-*
This little beauty looks like something that could be marketed as a home-built airplane. I smile  imagining it taking off out of a garage.

Cute as a button, mon ami!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: RussC on January 15, 2012, 04:34:54 AM
Much inspired by the Falke marvel of RussC (for instance at Deviant Art’s [url]http://fav.me/d4kma3t[/url] ([url]http://fav.me/d4kma3t[/url]) ), I have imagined a similar Lightning. The main differences in mine are the removal of canards into a flying wing and the addition of SPATS to explain (on a little drawing) why such a rear boom.



Makes me wonder if the legs holding the spats couldn't be made shorter by extending the tailwheel stinger. Also instead of a simple leg to hold the spats, maybe a two poster like on RAF heavies and Mosquitos, shrouded and a radiator bath there between engine nacelle and spat? Nice clean conformal single shape with wheel at the bottom.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 22, 2012, 02:37:51 PM
From JoseFern’s topic http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=157.60 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=157.60) I have drawn a slanting view of his P-47Z ChainBolt. It is presented on my site http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/#Sit) with derivatives of mine but I show it here bigger:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairC_zzzn.jpg)
(now I am going to "work" on RussC's idea...)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 22, 2012, 02:42:18 PM
Me like...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 22, 2012, 07:52:53 PM
Makes me wonder if the legs holding the spats couldn't be made shorter by extending the tailwheel stinger. Also instead of a simple leg to hold the spats, maybe a two poster like on RAF heavies and Mosquitos, shrouded and a radiator bath there between engine nacelle and spat? Nice clean conformal single shape with wheel at the bottom.
Thanks RussC, I have:
- extended the tailboom
- doubled each leg to the wheel
- added a radiator between engine and pod
Alas I have been unable to make shorter the landing gear: the propeller ground clearance is not big...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairF_mg.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 04, 2012, 10:55:58 AM
From JP Vieira's wonderful topic http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=15.240 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=15.240) :
And now for a prop He-162
a slanting view of mine, with asymmetric twin-fuselage derivative:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_He162tb_e.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on February 05, 2012, 03:43:58 AM
That's some great stuff, mon ami! I especially like your "twinned" He-162 with the V-tail.

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 05, 2012, 02:54:49 PM
Thanks Brian.
And still at http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=15.240 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=15.240) our dear Admin GTX posted a twin-boom He-162 of his own. Both should not fight one another but marry, into a double 162, asymmetric of course...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_He162tb_i.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on February 05, 2012, 05:26:18 PM
Nice. :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on February 05, 2012, 09:48:33 PM
Those are all great: congrats
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on February 06, 2012, 01:25:34 AM
(http://freesmileyface.net/smiley/respect/respect-013.gif)

Alex
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Doom! on February 06, 2012, 01:53:06 AM
You've been doing some really cool work lately!  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 06, 2012, 02:05:10 AM
Thanks to all of you!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on February 06, 2012, 03:48:44 AM
The "break" in the horizontal stabilizers reminds me of that Blohm & Voss asymmetric observation prototype, Tophe. Interesting to see two differenct concepts from two separate firms "married" in one aircraft.

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 06, 2012, 12:26:52 PM
Thanks Brian, you are right this seemed poorly balanced, so this morning (on my side of the Earth) I have created a more solid version:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_He162tb_j.jpg)
This one seems possible, and it may be the first airplane ever as "twin-engined with piston on port and turboprop on starboard", that is why I included it at the end of my asymmetric-aircraft Web-site http://cmeunier.chez-alice.fr/Asymm_addition.htm (http://cmeunier.chez-alice.fr/Asymm_addition.htm) referring to both genius JPV & GTX creators. Thanks again.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on February 06, 2012, 12:58:20 PM
a slanting view of mine, with asymmetric twin-fuselage derivative:
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_He162tb_e.jpg[/url])

On the twin with the V-tails, why not join the two "inner" tails in a larger inverted-V-tail and do away with the outer tails?  Note that this would leave all sorts of room for a central pod/nacelle, of whatever kind, between the two fuselages.  The ultimate evolution might be a push/pull twin-engine pod (piston or turboprop), or a twin jet pod (ala' Ar-234C) with no engines on the fuselages.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 06, 2012, 01:41:10 PM
Thanks a lot, engineer. Though the week-end is finished here and I must go to work. These new silhouettes of yours will come to life this week, probably. :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 07, 2012, 01:34:49 AM
I did it the first day of the week, thanks Evan!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_He162tb_l.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on February 07, 2012, 04:25:25 AM
These last three are right on !!!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on February 07, 2012, 05:58:39 AM
Those are great: Thanks Tophe
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 12, 2012, 12:53:45 AM
For Christmas, I got the wonderful huge book "Chasseurs russes et soviétiques 1915-1950" (Russian & Soviet fighters 1915-1950) by Herbert Léonard, ETAI publisher, France 2009. 464 pages... In this one, I loved many ones but I selected the poorly known MiG-5 to draw a zwilling (dvukh-fuselajnii):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_MiG5K_k.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on February 14, 2012, 06:35:18 AM
Your four-engined "zwillig" version is a delight, Tophe!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 15, 2012, 11:40:03 AM
Thanks again Brian.
Well, from the Blohm und Voss Bv 138, seaplane twin-boomer with a rear post, was created the Bv 138L, landplane twin-boomer with a rear cargo door:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_BV138B_d.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on February 15, 2012, 11:50:10 AM
Ooo Tophe ... love your Bv 138L! Very nice  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on February 15, 2012, 05:49:00 PM
Great idea.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on February 16, 2012, 04:49:02 AM
Aww those little spats are sooooo cute!
 :-* :-*
I'd blush if I had any shame...

Thank you, mon ami!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 16, 2012, 11:25:38 AM
Thanks to all of you!
Those spats are not very small, just the plane is big so they are small in comparing... hehe ;). I guess there would be 4 spats but 3 of them are hidden by the wing (rear starboard) and fuselage (front & rear, port).
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 26, 2012, 03:02:37 PM
Last night, I made a huge historical discovery: in Bell's archives was hidden the secret project of Jetcobras (both P-39J and P-63J): at the beginning of the jet age, 1941, it was hoped that a single turbojet could replace the piston engine of a Cobra, then it appeared that 2 turbojets would be needed and that directed towards the XP-59A (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_P-59_Airacomet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_P-59_Airacomet) ) but the very true first US jet-fighter was the P-39J!
Then the alarm clock rung and I rushed to the computer to inform you of this very truth!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_cobra_e.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on February 27, 2012, 10:13:20 AM
Very nice Tophe! Your bottom-left P-63J concept is very like the original XP-59B proposal  :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 27, 2012, 07:43:17 PM
You are right, maybe this memory inspired my dreamy "discovery"...
For the push-pull Cobras, with tandem central in-line engines (and belly air scoops), I think there is nothing to explain:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_cobra_h.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 29, 2012, 01:11:44 AM
Corrected with low fins to protect the rear propellers...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_cobra_k.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 08, 2012, 04:39:30 AM
Do you know the glider versions of the Bell Cobras?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_cobra_n.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 10, 2012, 10:58:04 PM
The Bell Spatscobra designer hesitated (for both versions Air & King) between nose-wheel and tail-wheel:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_cobra_q.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on March 11, 2012, 03:21:49 AM
My what lovely spats you have! I am especially enamored of the tricycled ones!

 :-* :-* :-*

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 11, 2012, 07:18:35 AM
He He. Love the Spatscobras  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 11, 2012, 03:57:02 PM
Thanks.
Now something different: the Cobras TT (Two-seat Twin-fin) had a very different shape
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_cobra_t.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on March 11, 2012, 06:03:34 PM
I love those TT,especially P-63,GP-39B glider is also interesting

Alex
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on March 11, 2012, 06:16:54 PM
The twin-fin cobras are great; they could be the basis for a powerful ground attack version (like a western built shturmovik)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 12, 2012, 11:40:42 AM
Tophe: I like the Cobras TT. The twin-tails change the look a lot! One question: Where is the engine in your two-seaters? Further aft or in the nose?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 12, 2012, 12:08:01 PM
Thanks for your comments, all...
Concerning the engine position in the TT-Cobras, the answer is... "this is a very good, puzzling question", I will work on it... I mean: "with engine in the nose, this would destroy the Bell Cobra concept, and with engine aft, this requires adapting, I will..." Thanks for your technical wisdom, dream alone is not enough. ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 12, 2012, 12:32:37 PM
Bell designers understood the balance problem of a central engine becoming aft engine on the Cobra. So they designed the improved Apophobra: a tail wheel improved balance on the ground and a tandem-wing (à-la-Delanne) improved balance in flight. Thanks Apoph-inspiration...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_cobra_w.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 13, 2012, 03:56:14 AM
Spitfire young girls met Thunderbolt young men and... they fell pregnant:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_zu.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on March 13, 2012, 05:06:16 AM
I'm a sucker for a love story, Tophe and I like your "Thunderfire", especially the top one!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 13, 2012, 10:56:09 AM
Love the 'Thunderfire' as well. Plus problem solved for the TT-Cobras and I'm famous to boot ... win/win!

Your Delanne solution is very elegant Tophe. Nice to have some extra lifting surface if she's getting tail-heavy  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 14, 2012, 01:31:39 PM
Thanks!
and... the daughter of Bubble-Thunderfire was Spitbolt, a poor girl needing aesthetical surgery maybe... towards the look of her cousin XP-47H?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_zw.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 15, 2012, 03:45:19 AM
her cousin XP-47H?
Historians do pretend there was nothing between the XP-47H and XP-47J. Wrong! (Secret!) There was the streamlined YP-47H and the bubble XP-47I...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_azb.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on March 15, 2012, 05:32:18 AM
Great ones
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 15, 2012, 10:14:18 AM
Historians do pretend there was nothing between the XP-47H and XP-47J. Wrong! (Secret!) There was the streamlined YP-47H and the bubble XP-47I...

Tophe: that turbocharger-less XP-47I is HOT! But we mustn't forget the service P-47I ...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 15, 2012, 10:27:48 AM
Wonderful! Thanks ApophenIa...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on March 16, 2012, 07:20:53 PM
I just love your work, Tophe and I only wish I had the money to make plastic kits of your wonderful ideas!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on March 16, 2012, 11:37:45 PM
Lovin' the P-47s!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 17, 2012, 02:57:01 AM
Thanks!
And here is an uncommon 2-seat Thunderbolt: side but side and without a single canopy but two.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_azd.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 17, 2012, 08:20:43 AM
Double-Bubble?  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: abtex on March 17, 2012, 10:12:04 AM
her cousin XP-47H?
Historians do pretend there was nothing between the XP-47H and XP-47J. Wrong! (Secret!) There was the streamlined YP-47H and the bubble XP-47I...
Did you forget the attempt to put a rear open machine gun station and later the enclosed 'ball' turret on the -H and -J using a multi-seat cockpit?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 17, 2012, 11:05:54 AM
Did you forget the attempt to put a rear open machine gun station and later the enclosed 'ball' turret on the -H and -J using a multi-seat cockpit?
What is the source? I'd be happy to discover this unknown data...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 29, 2012, 12:24:56 AM
Improving the P-40 Hawk's aesthetics, by replacing the nose radiator by a belly air scoop:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P40_37_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 29, 2012, 04:05:32 AM
That is an improvement! Of course, the prototype XP-40 originally flew with a belly radiator ... but your's is better shaped  :)

http://www.joesmodels.com/a_lf_models/LF72059.jpg (http://www.joesmodels.com/a_lf_models/LF72059.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 29, 2012, 07:02:47 AM
Oh yes, you're right Apophenia, I had forgotten. This XP-40 was a beauty, thanks for the link :-*.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 30, 2012, 03:09:59 AM
From this P-40, moving the canopy back and forth produces P-37-like and P-39-like derivatives:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P40_37_c.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 30, 2012, 12:01:25 PM
Ooh ... I like that canopy-forward P-40 with the belly radiator!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 31, 2012, 03:01:10 AM
Thanks Apophenia, and here is the twin of it:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on April 02, 2012, 12:08:43 PM
Thanks!
And here is an uncommon 2-seat Thunderbolt: side but side and without a single canopy but two.
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P-47z_azd.jpg[/url])

Very nice for a prototype, but I suspect a production version would have a single canopy and a large windscreen assembly similar to those on the two-seat Hunter and Lightning.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 03, 2012, 01:18:34 AM
Thanks for the advice, engineer. Well, engineering is less funny than dream. With a single canopy, the result is almost "normal", boringly...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on April 03, 2012, 10:12:12 AM
Oh, I don't know.  Stretched to a four-seat cockpit, it would make a great courier aircraft for VIPs.  It also makes for a most roomy cockpit for the trainer and a great ride for utility flights.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 03, 2012, 10:29:16 AM
Thanks again engineer! :D
So here is the engineered Republevan P-47T Thundercourier sedan:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on April 03, 2012, 12:11:04 PM
He he ... I like the Thundercourier sedan Tophe. The canopy reminds me a bit of the Boulton Paul Balliol.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 05, 2012, 12:00:10 AM
Thanks.
I like 1939-45 airplanes (to make twin-planes for my what-if topic) but not only. I love also the Mirage 5 shape, and here I try to compact it:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on April 05, 2012, 02:33:54 AM
So, a Mirage 5 "minimalized" down to compete with the A-4 Skyhawk?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 05, 2012, 09:29:13 AM
Maybe sellers could have sold it this way, yes, but the primary goal (of mine) was aesthetic try (not much convincing I agree) ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 11, 2012, 09:10:31 PM
Very canard Mirages 50: Mirages 55:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 11, 2012, 11:23:33 PM
And for selling it to the RAF, the Mirage 56 was named Javelirage:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 11, 2012, 11:36:41 PM
And from the Mirage 55 and 56 came the 57, delta but not tailless at all:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 12, 2012, 12:10:22 AM
On the opposite direction, the Mirage 58 was a pure delta rocket plane:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on April 12, 2012, 05:02:19 AM
I like Mirage-55 (http://freesmileyface.net/smiley/respect/respect-048.gif)

Alex
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 12, 2012, 11:21:00 PM
Thanks Alex.
Here is the simplification maximum: the glider-trainer Mirage 59:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 12, 2012, 11:51:25 PM
And, of course, that directed to the Bi-Mirage 500 (Twin-Mirage for export in the USA):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 03, 2012, 06:40:13 PM
The F-16 introducing the F-16R Rocket-Falcon (YF-16 thanks to http://aeronauticadigital.blogspot.fr/2011/04/general-dynamics-f-16-fighting-falcon.html (http://aeronauticadigital.blogspot.fr/2011/04/general-dynamics-f-16-fighting-falcon.html) )
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on June 03, 2012, 09:42:50 PM
Cool!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 03, 2012, 10:58:50 PM
Thanks GTX.
This was the preliminary step before the F-16TB (twin-boom) & F-16TL (tail-less):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on June 04, 2012, 02:38:55 AM
Even better
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on June 04, 2012, 06:12:34 AM
Love the F-16TL Tophe! That "preliminary step before the F-16TB (twin-boom)" looks like it might evolve into a vectoring-nozzle type  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 04, 2012, 11:35:56 AM
Thank you my friends.
And here is the F-16Z Zwilling-Falcon:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on June 05, 2012, 09:54:45 AM
Very nice F-16Z! Is there also going to be twin-boomer with a single fuselage?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 05, 2012, 12:26:04 PM
Thanks! ;)
So here is the F-16BP (BiPoutre for export to France):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: RussC on June 05, 2012, 03:58:53 PM
Thanks! ;)
So here is the F-16BP (BiPoutre for export to France):

  Interesting! and a improve on the idea of the F7u Cutlass!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on June 05, 2012, 04:32:19 PM
F-16BP is added to my favorites list.   :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on June 06, 2012, 03:05:31 AM
Now that is attractive.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on June 06, 2012, 03:44:23 AM
Oooo, F-16BP (BiPoutre) wasn't what I was expecting at all. Very nice Tophe!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on June 06, 2012, 03:53:07 AM
Impressive,I like F-16 BP !

Alex
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 06, 2012, 12:42:33 PM
Thanks to all, for your liking these fast-made drawings, far worse than yours, so perfect.
Oooo, F-16BP (BiPoutre) wasn't what I was expecting at all.
Is this more what you expected?:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on June 06, 2012, 02:58:10 PM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: RussC on June 06, 2012, 04:03:39 PM
Thanks to all, for your liking these fast-made drawings, far worse than yours, so perfect.


Its really the idea that counts here. As long as legible, its all that is needed.
Any sketch can always be expanded, colored or changed later.
Perfect is very subjective!  :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on June 06, 2012, 04:14:24 PM
"Its really the idea that counts here. As long as legible, its all that is needed."
Russ says it right !
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on June 06, 2012, 04:21:52 PM
Its really the idea that counts here. As long as legible, its all that is needed.
Any sketch can always be expanded, colored or changed later.
Perfect is very subjective!  :D
Totally agree !!!
By the way,I also like the last one!

Alex
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 07, 2012, 12:38:02 AM
Thank you my friends! ;)
Well, my idea was not good either: there should not be a double-fin but a double half-area fin. So I have applied a square root of 2, divided by 2, scale (70%) on the fins:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on June 07, 2012, 06:56:07 AM
Is this more what you expected?:

Exactly! Although I do like your later version with the scaled-down fins. I can just see that version with vectoring exhaust!  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 07, 2012, 12:02:17 PM
AV-8 like? or X-35 like? or F-22 like? tell me and I will try.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on June 07, 2012, 12:56:12 PM
More like P.1216 I reckon.  F-35B rear nozzle with front vectored nozzles.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on June 08, 2012, 06:31:27 AM
I was thinking more of the 2D exhausts seen on experimental Flankers.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on June 08, 2012, 08:57:32 AM
I was thinking more of the 2D exhausts seen on experimental Flankers.
Which were replaced by vectoring axi-symmetric nozzles as their technology progressed.  For that matter, an experimental F-16 flown with a similar vectoring nozzle under the AVEN (Axisymmetric Vectoring Exhuast Nozzle) program.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 08, 2012, 11:20:31 AM
Both the Su-37 and F-16 AVEN have vertor-thrust with no special aspect, so... I have comen back to the P.1216 aspect and to preliminary 2D vector exhaust:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on June 09, 2012, 10:49:13 AM
Very nice Tophe! And naming the file "r_Mirage5_v.JPG" will help with counter-espionage efforts  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 09, 2012, 11:36:31 AM
I am glad I have succeded in matching your dream more or less, Apophenia.
 ;)
The name of the file is because the Corel draw source is a common file with the Mirage 5, page after page. This came from my "going away of 1940s' warbirds", just for these supersonic beauties, before going back maybe.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 12, 2012, 11:46:01 AM
And here is a Mustang family of wings: normal, high altitude, double, circular...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51_N.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on June 13, 2012, 06:59:07 AM
Love the Mustang wing family, Tophe! I am a sucker for canard wings but your circular/annular wing is truly wild  :-*

The name of the file is because the Corel draw source is a common file with the Mirage 5, page after page. This came from my "going away of 1940s' warbirds", just for these supersonic beauties, before going back maybe.

Just so lone as it confuses the JMNs  ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on June 13, 2012, 08:19:51 PM
I like the CW-51!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 14, 2012, 01:04:32 AM
Thanks for your nice words...
But for real, how? installing the undercarriage? I try:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: RussC on June 14, 2012, 06:09:42 AM
And here is a Mustang family of wings: normal, high altitude, double, circular...
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51_N.JPG[/url])


  I would say that PR_19 over on the "other forum" would be very interested in the HA-51 version!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on June 14, 2012, 08:29:06 AM
But for real, how? installing the undercarriage? I try:

You need a fourth, central spat under the wing Tophe. You know, just for Brian  ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 14, 2012, 11:26:55 AM
Yes thanks, here is the improved North-Ameribrian CW-51F:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on June 21, 2012, 09:10:56 AM
CW-51E/F.  Held strange meter in front of screen and both pegged the needle.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 21, 2012, 12:11:42 PM
Dear finsrin, I don't understand your words, sorry...
In case you were referring to the wind-screen or/and to the wing making a screen against visibility, I have created a version more FTB-ish (P-39-like):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/tr_P82-51_r.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on June 21, 2012, 12:30:04 PM
A "strangeness" meter. 
Hold it between yourself and something that appears strange to see how high a strangeness is indicated for an object or image.   ;)
Bill
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 21, 2012, 01:11:52 PM
Oh, I see... Thanks for the explanation.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on June 22, 2012, 06:53:16 AM
CW-51 with only the upper curved wing can use stock landing gear and be a biplane version of P-51
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 22, 2012, 11:02:08 AM
Thanks finsrin for the idea! ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 23, 2012, 09:06:56 PM
Here is a twin-Mirage 5 with asymmetric swept wing:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 01, 2012, 11:33:20 PM
Required on Secret Projects, I have failed in finding a XF5F with inline engines, so I have drawn it myself:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_f5f_e.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 01, 2012, 11:50:57 PM
These XF5F are so "normal", you may judge my psychiatric pills are taking effect at last. No, no: this is to introduce classically the rue story of the F5F.
The American company Grumman wanted that their next Cat being like the others a single-engined single-fin fighter, of course, but they wanted a free nose, for machine-things (throwing flowers I guess). With the help of the German company Blohm und Voss, they produced the F5F Skyrocat (below: F5F-1 & F5F-2, the very first asymmetric airplanes on Navy carriers. But, in order to fool British and French spies (in war with Germany), Grumman invented the legend of the symmetric twin-engined XF5F Skyrocket! And all historians believed it!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_f5f_f.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 02, 2012, 02:18:48 AM
 ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 03, 2012, 01:26:18 AM
I can't help adding twin-fuselage asymmetric derivatives:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_f5f_g.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 03, 2012, 11:48:42 AM
The F5F-38 Lightn'cat may have been the last of the F5F family:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_f5f_h.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on July 03, 2012, 05:53:16 PM
Very very nice, Tophe! :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 03, 2012, 05:54:53 PM
I like that last one.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 07, 2012, 01:32:04 PM
The F5F-44 Skyrojet featured two turbojets:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_f5f_m.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Acree on July 07, 2012, 01:42:51 PM
Love the Skyrojet - has touches of F5F, Meteor and Airtruck! That's a phenomenal combination. :-\
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 08, 2012, 03:36:34 AM
Love the Skyrojet - has touches of...Airtruck! That's a phenomenal combination. :-\

Oh, a crop duster based on the Skyrocket...that would be interesting.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on July 08, 2012, 05:51:01 AM
All of the Skyrockets are full of Tophey goodness but that F5F-44 Skyrojet is fabulous!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 08, 2012, 11:48:14 AM
Thanks!
Well, there was no reason to be a twin-boomer to be a twin-jet F5F:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/f5f_o.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 19, 2012, 10:44:06 PM
Derivatives of the Mansyu Ki-98: Ki-98-II & Ki-98-III:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_KI98_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 20, 2012, 02:17:41 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 20, 2012, 11:55:32 PM
Ki-98-IV and V:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 21, 2012, 02:48:15 AM
Looks like some one is channeling Burt Rutan...or was Burt Rutan channelling Tophe??? ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on July 21, 2012, 05:44:12 PM
You are allways an inspiration to others :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 22, 2012, 12:35:55 AM
Thanks. :)
The push-pull Tachikawa Ki-94 would have pusher derivatives:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 22, 2012, 05:21:03 PM
On the opposite: the pusher AW-49 would have a push-pull derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 22, 2012, 10:27:56 PM
And the DFS 203B:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 22, 2012, 11:07:53 PM
Gotha Go-244AB:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on July 23, 2012, 04:19:01 AM
Some great stuff you have there Tophe!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 24, 2012, 11:48:58 AM
Thanks.
Next: the push-pull derivative of the Demaizière-Joffrin DJ-12 may have been coded DJ-14:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 24, 2012, 03:04:30 PM
Mmmm.....
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on July 25, 2012, 11:38:51 AM
Love the Gotha Go-244AB!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 25, 2012, 12:55:55 PM
Thanks.
Now, the push-pull derivatives of the Mantelli AM-6 and AM-8:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 25, 2012, 01:16:16 PM
And the bifusoliera BF-6:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 28, 2012, 10:47:45 PM
After the old push-pull Seversky Super-Clipper, the pusher Hyper-Clipper would have been designed in early 1939 (with high-price panoramic seats):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on July 28, 2012, 11:41:21 PM
And the bifusoliera BF-6:

Very intereresting this one for a surveilance aircraft: congrats
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on July 29, 2012, 12:17:17 AM
Your Hyper-Clipper is truly a wonder to behold, mon ami! It's so lovely that "if it could cook, I'd marry it"!

How do you keep coming up with so many incredibly imaginative ideas?

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on July 29, 2012, 12:44:40 AM
The Demaizière-Joffrins are beautiful and the Mantellis have a certain charm about them!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 29, 2012, 04:58:05 PM
Thanks a lot.
Here are the Diepen-Difoga 422 & 423, derivatives of the (famous?) 421:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 29, 2012, 09:09:28 PM
And 424, 425, with several engines, and no asymmetry if one engine fails:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 29, 2012, 11:15:04 PM
Before the single-hull 8-engined Kaiser-Hughes HK-1 there would have been the 7-engined twin-hull Kaiser K-1.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on July 30, 2012, 08:52:14 AM
Great stuff Tophe! I especially love that pyloned push-pull engines on your Diepen-Difoga 424  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 03, 2012, 12:48:02 PM
Thanks!
And here are the twin-engined derivatives of the Belyayev EOI: tandem engines or push-pull engines:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 03, 2012, 02:34:57 PM
Between the Ku 7 glider and the twin-engined Ki 105, there must have been a single-engined one:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on August 03, 2012, 04:23:48 PM
Love that wonderful asymmetry which is your unmistakable signature, Tophe!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 04, 2012, 09:02:32 PM
Thanks...
And here are the derivatives of the Hall Autoplane: twin-engine and single-engine on pylon:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on August 05, 2012, 12:05:22 AM
Heee,I like this  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on August 05, 2012, 11:03:57 AM
Great stuff Tophe! The twin-engined Autoplane is my fav  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on August 08, 2012, 03:06:31 PM
Before the single-hull 8-engined Kaiser-Hughes HK-1 there would have been the 7-engined twin-hull Kaiser K-1.

Beautiful in Navy dark blue.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 08, 2012, 11:28:50 PM
I'm not good with colours, but here is a try:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on August 09, 2012, 06:30:27 AM
Night flying! Wonderful wings of the dark, mon ami!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 10, 2012, 11:06:09 PM
Thanks Brian, and here is a 1939-monoplane derivative of the DTD Twin-fuselage fighter of 1935:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 10, 2012, 11:42:00 PM
then derivatives of the Hirth 24:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on August 11, 2012, 10:56:48 AM
Very elegant!  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 12, 2012, 04:12:59 PM
Thanks.
And here is the SAAB J.27 family (in my dreams):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on August 12, 2012, 05:21:09 PM
Interesting
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 12, 2012, 08:43:25 PM
Mozharovskiy-Venevidov Kombayn family:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 12, 2012, 09:44:37 PM
Northrop XP-61H and UAV version
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 12, 2012, 10:16:22 PM
NIAI OSh family:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: dy031101 on August 12, 2012, 11:00:46 PM
Twin-boom goodness!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 13, 2012, 12:38:03 AM
Thanks.
And here is the monoplane derivative of the Pemberton-Billing PB-41:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on August 13, 2012, 10:22:48 AM
Great stuff Tophe  :)  Love those SAAB J.27s!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 14, 2012, 10:01:12 PM
Thanks Apophenia..
And here is the PWS 46B asymmetric derivative of the PWS 46:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on August 15, 2012, 02:07:01 AM
Hmmm...for some reason that makes me think of a twinned Hughes H.1 racer...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 15, 2012, 12:56:38 PM
Maybe.
And here is the Matra R.101 completing the famous R.100:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 15, 2012, 03:17:39 PM
And 4-engined Moskalyev SAM-24:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on August 15, 2012, 11:14:53 PM
Lovin' the Matra R.100 and R.101!  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 16, 2012, 12:49:51 AM
Thanks.
And here are the Santangelo Combattimento and derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on August 16, 2012, 05:41:41 AM
^ Really like those!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on August 16, 2012, 05:58:04 AM
Tophe: nice work on the Caccia Santangelo! Can we expect the early version, twin-boomed P.111 soon?  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 18, 2012, 12:18:38 AM
I have not the source for the P.111 sorry. Can you post it here? I would draw it, with a derivative of mine, yes.
In the meantime, here is the Slingsby T-27 glider with a motorglider derivative of mine:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on August 18, 2012, 01:44:08 AM
Forgot to mention - love the XP-61, Tophe!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 18, 2012, 09:34:48 PM
Thanks.
And here are the Weserflug P.2137 and push-pull asymmetric radar derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 18, 2012, 11:30:46 PM
and WNF-342 with several beams together with a derivative having twin-booms only:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on August 19, 2012, 01:39:18 AM
Heee I like WNF-342
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on August 19, 2012, 08:22:42 AM
lookin' good .... are you going to replace that twin-boom with a single asymetric one ???
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on August 19, 2012, 08:26:02 AM
Tophe,

Have you ever done a twin boom Bv141.

Regards,

Greg
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on August 19, 2012, 08:32:23 AM
I have not the source for the P.111 sorry. Can you post it here? ...

Here is the early, twin-boomed concept for the P.111 Caccia Santangelo Tophe.

I based this on an online sideview but that drawing doesn't jive with the photo of the wind tunnel model. So, the upper sideview is as shown on Secret Projects. The top view and lower sideview are corrected for length to match the wind tunnel model. Which is right? Take your pick  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 19, 2012, 10:47:24 AM
lookin' good .... are you going to replace that twin-boom with a single asymetric one ???
Yes we can!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 19, 2012, 10:51:33 AM
Tophe,

Have you ever done a twin boom Bv141.

Regards,

Greg
Several have been built in plastic, and I drew them in my books "Forked Ghosts". I could check the pages if you are interested (downloading them is free at http://cmeunier.chez-alice.fr/Free_EoFG_MV.htm (http://cmeunier.chez-alice.fr/Free_EoFG_MV.htm) )
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 19, 2012, 10:52:55 AM
Here is the early, twin-boomed concept for the P.111 Caccia Santangelo Tophe.
I will work on it today or next week. Thanks.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 19, 2012, 09:12:49 PM
Here is the old P.111 and the P.111B of 1939 (in my mind):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 19, 2012, 10:30:38 PM
and the AGA XLRG1 towed by a pusher derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on August 20, 2012, 07:00:34 AM
Here is the old P.111 and the P.111B of 1939 (in my mind):

Very nice! I like the XLRG1 derivatives too  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on August 21, 2012, 03:06:50 AM
Early twin-boomed concept for the P.111 Caccia Santangelo.
Cool in a wonderfully strange way.   8)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 23, 2012, 01:31:31 PM
Thanks.
And here is the Snead XLRH1 and its powered derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 24, 2012, 01:27:08 AM
Bücker 181 and derivative (antitorque):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 25, 2012, 01:30:49 PM
The Gaucher biplace and push-pull asymmetric derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 25, 2012, 09:46:36 PM
Howard Nebesar and derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 26, 2012, 01:53:55 AM
Martin-Baker Tankbuster and push-pull derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 26, 2012, 02:39:02 PM
General Airborne XCG-16 and powered derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 26, 2012, 09:19:32 PM
Portsmouth Aerocar and derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 26, 2012, 11:02:57 PM
Winkler Doppelrumpf and manned version:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 01, 2012, 09:40:37 PM
Charpentier Patent 867.149 and derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 01, 2012, 10:03:20 PM
Intermediate model between Bowlus MC-1 and XCG-16:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on September 02, 2012, 12:53:21 AM
That Charpentier design is brilliant!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on September 02, 2012, 02:21:36 PM
That Charpentier design is brilliant!  :)

Same goes for me  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 02, 2012, 04:53:18 PM
The true Charpentier design featured huge guns...
http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/mosaics?CC=FR&NR=867149A&KC=A&FT=D&ND=3&date=19411001&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP (http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/mosaics?CC=FR&NR=867149A&KC=A&FT=D&ND=3&date=19411001&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 03, 2012, 07:50:44 PM
The other Charpentier design of the same patent, with twin-boom derivatives:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on September 04, 2012, 01:58:54 AM
Batman lives!!! ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 12, 2012, 11:04:02 AM
Thanks!
And here is the De Schelde S.26, with a derivative which is even more Burnelli-like:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on September 12, 2012, 04:43:38 PM
S26 - so much late half 1930s into 40s.
Cool design and worthy of a kit-bash.  8)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 12, 2012, 08:07:45 PM
'Glad you liked it.
Here is the Boudier Patent 886,665 and a rotor-less derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 12, 2012, 10:35:50 PM
Then the Heinz monoplane, with a landplane derivative of my own:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 16, 2012, 12:20:49 AM
Welch OW12 and asymmetric derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on September 16, 2012, 03:31:00 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 16, 2012, 07:49:36 PM
Renard R-42 and asymmetric derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 16, 2012, 09:01:06 PM
Kurbala IS 2M-71 and single-seat derivative of mine:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 18, 2012, 07:31:37 AM
Forefather of Heston A2/45:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 18, 2012, 07:32:58 AM
Derivative of Vakhmistrov glider TR:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 18, 2012, 07:34:16 AM
More asymmetric derivative of the ML Night-Fighter:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on September 19, 2012, 05:05:55 AM
Great stuff as always Tophe ... but I love the Heston A2/45  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 20, 2012, 12:07:46 PM
Thanks.
And here is the Rossmaier compound, with a rotor-less dervative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on September 20, 2012, 01:04:56 PM
Great stuff as always Tophe ... but I love the Heston A2/45  :-*

Same for me --- and add to that the 2M-71 and Rossmaier
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 21, 2012, 02:06:37 AM
Thanks again.
And here is the Max Holste MH.20 with its powered derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on September 21, 2012, 02:47:24 AM
Thanks.
And here is the Rossmaier compound, with a rotor-less dervative:

 :o :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 21, 2012, 10:35:24 AM
IMA Swallow and manned derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 22, 2012, 12:00:36 PM
Capra R90 and asymmetric derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 22, 2012, 01:29:51 PM
Pelenberg and push-pull derivative:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 22, 2012, 01:31:12 PM
Roteron X100 with a derivative featuring a more classical twin-boom tail:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 22, 2012, 01:32:32 PM
Saunders-Roe P.1033 and test prototype:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on September 23, 2012, 01:24:52 AM
Pelenberg and push-pull derivative:

Niiiiice!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on September 23, 2012, 09:45:27 PM
Pelenberg and push-pull derivative:

Niiiiice!  :)

Seconded!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 30, 2012, 08:45:20 PM
Thanks...

Lisunov Li-4 built for a good reason, ahem: escaping a trial from Douglas for illegal copy
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on September 30, 2012, 09:58:57 PM
Outstanding!  Put floats on it would be nice too...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 01, 2012, 01:51:25 AM
Adding floats? Are you crazy, dear admin, or... is this the top secret forefather of ekranoplanes?...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on October 01, 2012, 03:59:39 AM
Nice that Pelenberg  :)

...more power for Lisunov...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on October 01, 2012, 07:03:31 AM
wow !! you guys are gonna make every DC-3 kit rare as hen's teeth - modellers will have to build all of these versions in plastic !! ........... unless they're boring numpties :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on October 01, 2012, 10:33:21 AM
Love the Lisunov ekranoplan  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 01, 2012, 11:40:02 AM
Thanks for the comments.
And thanks AXU for those great additions! :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 05, 2012, 01:10:18 AM
Double Mustang-Cheranovsky flying-wing...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on October 06, 2012, 06:13:12 AM
Like those pictures Tophe.
dc3_q1 picture and push/pull Pelenberg be great projects in plastic.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 09, 2012, 01:32:17 AM
Thanks.

Compared to a Spitfire, the (symmetrical) single-engined Whirlwind had the same 'free' nose as the twin-engined Whirlwind:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 09, 2012, 01:48:46 AM
And the Twin-Single-Whirlwind featured 2 free noses:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on October 10, 2012, 11:15:05 AM
Love the pedestal-engined Whirlwinds  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 27, 2012, 08:12:07 AM
Thanks.
And from Brian's http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2113.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2113.0) I add an asymmetrical Twin-Whirlwind:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on October 27, 2012, 02:23:23 PM
Very nice one, Tophe! :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 28, 2012, 12:36:49 PM
Thanks.
Now the (provisional) drawing of Celestino Rosatelli CR-50 and CR-55, together with the improved CR-56 of mine...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 30, 2012, 10:54:01 PM
North-American O-141 Half-Twin-Mustang...:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 31, 2012, 01:59:42 AM
Different.  You could also have a prone bombardier in that one - kind of a counterpart to the P-38 Droopsnoot.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 31, 2012, 02:20:24 AM
You are right, my drawing was not very panoramic... ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on November 02, 2012, 11:40:26 AM
Thanks Tophe. I like your take on Rosatelli's CR.50 and CR.55  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 02, 2012, 05:18:58 PM
For next Christmas, I consider requiring from Santa-Claus a Junkers EF-112 (http://www.unicraft.biz/germ/ju112/ju112.htm (http://www.unicraft.biz/germ/ju112/ju112.htm) ), but I will lack room for its span and it will be biplane. On the same way, as I lack skills for undercarriage, I plan to discard propellers into a glider:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 02, 2012, 05:41:48 PM
If I had more money and room and skills, I would build Zwilling EF-112:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 02, 2012, 07:15:00 PM
If I were not so focused on twin-boomers, I would present more classical shapes:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on November 02, 2012, 07:40:31 PM
Very nice one , Tophe! :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 03, 2012, 12:13:00 AM
Thanks Lauhof!
And still inspired by the model at http://www.unicraft.biz/germ/ju112/ju112.htm (http://www.unicraft.biz/germ/ju112/ju112.htm) here are non-push-pull derivatives of the EF-112:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 03, 2012, 11:40:55 AM
ANd the asymmetric version of the EF-112 may have been coded EF-141:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 17, 2012, 02:36:12 AM
Arado Ar 340 family: /2m, /3m, /1m...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on November 17, 2012, 06:19:57 AM
Very nice Arados! I especially like the /1m  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 17, 2012, 05:39:52 PM
Thanks.
And here is the Ar-340J low weight version of the Ar-340:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on November 25, 2012, 01:51:43 AM
Very interesting stuff as usual :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: arc3371 on November 25, 2012, 05:06:06 AM
Thanks.
And here is the Ar-340J low weight version of the Ar-340:

That looks like an interesting aircraft
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 03, 2012, 12:05:02 AM
Thanks Arc.
Here is the twin-engined Hurricane and 3-engine Twin-Hurricane:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 03, 2012, 12:37:35 AM
Of course, the 6-engined Twin-Hurricane needed more solidity, thus had linked tailplanes:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on December 03, 2012, 08:26:29 PM
Some great stuff in this thread!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on December 04, 2012, 03:55:19 AM
I agree, some of Tophe's stuff is just fantastic.

From What-If Modellers build pages ....
Tophe's design
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Hurri2_f.jpg)

The model by TallEng.
http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic,35173.0.html (http://www.whatifmodelers.com/index.php/topic,35173.0.html)
(http://i980.photobucket.com/albums/ae284/Tourjet/f33f660b3c1164abd83b3ab7e2870b7f.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on December 04, 2012, 06:35:21 AM
Nice mailplane scheme on the TallEng version too! Now, who is going to build Tophe's 6-engined Twin-Hurricane?  >:D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on December 04, 2012, 02:39:39 PM
Of course, the 6-engined Twin-Hurricane needed more solidity, thus had linked tailplanes:

Nice  :)
With props at front of each fuselage you have the 8 engine Twin-Hurricane. In this case a second person is needed as flight engineer to monitor those 8 engines.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 05, 2012, 02:11:20 AM
Like this?
Thanks finsrin! ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Cliffy B on December 05, 2012, 02:19:23 AM
That's an air racer all right!  Only problem would be taking off without running out of gas  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 05, 2012, 02:28:56 AM
Thanks...
Here is an improved view, for the double-propellers less pixelized:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Hurri2_j.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 05, 2012, 01:35:03 PM
With just the 2 engines in the nose, the range is better but there is less fun :(
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 05, 2012, 04:49:33 PM
Interesting look.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 06, 2012, 02:09:49 AM
Thanks.
While the difference is more easy to see on the 3-engined Twin-Hurricane
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on December 06, 2012, 12:47:23 PM
With just the 2 engines in the nose, the range is better but there is less fun :(

Sure looks nice though!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 06, 2012, 01:06:59 PM
Thanks for your psychological rescue, apophenia :) :) ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on December 06, 2012, 09:11:11 PM
With just the 2 engines in the nose, the range is better but there is less fun :(

Sure looks nice though!  :)

I concur with my esteemed colleague!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 07, 2012, 12:48:41 AM
Thanks to both of you :)
And here are twin-boom Hurricanes and asymmetric Hurricanes:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on December 07, 2012, 06:59:29 AM
Love it! Hurricane meets Fokker G.1 and their offspring finds its own path  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 08, 2012, 01:45:49 PM
One for you Tophe:

(http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/attachments/aircraft-design-aerodynamics-new-technology/11991d1303667210-airplane-design-competition-front-quarter-perspective.jpg)
(http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/attachments/aircraft-design-aerodynamics-new-technology/12009d1303894192-airplane-design-competition-11990d1303666513-airplane-design-competition-front-quarter-iso-inboard.jpg)

Found here (http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com/forums/aircraft-design-aerodynamics-new-technology/10028-airplane-design-competition-4.htm).
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 08, 2012, 02:46:28 PM
Thanks to have thought of my craziness seeing it...
Though, it was in my collection http://cmeunier.chez-alice.fr/Asymm_addition.htm (http://cmeunier.chez-alice.fr/Asymm_addition.htm) since 2011/10/02nd
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 22, 2012, 04:29:23 PM
Thanks to http://xp-82twinmustangproject.blogspot.be/2011_10_01_archive.html (http://xp-82twinmustangproject.blogspot.be/2011_10_01_archive.html) here are Twin-Mustangs cousins/forefathers:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 23, 2012, 02:19:08 PM
Dear Raafif's creativity about asymmetric aircraft (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=852.240 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=852.240) ) made me react with an asymmetric Spitfire, Mk.141, powerful...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 23, 2012, 02:35:02 PM
A wrong historian spoke of the Spitfire Mk 141Z zwillingfire. Lies... This was not a Spitfire but the Mk 141 of the Twin-Spitfire family:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on December 24, 2012, 01:22:32 PM
I am liking those asymetrical Spits  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 27, 2013, 02:21:52 AM
Thanks Apophenia... :)

In 1975 or 1977, I have read (in our French selling propaganda) that the YF-16 canopy would be broken by a simple bird... Well, as it proved wrong, our old Mirages may have changed their canopies too in a more modern way:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 27, 2013, 03:40:57 AM
Oooo...interesting.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 28, 2013, 12:59:13 AM
Thanks.
And here are :
- an asymmetric Twin-Mirage
- a Mirage 5GB of the Aggressor French squadron (ordered by General Napoleon IV...)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on January 29, 2013, 11:32:22 AM
Love the Mirage 5GB ... 'Teddy' Petter would be proud  ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 10, 2013, 12:22:39 PM
Thanks Apophenia.

This one is a Zwilling from http://www.samolotypolskie.pl/samoloty/1604/126/Leja (http://www.samolotypolskie.pl/samoloty/1604/126/Leja) :
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on February 12, 2013, 12:53:09 AM
Love the Mirage 5GB ... 'Teddy' Petter would be proud  ;)

Indeed! Wasn't there a Folland Super-Gnat proposal that was somewhat similar? Either way, it's a really good idea Tophe!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 07, 2013, 01:04:14 AM
Thanks!

And here is a B-29 contaminated by the V-3420 inline engines of its P-58 escort...:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on March 07, 2013, 01:10:30 AM
Home run on this one   :)
Cool bomber and escort  8)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: jorel62 on March 07, 2013, 01:33:42 AM
Very nice......
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on March 07, 2013, 02:22:42 AM
Thanks!

And here is a B-29 contaminated by the V-3420 inline engines of its P-58 escort...:
A.K.A.  B-39 (well, if it had gone operational, the testbed was the XB-39)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 07, 2013, 02:28:10 AM
(http://www.afwing.com/intro/b29/xb39.jpg)(http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4113/5412707154_67b0058e18_z.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 07, 2013, 02:41:02 AM
Well, if this one did exist, I must invent something else... like this zwilling asymmetric B-29Z:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 07, 2013, 02:50:31 AM
That's the spirit!! :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 09, 2013, 10:33:22 AM
from http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,5813.30.html (http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,5813.30.html) the very first Kikka design which was twin-boom.
I add what-if derivatives : single-engined with the possibility to bale out or eating less pebbles on the ground...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 09, 2013, 01:29:12 PM
And the Dassault designers have been inspired by the Cutlass, at a time when twin-fins became the rule (YF-12, F-14, F-15, YF-17...), thus the Mirage 5TF:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 09, 2013, 01:40:33 PM
Nice
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 11, 2013, 10:31:47 AM
Well, if this one did exist, I must invent something else... like this zwilling asymmetric B-29Z:

Nice! And those Chain Lightning cowlings look a lot better than the XB-39's too  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on March 11, 2013, 07:26:15 PM
Nice Twin-Boomers and Mirage!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 17, 2013, 01:20:07 PM
Thanks!

And now from the Blohm und Voss Patent DE676631 (filed in 1936, published in 1939*), I imagine a P.676631 project of 1943 for a wooden stealth single-seater...
* see http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/mosaics?CC=DE&NR=676631C&KC=C&FT=D&ND=3&date=19390608&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP (http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/mosaics?CC=DE&NR=676631C&KC=C&FT=D&ND=3&date=19390608&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on March 17, 2013, 02:18:24 PM
Now that can be a cool styrene bash.  Approximately it anyway.  Good drawing, am liking it  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: jorel62 on March 17, 2013, 07:45:10 PM
Very cool Tophe......
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 23, 2013, 04:41:15 PM
Thanks!

Now I must break the Mirage 5F legend. According to historians, the Mirage 5F was a French embargoed Mirage 5J. Wrong: this was at first a Mirage 5Fusée (Rocket):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 23, 2013, 06:09:56 PM
Ups, I had forgotten I already invented presented the Mirage 5 Fusée. So let me go one step further, revealing the top secret Mirage 5F-16 that inspired the YF-16 pirat design... ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on March 23, 2013, 09:17:19 PM
Nice ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: jorel62 on March 23, 2013, 09:29:59 PM
sweet......
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 24, 2013, 02:58:17 AM
Interesting.  Need more images of the last one.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 28, 2013, 12:32:15 PM
Like this?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on March 28, 2013, 06:08:46 PM
Blohm und Voss one is excellent!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 30, 2013, 05:09:04 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 03, 2013, 08:29:44 AM
Thanks!
And here are the Mirage 5DD biplane double-delta, and the Mirage 5H high wing:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 18, 2013, 11:52:27 PM
Spitfire Mk 25 Jet-Spitfire
Spitfire Mk 26 Twin-Jet-Spitfire
Spitfire Mk 27 Half-Twin-Jet-Spitfire
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on April 19, 2013, 02:11:03 AM
Tophe,

What about some twinned Skyraiders?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on April 19, 2013, 02:16:27 AM
Great ones :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 19, 2013, 11:50:48 AM
Thanks JP!

What about some twinned Skyraiders?
Here is the XBT2D-1Z of 1945, yes:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on April 19, 2013, 01:16:28 PM
I'm sick of asymetric aircraft, Tophe .... how about some asymetric cars ?? ???

from the famous Virgil Xner Jr. ....
(http://www.madle.org/xjxspynx04.jpg)
(http://www.madle.org/xjxspynx05.jpg)
http://www.madle.org/estutz.htm (http://www.madle.org/estutz.htm)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 19, 2013, 06:59:55 PM
funny, thanks!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on April 20, 2013, 04:09:37 AM
 ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on April 20, 2013, 04:09:53 AM
Thanks JP!

What about some twinned Skyraiders?
Here is the XBT2D-1Z of 1945, yes:

 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 25, 2013, 07:53:26 AM
Thanks.
And here are the Blohm und Voss Bv 250Z, one fantasy and two serious:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: jorel62 on April 25, 2013, 08:41:43 AM
That must be huge.......
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on April 25, 2013, 10:12:22 AM
Like to build 1/72 of bottom configuration as cargo or tanker.
Basis kits that pop to mind are C-97 and C-130 and P3 and B-29.
Ju-290/390 converted to nose wheel ?
Same for Lancaster/Stirling ?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 25, 2013, 11:30:19 PM
Thanks.
I've included several Twin-Lancasters on my site http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/twin_boom_whatif_1939_45.htm (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/twin_boom_whatif_1939_45.htm) but I am glad to add a new one today:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on April 26, 2013, 02:21:07 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on April 26, 2013, 07:33:44 AM
Thanks.
And here are the Blohm und Voss Bv 250Z, one fantasy and two serious:

Those would make fantastic trans-oceanic airliners!

Just wonderful, Tophe!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 28, 2013, 04:05:02 PM
Thanks Brian.
And here are the Moskito, Asymmetric-Moskito, Twin-Moskito:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 28, 2013, 05:09:59 PM
ANd the 3-engined twin-boom Ta-354:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on April 29, 2013, 06:25:16 AM
I like both of your twin-boomed Moskitos  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 29, 2013, 02:43:19 PM
Thanks apophenia...
And here is the jet version:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on April 29, 2013, 06:10:49 PM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 30, 2013, 10:13:29 AM
Thanks. And here is a variation of the Klemm 25 zwilling, for group training...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on April 30, 2013, 12:55:21 PM
I like the jet Moskito but your zwilling Klemm is really cute!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on April 30, 2013, 10:31:37 PM
Love the TA-154!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 01, 2013, 08:49:03 AM
Thanks lauhof!

And here is the Stout C-65Z:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on May 01, 2013, 01:55:33 PM
really like those stout Stouts :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 01, 2013, 04:25:25 PM
Uh? Does Mr Stout's name mean something? (like Mr Miller, my cousin)
I asked Google and they are lots of meaning, thanks a lot!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on May 02, 2013, 08:59:48 AM
Stout means short, solid, pudgy, compact ..... & is also a dark beer made using roasted malt or roasted barley or hops  ;)

a mod on your design ....
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 02, 2013, 11:25:40 AM
Wonderful, thanks Raafif! :-* :-*
I have a question: how did you do it? If I had given you the cdr vectorial file, it would have been rather easy, but without it, how? ???
PS. Could I add both of them on my site http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/twin_boom_whatif_1939_45.htm (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/twin_boom_whatif_1939_45.htm) ?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on May 02, 2013, 01:43:20 PM
I simply saved your pic as a bitmap (needed conversion in another photo program) then used MS Paint - copy, paste & clean up with the eraser tool, re-draw the few lost parts of lines & use iPhoto Express to fill in the colour.  All my software is 15+ yrs old.

Yes, you can post my drawings on your site (note I fixed the text on them) ......
                but if any mother's-in-Law complain you'll have to handle it - I'll be hiding ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 02, 2013, 05:20:24 PM
I understand: re-drawing was the key!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on May 03, 2013, 12:52:19 PM
two more ..... I still have another idea for the weekend to do ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 03, 2013, 01:23:48 PM
Great additions, thanks! :-* :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on May 04, 2013, 06:25:42 AM
here's the final version :-\ ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 04, 2013, 08:04:02 AM
Wow! What a designer you are!  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 04, 2013, 11:25:06 AM
And now something different: the AGA XLRG-1 (marine glider) gave birth to the G&A XP-74. This is poorly known, maybe becuse it is unreal ???
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on May 07, 2013, 05:50:20 AM
Wow now that's an innovative concept! A twin-boom/fuselage aircraft with a pusher-tractor engine in the middle!

If only to have 1/10th of your wonderful imagination, mon ami...

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 07, 2013, 07:02:36 AM
Thanks Brian, while... I must confess this does not come from my imagination but from a Bellanca patent of the early 1930s... ???
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 07, 2013, 07:08:07 AM
Thanks Brian, while... I must confess this does not come from my imagination but from a Bellanca patent of the early 1930s... ???
I found it again rather easily, it is patent US2140783 of 1937:
http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/mosaics?CC=US&NR=2140783A&KC=A&FT=D&ND=3&date=19381220&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP (http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/mosaics?CC=US&NR=2140783A&KC=A&FT=D&ND=3&date=19381220&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on May 07, 2013, 07:14:06 AM
Ahhh I had no idea, Tophe. This is the second time today I've learned something here.

Still, I prefer your version to the original Bellanca design.

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 08, 2013, 06:08:55 AM
Thanks Brian.

Now the Doblhoff WNF342 helicopter is famous, but the WNF343 derivative airplane is not:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 08, 2013, 09:43:37 AM
Quite an improvement, really  ;D  Nice work Tophe!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 10, 2013, 08:18:19 AM
Thanks Apophenia.

Now archives have demonstrated that, while the Centre NC.900 was just a French Fw-190, the NC.900Z was different from the Fw-190Z:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 14, 2013, 03:59:15 PM
From Hungary, the cargo glider Rubik R21 and derivative of mine:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on May 14, 2013, 04:03:58 PM
Seaplane in "Floaty" is cool  8)
Another one of those wanna build it in styrene designs.  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 15, 2013, 11:03:41 AM
Thanks finsrin.

Now, from the Hasegawa Hitachi A6M2K trainer can be made a Twin-Zero with tandem seats:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on May 15, 2013, 11:30:50 AM
Thanks finsrin.

Now, from the Hasegawa Hitachi A6M2K trainer can be made a Twin-Zero with tandem seats:

Why not a single seat on one side and tandem seats on the other.  The single seat could be the pilot and the tandem seats could be high-ranking, or otherwise important, passengers.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 15, 2013, 03:24:50 PM
Yes, thanks engineer, the Hitachi factory produces these extra versions immediately:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 17, 2013, 02:46:30 AM
While the CASA C-2111 was just a normal Heinkel He-111, the C-2111Z was different from the He-111Z:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on May 17, 2013, 08:09:10 AM
makes much more sense than wasting a 2nd crew in the other fuselage :)

I was going to do a zwiling on your AGA XLRG-2 marine glider ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 17, 2013, 08:43:11 AM
The Rubik R21! You do find thre rarities Tophe!  :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 18, 2013, 01:02:52 AM
Thanks.
And as Doblhoff did, AGA/Firestone/G&A transformed an autogyro into an airplane:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 18, 2013, 04:00:04 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 18, 2013, 04:08:43 AM
Nice! I like that you've retained the up-turned tips to the horizontal tail  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 23, 2013, 02:23:00 AM
Thanks again.

Here is a push-pull twin-engined Spitfire:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 23, 2013, 02:36:21 AM
And further from the original Spitfire: a pusher one:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on May 24, 2013, 01:30:49 AM
I like the pusher Spit!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 24, 2013, 02:37:17 AM
Yes, the PushSpit is destined to drive the purists wild!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 24, 2013, 11:00:10 PM
Thanks a lot...

And after the relative success (and safety) of the Spitfire-floatplane, the Griffon-Spitfire was fitted with spats:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 25, 2013, 01:27:58 AM
Spitfire/Spitacobra/FTB-Spitfire:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 26, 2013, 02:50:00 AM
Twin-Spitacobra:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_r.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on May 26, 2013, 06:26:27 AM
mixed engine positions ?  The right fuselage seems to have the engine in the nose but the forward cockpit seems to mean a mid-engine for the left fuselage !
Can you add the exhaust stubs to show it ?? ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 26, 2013, 01:57:53 PM
Both have mid-engine. The starboard fuselage has a cockpit at the same position as a P-39 and the port fuselage has a cockpit at the same position as a FTB Mustang...
Drawing oblical curved exhaust pipes in slanting view is not easy, I may try but I am not sure to get a satisfying result.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on May 26, 2013, 03:40:11 PM
Spitacobra is top!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 26, 2013, 05:00:29 PM
Thanks!
Here is the view with exhaust pipes:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Spitfire_t_zps08464726.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 26, 2013, 05:18:35 PM
(Thanks Raafif:) here is the Twin-Spitacobra/3e:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_u.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 27, 2013, 08:41:11 AM
Great! I love the extra assymetry on the Twin-Spitacobra/3e  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on May 27, 2013, 10:27:16 AM
Perhaps a "/3f" with two engiens per side but just a cockpit on one side?  It would be a really hot interceptor.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 27, 2013, 11:36:54 AM
Thanks Apophenia!

While... here is the Supermayerle Twin-Spitacobra/4e, hot!:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_v.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 28, 2013, 10:22:00 AM
Yowza! That's a powerful looking beast!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 31, 2013, 12:22:37 AM
Thanks!

Demaizière-Joffrin preliminary designs:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_DJ12_h.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 31, 2013, 06:56:43 AM
Nice! For those not familiar with the original, pusher DJ.12: http://maquette72.free.fr/amis/Gaetan/2011_07_dj12/index07.php (http://maquette72.free.fr/amis/Gaetan/2011_07_dj12/index07.php)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 01, 2013, 01:56:02 AM
Thanks Apophenia.
Here is the Dornier P.231 Entwurf2 and my E3...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 01, 2013, 02:25:19 AM
I like the twin engined one.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 07, 2013, 11:28:48 PM
Thanks.

And from http://longstreet.typepad.com/books/2010/11/wwii-aircraft-cross-sections.html (http://longstreet.typepad.com/books/2010/11/wwii-aircraft-cross-sections.html)
here is the Davis Davis (and a single-engined derivative of mine): UK-Davis airplane with a US-Davis huge gun...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: perttime on August 08, 2013, 02:41:49 AM
Huh!
The Davis Non-Recoil Gun: shoots grenades from the front end and buckshot from the rear end (to make it recoilless)...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 16, 2013, 01:05:03 AM
Thanks for this detail.
And here are the derivatives of the Antonov LEM-2 planerlet. This was a motorglider flying wing before 1939, and its 1939-derivatives used an even smaller engine, as addition than all alone:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_LEM2_b.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 19, 2013, 11:38:07 AM
As well: the Letov S56 design was dated before 1939, but the derivatives with in-line engines (asymmetrical or not) are dated 1939:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/S56E_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 20, 2013, 12:43:27 PM
The Hamburger Ha-138 (then Blohm und Voss Bv-138) was as well designed before 1939, but all seems lies or propaganda about this, and here are the "Real" Ha-139, Ha-140, and asymmetric Ha-141, all designed in 1939 (like especially for my collection!):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_BV138_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 24, 2013, 12:58:30 PM
The triplex-boomer "XP-56 with Auxiliary Wing" may be the source of two twin-boomers: one with tandem wings and no central fin, one still a tailless airplane somehow:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_XP-56_zzb.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 28, 2013, 10:34:03 AM
from ericr's great topic http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=3546.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=3546.0) :
([url]http://i1274.photobucket.com/albums/y435/ericr63/hyd/do18z_zpsce5f0140.jpg[/url])
I have added the rest of the family: standard Do18, Mistel Do18 and the simplified Do18Z-2...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 28, 2013, 09:11:06 PM
It is famous that an argument occured among Historians: was the Arado 530 just an Arado code or an official code with preliminary order? With secrecy now over, I can tell everything (beyond Reality):
- the E530 was an Arado project, twin-fuselage, with asymmetry in the pilot position
- the official Ar-530A was a twin-boom derivative featuring a free nose (P38-way) probably to send flowers to foreign aircraft
- the Ar-530B was coming back to twin-fuselage layout, with less asymmetry if ever one engine fails
- the Ar-530C went further with fuselage asymmetry of the Ar-530B
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 29, 2013, 08:11:49 AM
The huge Daimler-Benz Projekt C came from smaller designs:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_DaimlerS_a.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 29, 2013, 08:33:28 AM
smaller and smaller indeed:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_DaimlerS_b.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 30, 2013, 01:13:29 AM
I was dissatisfied with my twin-boom Spitfires, looking like Spitfires no more. I had to try again:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_w.JPG)
Is this better?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on September 30, 2013, 09:19:03 AM
Very nice Tophe! Much more 'Spitty'  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 02, 2013, 12:13:36 PM
Thanks a lot Apophenia.
I may do the same with the Mustang 51D, in a step by step way making the comparison easier:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51_bl.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on October 02, 2013, 02:04:01 PM
I like that P-51 P-2!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 04, 2013, 12:44:24 PM
Thanks ChernayaAkula!
Will you like also the turbojet version P-51TJ-2?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51_bo.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on October 04, 2013, 01:16:55 PM
So many cool  8) slanting views in the last month.  I have been remiss on commenting  :-[
Majority of symetric views I would like to build in styrene.  Don't have time to, but WOW might get to a couple of them "someday".
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on October 04, 2013, 02:55:18 PM
Thanks ChernayaAkula!
Will you like also the turbojet version P-51TJ-2?

I do!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: raafif on October 05, 2013, 04:20:13 AM
I like the P-51 TJ-1 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 05, 2013, 02:48:01 PM
Thanks!
Of course, a jet-Mustang does not need to be twin-boom:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51_br.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 05, 2013, 05:13:36 PM
The twin-fuselage versions were called Twin-MustJet:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51_bs.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 05, 2013, 10:18:44 PM
The Gotha Go-245 was designed as a mix of (from starboard to port) Go 242, Go 244A, Go 244B...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_GO244A_c.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 08, 2013, 02:38:17 AM
Mustangs with kinda giant spats, reduced from a Daimler-Benz mother-ship project. Safe landing with them!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51_by.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 11, 2013, 12:39:27 PM
At http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=957.195 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=957.195) dear ysi_maniac invented the missing link between Dassault Super-Mystère B2 and Mirage III. Here is the Super-Mirage B5 derivative of it:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zi_zpsdbb47366.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 12, 2013, 03:28:34 AM
Interesting.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 13, 2013, 02:54:58 AM
Thanks!
And... as there were classical (famous) Spitfires and twin-boom (secret) Spitfires, there were twin-boom (classical) SAAB J.21 and classical (secret) J.21:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_J21c_zps2c09d57c.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 13, 2013, 03:12:47 AM
That's why there were both twin-fuselage J.21Z and twin-boom J.21Z:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_J21d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 13, 2013, 03:53:02 AM
That's why there were both twin-fuselage J.21Z and twin-boom J.21Z:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_J21d.JPG[/url])


The twin-boom J.21Z looks like the ancestor to this:

(http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20071028184850/starwars/images/1/18/Cloud_Car_NEGVV.jpg)
(http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20081001130442/starwars/images/c/cd/Cloudcar_schem.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 13, 2013, 09:07:01 AM
Science-fiction year 2040? Nice! (no need of wings in outer space)

EDIT: in fact (as long as Reality is concerned!), my favorite J.21Z was the strongly asymmetric push-pull one:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_J21e.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ysi_maniac on October 14, 2013, 09:54:29 AM

The twin-boom J.21Z looks like the ancestor to this:

([url]http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20071028184850/starwars/images/1/18/Cloud_Car_NEGVV.jpg[/url])
([url]http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20081001130442/starwars/images/c/cd/Cloudcar_schem.jpg[/url])

What is this? two flying shoes?  :P
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ysi_maniac on October 14, 2013, 09:55:55 AM
At [url]http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=957.195[/url] ([url]http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=957.195[/url]) dear ysi_maniac invented the missing link between Dassault Super-Mystère B2 and Mirage III. Here is the Super-Mirage B5 derivative of it:
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zi_zpsdbb47366.jpg[/url])

Thanks for your recreation!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 14, 2013, 11:12:40 AM
Thanks also.

Now here is the compound Spitfire model that may be built with one 1/48 kit and two 1/72nd:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_x.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on October 15, 2013, 03:40:49 AM
Very nice Tophe! I like the P-51T-2 and Saab variations too  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 16, 2013, 01:00:42 AM
Thanks a lot Apophenia!
Well, as you like the P-51T-2 canard and Saab variations, I must present the top-secret Saab canard (J.21-55) and its zwilling derivative...:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_J21f.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on October 16, 2013, 05:20:21 PM
You never run out of imagination: keep it up :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 20, 2013, 01:11:16 AM
Thanks!
And here are derivatives of the Burnelli B-2000:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Burnelli_a.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on October 24, 2013, 09:30:05 AM
Always nice to see Burnellis  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 29, 2013, 12:58:40 AM
Thanks Apophenia!

And here is the twin-booming of the Curtiss P-40 Hawk:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-40z_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 29, 2013, 01:46:40 AM
Final step of the P-40 twin-boomation:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-40z_e.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Logan Hartke on October 29, 2013, 02:13:45 AM
And here is the twin-booming of the Curtiss P-40 Hawk:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-40z_d.JPG[/url])


I don't see what the advantage of the middle one would be, but I really like it!  It has a Crimson Skies feel to it.

Cheers,

Logan
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 29, 2013, 03:45:44 AM
Ditto!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 29, 2013, 12:53:10 PM
I don't see what the advantage of the middle one would be, but I really like it!  It has a Crimson Skies feel to it.
The advantage would be: testing the twin-boom layout (intended for the final pusher step) without having yet the tools to manufacture a brand new fuselage/pod. Maybe.

But you are right, Logan, this seems not plausible a story. So I must reveal the 'Real' one ;) : the proposed twin-engined P-40 was a push-pull twin-boom aircraft, inspired by the Fokker D-XXIII, but the test pilots refused to fly it (in case of bailing out) so the rear propeller was moved ahead. No?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-40z_f.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 09, 2013, 06:37:58 PM
From the Savoia-Marchetti SM.88 came in 1944 the SIAI-Marchetti SM.88C:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_SM88_zf.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on November 10, 2013, 04:30:41 AM
Love the twin-boom P-40s!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 19, 2013, 01:25:38 AM
Thanks!

And inspired by the Arado Ar-555 turned into canard Ar-1055 by the Big Gimper at http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=3794.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=3794.0)
here is a Zwilling Ar-2055:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_AR555_s.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: PR19_Kit on November 19, 2013, 03:13:49 AM
That would be with TWENTY engines when it's fully kitted out then Tophe?  ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 19, 2013, 11:58:23 AM
What?!? :icon_surprised: :( >:D 20 engines on an Arado plane? Hey, Beyond the Sprues is not Beyond (mental) Sanity! while, uh... you are very right, Kit, I forgot that the Ar-1055 had 4 engines, 2 times 2, so the Ar-2055 would have probably 4 times 2 = 8. Thanks for this correction! ;)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_AR555_t.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: PR19_Kit on November 19, 2013, 03:00:15 PM
The stock Revell A555 has six engines Tophe, arranged across the trailing edge between the two fins. It's just that The Big Gimper hasn't installed the rear engines in his piccies yet. So adding his four at  the front AND doubling up for your twin makes it twenty.  :)

(http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/1692/xq0c.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on November 19, 2013, 03:08:36 PM
BTW - 1990s release box art did not have F-80 fighters.  Were no fighters.
Wonder how F-80A would have done in pursuit of Ar 555 ?
Based on my limited reading; bet drop tanks would have to be dropped for any hope of attack from rear.
Better chance with F-80C
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 20, 2013, 01:12:39 AM
The stock Revell A555 has six engines Tophe, arranged across the trailing edge between the two fins. It's just that The Big Gimper hasn't installed the rear engines in his piccies yet. So adding his four at  the front AND doubling up for your twin makes it twenty.  :)
Oh, you are right, sorry... ;)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_AR555_u.JPG)
Maybe a twin-Shooting-Star could be a right opponent?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on November 20, 2013, 02:32:02 AM
And thus the down fall of Hitler's Empire was the lack of sufficient engine technicians... ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: PR19_Kit on November 20, 2013, 02:48:12 AM
Now that REALLY looks the business Tophe, terrific stuff!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 20, 2013, 03:07:34 AM
Thanks Kit!

And thus the down fall of Hitler's Empire was the lack of sufficient engine technicians... ;)
I am glad the Ar-2055C project brought Hitler's defeat!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on November 20, 2013, 04:51:43 AM
They're wicked!  ;D

How about a 1055 with jet engines on the pylons near the cockpit and some nice, big prop(s) (maybe even contra-rotating) on the trailing edge? Turboprop engines, maybe? Jets for take-off and dashes over the target and the props for long-range endurance...  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 20, 2013, 08:41:08 AM
OK for your prefering the 1055 than the zwilling 2055, but I need 2 tails... ???
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_AR555_w.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on November 20, 2013, 08:47:08 AM
This latest series of postings are more swell kitbash concepts. :)   Lucky if I can get to building even one.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on November 20, 2013, 11:46:54 AM
Nixce!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ysi_maniac on November 24, 2013, 11:50:19 AM
20 engines :) I like!! :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 24, 2013, 06:33:22 PM
Thanks ysi...
and thanks to your wonderful batch of XLs at http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=957.270 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=957.270) here are P-38XLs made today:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairH_aaae.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 27, 2013, 03:41:53 AM
Douglas Twin-Dauntless:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_G.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 27, 2013, 12:24:30 PM
Other Twin-Dauntless(es?), asymmetric:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_h.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on November 27, 2013, 12:35:11 PM
Such a surprise to see slanting Dauntless views.  :)
Could you treat us to a slanting SBDJ Dauntless II view ?

http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2747.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2747.0)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 27, 2013, 01:38:29 PM
I will work on it, now I must go to work. See you soon...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on November 28, 2013, 02:42:51 AM
I like.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 28, 2013, 02:55:37 AM
Such a surprise to see slanting Dauntless views.  :)
Could you treat us to a slanting SBDJ Dauntless II view ?
[url]http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2747.0[/url] ([url]http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2747.0[/url])
Here it comes. That's a first try though, I am not satisfied with my drawing, sorry...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_j.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on November 28, 2013, 08:34:16 AM
Thank you and not to be sorry.  I'm pleased you accomodated my request.  :)
Is a glimpse of feasibility of a styrene SBDJ-2.
Bill
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 28, 2013, 12:16:38 PM
Thanks finsrin!

Well, I have downloaded a few of your pictures to improve my drawing:
Could you treat us to a slanting SBDJ Dauntless II view ?
[url]http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2747.0[/url] ([url]http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2747.0[/url])

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Twin-Dauntless_l_zps35b9610b.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 29, 2013, 02:09:54 AM
The Dauntless could be turned into a single-seater, but... it needs a second engine to be fast enough, not to require rear defense:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_m.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on November 29, 2013, 11:31:53 AM
Your single-seat SBD-9 may not have been fast enough but it sure looks nice  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 29, 2013, 01:38:03 PM
Thanks Apophenia!

Well, if you like the single-seat (per fuselage) and dislike asymmetry, I could present the missing links between the SBD-11 and SBD-14.1: top secret SBD-12 and SBD-13:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_n.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on November 30, 2013, 06:31:00 AM
Symmetry is the new asymmetry, Tophe, and I love 'em all  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on November 30, 2013, 09:36:37 AM
How does this sound? Start with the SBD-14.1, but with the engine nacelle turned around, giving it a pusher prop. Short glazing on the nacelle for a front gunner, long glazing on the main fuselage, allowing for a tail gunner. Twin engine power, front and tail gunner, but with the frontal area smaller than a conventional twin-engine bomber. Also suitably compact for carrier use.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 30, 2013, 11:22:28 AM
Thanks Apophenia!

ChernayaAkula, I don't understand what you call tail-gunner... on a small aircraft, I fear I cannot install a rear post after the fin, à la B-29...
For the rest, it is not easy to draw a pusher radial but I have tried:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_q.JPG)
Thanks!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on November 30, 2013, 12:20:43 PM
Lot of possible SBD growth vartiations  :)
Glimpses of Naval Air that could have been....
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 30, 2013, 07:34:41 PM
Thanks!
I go again with ChernayaAkula's words about a tail post. In a what-if World, nothing is impossible, but shouldn't I install tandem wings?:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Twin-Dauntless_s_zps58aed151.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on November 30, 2013, 10:23:04 PM
Yeah, "tail gunner" was a bit misleading, I guess. Rear gunner would've been more accurate. Your rendition of the SBD-14.4 is exactly what I had in mind, though. Very cool!  :)  8)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 01, 2013, 02:15:28 AM
Thanks for confirming the SBD-14.4 aspect :)
Thanks also for the misunderstanding about the tail post, that created the Douglas-Delanne SBD-16&17:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_u.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 01, 2013, 03:31:44 PM
The SBD-18 also coming from the misunderstanding about the tail-post, thanks again ChernayaAkula!:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_v.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 02, 2013, 01:37:00 AM
Well, let us stop delirium, welcome seriousness: the SBD Dauntless (SBD-19 like the others) was a single-fin two-seater with a single engine (located on the centerline):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_w.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 03, 2013, 01:37:10 AM
A different B-51 (and the B-82): the SuperMustang (and TwinSuperMustang) mix of 1/144 B-29 and 1/48 P-51D
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_B29z_j.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Cliffy B on December 03, 2013, 04:30:05 AM
Darn it if those SBDs aren't cool and oh man, that B-51/B-82/whatever you call it..... :o 8) :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: The Big Gimper on December 03, 2013, 05:57:35 AM
A different B-51 (and the B-82): the SuperMustang (and TwinSuperMustang) mix of 1/144 B-29 and 1/48 P-51D
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_B29z_j.JPG[/url])


Drool .... Big wings.   :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 03, 2013, 10:23:50 AM
Thanks!

Closer to "Real-World" B-51s (still reduced size to match a P-51): :-\
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_B51_b.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 05, 2013, 02:18:29 AM
Caproni Ca.380 Corsaro family:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Ca380_-a.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 05, 2013, 02:22:24 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ChernayaAkula on December 05, 2013, 07:52:39 AM
Coooool!  8)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on December 07, 2013, 09:11:14 PM
Always very interesting
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 10, 2013, 12:53:03 AM
Thanks!
And here is the Blohm und Voss Bv-141Z/1m:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Bv141z_q.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on December 10, 2013, 04:31:19 AM
B-51 is Top, Tophe!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 11, 2013, 01:07:42 AM
Thanks.
And here is the twin-boom version of the Ju-88:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Ju88z1_v52.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 11, 2013, 02:23:28 AM
Cool.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 12, 2013, 02:48:21 AM
Thanks!
And here are light derivatives of the P-61 Black Widow:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-61_b.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 12, 2013, 04:49:06 AM
That top one is interesting - could be quite build able too.  Maybe a stepping stone towards the F-15/P-61E?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 12, 2013, 09:14:20 AM
Thanks.
You are very right (wright?): the light-P-61 (especially in its bubble-top form below) was the missing link between the standard P-61 and the XP-61E
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-61_c.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 12, 2013, 10:30:29 AM
I quite like your "birdcage" look.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 13, 2013, 12:47:07 AM
Uh? I thought the bubble canopy was the opposite of a birdcage canopy, no?
How do you call the canopy below? not birdcage?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-61_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 13, 2013, 02:18:23 AM
Yes, the bubble is opposite to birdcage - I was simply stating that I preferred your first (i.e. birdcage) one over the more recent one.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 15, 2013, 01:44:22 AM
All right. And here are Mustangs with either birdcages or bubbles:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P82-51_dh_zps037d4caf.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 17, 2013, 01:24:45 PM
Nakajima twin-boom project (and what-if derivative of mine):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Nakajima_TB_g.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 20, 2013, 03:38:26 AM
A half Belyayev OI-2 Tvin-Aerokobra would have been similar to a P-39:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_OI-2_zz_zps14b88c4c.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ysi_maniac on December 21, 2013, 02:10:42 AM
I like AeroKobra. The plane and the name. ;) :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 22, 2013, 01:59:39 AM
Thanks!
And here is the completed family (in my dreams): from twin-fuselage to twin-boom pusher:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_OI-2_zza.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 04, 2014, 11:17:22 AM
The General Aircraft Twin-Hotspur is well known, but what about the Triple-Hotspur and the Twinboom-Hotspur?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_GAL48B_c.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: PR19_Kit on January 04, 2014, 03:56:28 PM
The Twin-Boom Hotspur looks eminently modellable there. I did the Twin many years ago and I still have an old Frog Hotspur in The Loft......  ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 04, 2014, 08:21:31 PM
With these long long wings? as designed for you...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 05, 2014, 02:46:23 AM
That first one reminds me a bit of the real world Twin Blanik:

(http://s002.radikal.ru/i199/1001/f3/df9baf554441.jpg)

Which you can get a model kit of:

(http://umm-usa.com/onlinestore/images/AMC4802.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 05, 2014, 02:48:51 AM
I did the Twin many years ago and I still have an old Frog Hotspur in The Loft......  ;)


Bit like this perhaps?

(http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL1312/4776356/16163162/309730735.jpg)
(http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL1312/4776356/16163162/309730733.jpg)

More here (http://airfixtributeforum.myfastforum.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=8485&start=20)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 05, 2014, 03:01:11 AM
Thanks for this parallel and this link!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: PR19_Kit on January 05, 2014, 03:17:50 AM
I did the Twin many years ago and I still have an old Frog Hotspur in The Loft......  ;)

Bit like this perhaps?

Pretty much EXACTLY like that, except mine has a vestigial Y-shaped tow-line attached to each fuselage.

It was even moulded in that bilious yellow styrene so beloved of Frog at the period, almost everything they did was in yellow, perhaps it cost less as raw material just because it was such a bizarre colour?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ysi_maniac on January 05, 2014, 04:02:55 AM
A different B-51 (and the B-82): the SuperMustang (and TwinSuperMustang) mix of 1/144 B-29 and 1/48 P-51D
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_B29z_j.JPG[/url])

I do like this idea!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 12, 2014, 12:07:20 AM
Thanks ysi_maniac!

Kit, I am glad I did not understood what you were saying, about Y shape on each fuselage of the Twin-Hotspur: that produced in my dreams the GAL-48YY:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_GAL48B_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: PR19_Kit on January 12, 2014, 02:41:43 AM
Kit, I am glad I did not understood what you were saying, about Y shape on each fuselage of the Twin-Hotspur: that produced in my dreams the GAL-48YY:

Hehehe, it was the TOW line that was Y shaped Tophe! But I like your Y tail, like a twin glider version of the Planet Satellite.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 12, 2014, 06:19:53 PM
The Planet Satellite of 1948? You seem to ignore this was a derivative of the motorglider GAL-48ZZ: ;)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_GAL48B_e.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 17, 2014, 03:22:41 PM
Venezuela's V-tail Mustangs:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P82-51B_ai.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 18, 2014, 03:22:56 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 25, 2014, 07:52:15 PM
Mirage 5 TB:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zj_zps91cb2aa9.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 26, 2014, 02:11:27 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on January 27, 2014, 12:52:42 PM
I do like that Mirage 5 TB.   :) Tempting to go twin-engined on that delta.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 28, 2014, 12:01:58 AM
Thanks for this idea, of a Mirage 5.2TB (with the tailless 5.2 below):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zk_zps83fa6aa2.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 03, 2014, 01:55:01 AM
Mirage 502 with 2 noses and 2 jets:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 16, 2014, 11:59:42 PM
Another Mirage 5 combination, asymmetric:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Mirage5_zm.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 17, 2014, 02:12:27 AM
Discarding the pusher propeller was considered on the Dornier 635, for a safe bailing out:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_DO635Z_ad.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on February 17, 2014, 02:54:33 AM
The Do335 (and thus Do635) did actually have an ejection seat…though reading accounts of its operation, one gets the distinct impression the rear propeller was the least of the worries...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 17, 2014, 09:10:22 AM
I don't like the word "actually", like "really", but your objection drives me pleasantly to a XB-42-like Do-635, thanks!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_DO635Z_ae.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 11, 2014, 01:31:18 AM
One of the very rare single-engined planes by Burnelli:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Burnelli2_b.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 11, 2014, 11:40:19 AM
Of course, a little asymmetry helps separating engine and passengers:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Burnelli2_c.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 15, 2014, 10:34:29 AM
I like these single-engined Burnellis!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 15, 2014, 01:49:43 PM
Thanks! One more:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Burnelli2_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on March 15, 2014, 01:54:52 PM
Those last two make for tempting kitbash subjects  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on March 16, 2014, 01:17:59 AM
Tophe, those last two look right up there with the proposed airliner version of the B-49.  I suspect the single-engine one would work for business or personal aircraft while the tri-motor would work for the airlines (FAR's forbid single-engine airliners in the US).
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 16, 2014, 02:21:32 PM
Thanks for the comments/analysis of my delirium!

Now going back to seriousness: in 1939, Renault disagreed with the Caudron C-714 design featuring their engine "Hey, do not design racers anymore, the pilot needs visibility, install the engine behind him!". Caudron won the contract anyway, the rest is History... (no twin-boomer, no victory).
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_C714R_b.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 17, 2014, 02:18:26 AM
(no twin-boomer, no victory).

On the other side, the (top secret) Bf-109Y won the France battle...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Bf109Z4_u.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 17, 2014, 03:04:44 AM
The Bf-109Y did not win the Britain battle (and the war) because on the good side was the Spitfirasy that was both twin-boomer AND asymmetric: a decisive point.
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_za.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 17, 2014, 04:24:49 AM
Love the twin-boom fighters but especially nice to see the Caudron C.714 get some attention  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 17, 2014, 02:53:57 PM
I like the Spitfirasy! :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 23, 2014, 07:38:10 PM
Thanks a lot!
Here are the Mirage 55A/B double deltas:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zzr_zpsa42d46e2.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on March 23, 2014, 08:58:35 PM
Thanks a lot!
Here are the Mirage 55A/B double deltas:

grandiose double delta!

Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 27, 2014, 12:50:44 PM
Thanks a lot, Ericr!

Now here are the 3-seat Mirage 53A/B: (I prefer the B, with a child in the front seat)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zzs_zpse0e9c8bc.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 28, 2014, 02:07:10 AM
In 1940, 2 big engines were enough for the Blohm und Voss Bv-138X, and even only one big engine (+ one old engine) on the asymmetric Bv-138Y:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_BV138_f.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 29, 2014, 04:54:29 AM
Amazing how much better the Bv 138 looks as a twin-engined aircraft! Nice work  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Volkodav on March 29, 2014, 04:56:55 AM
In 1940, 2 big engines were enough for the Blohm und Voss Bv-138X, and even only one big engine (+ one old engine) on the asymmetric Bv-138Y:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_BV138_f.JPG[/url])


Looks really good, the twin bigs in particular looks like it could / should have been built.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on March 29, 2014, 05:11:36 AM
In 1940, 2 big engines were enough for the Blohm und Voss Bv-138X, and even only one big engine (+ one old engine) on the asymmetric Bv-138Y:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_BV138_f.JPG[/url])


Gives me idea of bashing C-119 or Noratlas into a seaplane.  Hmmm....
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 29, 2014, 02:38:06 PM
Thanks for enjoying this. A truly asymmetric version would be even better (less drag):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_BV138_g.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on March 29, 2014, 04:27:53 PM


Gives me idea of bashing C-119



like this?

(http://i1274.photobucket.com/albums/y435/ericr63/hyd/img_7076s_zps6e0873bb.jpg)


or Noratlas into a seaplane.  Hmmm....


like that?

(http://i1274.photobucket.com/albums/y435/ericr63/hyd/noratlas-s_zps09799a83.jpg)

cheers
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on March 29, 2014, 04:28:16 PM
Thanks for enjoying this. A truly asymmetric version would be even better (less drag):

beautiful variations on the BV138!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 29, 2014, 04:32:42 PM
I should have guessed it drawing flying boats: there must be better marvels in Ericr's models collection! (twin-boom also) :-* :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on March 29, 2014, 11:11:08 PM
WOW - they already been built as seaplanes :o
Never would have thought to finish in those colors.  Surprised how well they work.
Thanks for sharing :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Volkodav on March 29, 2014, 11:30:20 PM
The work so many of you keep producing never ceases to amaze me. I love this site and getting to see so many works of art so often.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 30, 2014, 02:05:18 AM
Now the manned powered derivative of the unmanned engine-less XBG2:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Xbg2_f.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 30, 2014, 04:49:06 AM


Gives me idea of bashing C-119



like this?

([url]http://i1274.photobucket.com/albums/y435/ericr63/hyd/img_7076s_zps6e0873bb.jpg[/url])


or Noratlas into a seaplane.  Hmmm....


like that?

([url]http://i1274.photobucket.com/albums/y435/ericr63/hyd/noratlas-s_zps09799a83.jpg[/url])

cheers


Oh yeah! :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on March 30, 2014, 05:25:15 AM
WOW - they already been built as seaplanes :o
Never would have thought to finish in those colors.  Surprised how well they work.
Thanks for sharing :)

the choice of color is a bit personal indeed  ;)
I would certainly like seeing others have a try at these seaplanes with other colors and more refined modeling  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 05, 2014, 11:40:58 AM
The CG-16E (mass produced in 1944-45) was the motorglider version of the XCG-16 prototype cargo glider:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Burnelli2_e.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on April 05, 2014, 03:36:15 PM
Very nice! Apparently, the XCG-16 flew well on its own ... so better off as a motorglider  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 05, 2014, 10:32:40 PM
Thanks!
Now, you know the Hughes XF-11 was powered by "just" 2 engines R-4360 (3,000hp each), but do you know the ambitious Howard Hughes wanted a third engine in the nose of the F-11A hundred copies? That was the reason why the program was cancelled:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Hughes_XF11J_c.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 06, 2014, 09:59:58 PM
Why only 3 engines? In fact, the YF-11 had 4... (12,000hp single-seater) The speed is top secret.
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Hughes_XF11J_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 09, 2014, 08:25:55 AM
On the contrary: to save the F-11 program, a young designer said "one R-4360 double engine is enough", and he designed the XF-11B and XF-11C (below). The USAAF staff was much interested but the empoyee was fired out from the Hughes company...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Hughes_XF11J_f.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on April 11, 2014, 06:22:49 AM
Ooo, that Hughes with the cockpit in the starboard boom is really nice!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 12, 2014, 01:02:58 PM
Thanks apophenia!

Now, you know probably the PZL-38 Wilk but she got married with a Lockheed P-38 and the babies PZL-38D ans PZL-38Z were twin-boomers:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairJ_aabd.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on April 12, 2014, 03:28:31 PM
Like PZL-38D and PZL-38Z  :)
Be good kitbashes.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 12, 2014, 05:40:11 PM
Thanks!
Now here is the twinning of a twin-boom seaplane: the Bendix 51A
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Bendix_m.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on April 13, 2014, 03:43:16 AM
Thanks apophenia!

Now, you know probably the PZL-38 Wilk but she got married with a Lockheed P-38 and the babies PZL-38D ans PZL-38Z were twin-boomers:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P38eclairJ_aabd.JPG[/url])


I thought at first these were variants of the Breguet 693:

(http://francecrashes39-45.net/phot_tech/breguet693-1.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 13, 2014, 08:28:31 AM
You are very right: the PZL-38Z and Br-693Z were very close:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Br693Z.JPG)
(thanks...)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on April 13, 2014, 11:16:33 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 13, 2014, 02:07:10 PM
Thanks ;)

Well, at http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=4293.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=4293.0) we discussed of increasing a XF-15 up to the size of a XF-11 but what about the opposite: decreasing a XF-11 down to the size of a XF-15/P-61?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Hughes_XF11J_g.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 17, 2014, 05:26:54 PM
Mirage 5 TNST-1 & 2 (Twin-Nose Single-Tail):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zzt_zps250dc381.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 13, 2014, 11:57:21 PM
The Kogiken Ki-104 was a projected derivative of the push-pull Tachikawa Ki-94-I:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Ki_104.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 05, 2014, 11:08:02 AM
Here is the Trident-Mirage 5 (Triage-5) and Twin-Trident-Mirage-55 (Bitriage-55):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zzu_zps75b6efe9.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on July 05, 2014, 11:42:56 AM
You are very right: the PZL-38Z and Br-693Z were very close:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Br693Z.JPG[/url])
(thanks...)

Hmm, what if you used a constant-chord horizontal section between the two fuselages and spaced the two vertical tails above the horizontal surface, equally distant from the outboard vertical tails; something like a four-vertical-tail version of the OV-1 tail surfaces?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 05, 2014, 02:29:12 PM
Like this?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Br693ZOV.JPG)
Thanks for this improvement!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on July 05, 2014, 11:58:07 PM
Precisely.  I think it would work better than separate sets of twin tail surfaces as you would not get any interference drag from flows around adjacent vertical surfaces interfering with each other.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 06, 2014, 02:32:29 AM
Thanks engineer! :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 16, 2014, 10:20:54 PM
The XP-47Y, YP-47Y, P-47Y were single-engine fighters of course but they had no ugly big nose, they had 2 slim noses! The designers made a twin-boomer at last.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on August 17, 2014, 05:27:57 AM
Oooo, the final P-47Y is especially nice!   :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 17, 2014, 10:52:01 AM
Oooo, the final P-47Y is especially nice!   :)
Thanks! This one is also my favourite, as twin-boom non triplex-boom, while I wanted to show the lineage... ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on August 17, 2014, 03:32:48 PM
Oooo, the final P-47Y is especially nice!   :)

I second that, Tophe!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 26, 2014, 01:35:56 AM
The Supermarine Twin-Spitfire II was a Very Long Range fighter, shutting off one engine in cruise flight:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_zc.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Logan Hartke on August 26, 2014, 01:41:49 AM
I wouldn't want to bail out of it, but it sure does look cool!

You could just about use the engine pod from a Supermarine Seagull and put it on a Spitfire to achieve that. I'd also be interested to see your take on this variant with just the engine mounted above, no engine in the nose.

Cheers,

Logan
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 26, 2014, 01:31:36 PM
Thanks Logan for your opinion/explanation... (I was wondering why the Spitfires II below were designed this way and you gave the clue).
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_zd.JPG)
I thought the RAF officers had yelled "hey! a Spitfire must be single-engined, otherwise this is heresy!" or they wanted efficient noses (like the P-38 fighter or Fw-189 observer) but no, the reason was a safe bailing out (ventral), without unreliable explosive rear-propeller nor the obstacle by the front-propeller-shaft from the central engine. Thanks again!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 06, 2014, 01:57:19 PM
Different twin-engined Spitfires:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Spitfire_ze_zpsd61945a3.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 06, 2014, 02:43:24 PM
Of course, after the first principle sketches came the actual projects, with different fins, to protect the propellers from hurting the runway:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Spitfire_zf_zpsa36d388d.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 06, 2014, 05:46:05 PM
The final goal, of course, was a 4-engined Twin-Spitfire, of either type:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_zg.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on September 07, 2014, 02:33:52 AM
I like…although I would probably move the propellors forward a little.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 07, 2014, 05:15:10 PM
What?! For the push-pull one, the rear engine must be as close as possible to the center of gravity (the propeller being somewhere behind)...
While, for the other one, well, you are right and this was even mass-produced this way (as the famous Gupermarine-Tupermarine-Xupermarine GTX-25 Twin-Twin-Spitfire II):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Spitfire_zi.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 07, 2014, 05:29:23 PM
this was even mass-produced this way (as the famous Gupermarine-Tupermarine-Xupermarine GTX-25 Twin-Twin-Spitfire II):
A little more complex, the very-very-very-very-long-range GTX-2525 Double-Twin-Twin-Spitfire IV was not mass-produced, it was sold to Germany 1946 as Mistel-Zwilling-Spitfire:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 13, 2014, 01:10:25 AM
from Faust's great topic about the Fw-380 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=4752.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=4752.0)):
If a Mustang was good, and they made a Twin Mustang, then it stands to reason that since the FW-190 D9 was good, there really should have been a twin of that!
I don't love Reality but I just tell what I have read in Edgar Shmued (the Mustang's designer) autobiography: the Twin-Mustang was not at all a double P-51, but a far bigger airplane than a double P-51, just a derivative of a very different twin-fuselage airplane on which were installed Mustang-like features: bubble-canopy, belly-air-scoop, etc. I don't want to divert from your wonderful Fw-380 subject, so I will post the illustrated explanation in my own topic, later.
Here is the illustration proof:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 13, 2014, 11:11:40 AM
As a further demonstrating joke, here is the zwilling (twin-plane) asymmetrically built with a P-51 and a half P-82...:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51B_ca.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 19, 2014, 01:15:30 AM
With its free nose like a P-38 Lightning, the Mitsubishi A6M14-1 was very dangerous for its enemies:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 19, 2014, 10:59:23 AM
Well, as far as I am concerned, I prefer the Double Zero A6M14-2 and Triple Zero A6M14-3 (how do you say Double Zero and Triple Zero in Japanese?):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_n.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 20, 2014, 02:35:28 PM
I know I know, you will say: "this designer was a crazy lunatic: a Double-Zero did not need at all to be asymmetric!". This is right and, of course, the symmetric A6M11 Twin-Zero was designed first (with the quadruple-Zero A6M11Z as a complement, like the A6M3 gave the twin-engined twin-fuselage A6M3Z)...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_o.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on September 20, 2014, 03:45:18 PM
Both twin and quad engine Zeros are cool 8)
Can add fuselage engine for 3-6 engine Zeros.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 20, 2014, 05:47:18 PM
Yes! The Finsrinnishi A6M13 (and 13Z), were faster than any P-51 or P-47, while... without dangerous free nose, they were just civilian aircraft. I like them even more for that, thanks!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_p.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 20, 2014, 11:00:47 PM
The Finsrinnishi A6M13 (and 13Z)
Later, the Tophitsubishi twin-boom interceptor should have been coded A6M15 but it was coded A6M38 to refer to the opponent it was surpassing...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_q.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 21, 2014, 12:41:57 PM
The final jet-less Zero has been of course the very famous transsonic A6M99 (the 6-engined 99 and even better: the 12-engined 99Z, a single-seat racer that became the fastest airplane without jet ever, winning Reno 1946 and each year up to now). No? ;)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_r.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on September 21, 2014, 02:48:23 PM
As I recall, its widest margin of win was/is in time to climb.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 21, 2014, 07:08:47 PM
How to still improve this?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 22, 2014, 12:47:26 AM
The A6M18 and A6M18Z Pusher-Zeros were the heroes that saved Hiroshima and the planet from atomic destruction (if my Japanese sources are reliable, I am not sure)...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_s.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 22, 2014, 01:18:39 AM
The A6M19 and A6M19Z were other Pusher-Zeroes but with front engine. They got less historical importance, they were just sent from Nagasaki to shot down a lone B-29 approaching the cost, and they never returned, for unknown reason, after a probable success.
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_t.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 28, 2014, 01:30:39 AM
Thanks to the spy/SuperHero Jamesamoto Bondo 007, the A6M55 and A6M55Z canards were ready to fight the Curtiss Ascenders, but the P-55A never came above Japan (nor anywhere else) - but I've seen the film: this was a success of Jamesamoto kissing the girl!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_u.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 28, 2014, 02:20:22 AM
The A6M56 and A6M56Z were also canards but not pushers, they were more Zero-looking and easier for colling down the engine:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_v.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 04, 2014, 01:16:00 AM
The BMW TL-VI (aka TL-IIIZ) was very easy to build from TL-III parts (if you don't know the TL-III, see http://users.skynet.be/fa111491/images/BMW%20TL%20Jaeger%20III.jpg (http://users.skynet.be/fa111491/images/BMW%20TL%20Jaeger%20III.jpg) ):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Bmw5_y.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 08, 2014, 10:32:19 AM
The first Black Widow (was not the 3-seat P-61 nor the 2-seat F-15 but) was a single-seater very inspired by the P-38 Lightning:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-61_L.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 08, 2014, 11:09:54 AM
All the Historians of the past decades, up to now, have failed understanding why the asymmetric Black-Widow (and Twin-Black-Widow) were not signed Northrop but "Nortophe", this is a complete mystery...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-61_m.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 09, 2014, 01:03:00 AM
The first Black Widow was a single-seater very inspired by the P-38 Lightning:
For a full understanding, you should know the preliminary Lightning proposal (with radial engines and high wing):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 18, 2014, 12:45:13 AM
Each engine of the Heinkel He-177 was a double-engine DB-606 (total two DB-606 = four DB-601), so a different twin-engined He-177 (two DB-601 or one DB-606) was made, asymmetrical, in the Vlohm und Voss factory: He-177X
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on October 18, 2014, 09:48:21 AM
Love it!  ;D  The He 177X's new nickname would be the 'Luftwaffe's Half-Lighter'?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 18, 2014, 10:50:38 AM
Thanks! eheheh... :D well, no, this is the bad side, so this is evil :( but thanks for the joke anyway ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 26, 2014, 01:36:38 PM
It is not well known but the late Focke-Wulf Fw-190 (V90 and V91) were twin-boomers:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Fab_Fw190Z_d.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Volkodav on October 26, 2014, 06:59:30 PM
Each engine of the Heinkel He-177 was a double-engine DB-606 (total two DB-606 = four DB-601), so a different twin-engined He-177 (two DB-601 or one DB-606) was made, asymmetrical, in the Vlohm und Voss factory: He-177X

 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 27, 2014, 02:05:20 AM
It is not well known but the late Focke-Wulf Fw-190 (V90 and V91) were twin-boomers:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Fab_Fw190Z_d.JPG[/url])


Beat you there... ;):

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/190twintop.jpg)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/190twinside.jpg)

and:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/BV190D13.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 27, 2014, 03:00:18 AM
Thanks! You presented the 2-engined twin-boom version and me (later): the 3-engined and 1-engined twin-boom versions.
Thanks also for the asymmetric Blohm-und-Voss Bv-190D13! :-* I add of course the Bv-190D13Z Zwilling:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/BV190D13Z_.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 28, 2014, 01:07:16 AM
Another twin-boom derivative of famous fighter was the Zero-Kai-Kai:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_w.JPG)
The design principle was "me too" (meaning, "yes, we can do it too, to face the Lightning but with far less weight and price"). This is Historical fact! or not.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on October 28, 2014, 06:53:05 AM
Liking these last few twin-boomers :)
More kitbash contenders.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 29, 2014, 01:24:38 PM
Thanks!

Well, of course the Lightning with its 2 engines was faster than the Zero Kai Kai, but Mitsubishi built the improved Zero Kai Kai II, a push-pull that was 10 times better than the Lightning:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_x.JPG)
This is why Japan won WW2 (and would have won even without the famous and decisive atomic bombs for Peace, on Los Angeles and San Francisco)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 01, 2014, 11:07:52 PM
The Zero Kai Jet was also designed in 1945, but building it was scheduled for January 1946:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_y.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 07, 2014, 02:37:53 PM
The Nikitin-Shevchenko IS-16 is a poorly-known Soviet project of 1941 (the push-pull version being my addition):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Nikitin16_v05.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 11, 2014, 01:13:34 AM
74 years after 1940, I think the old top-secret status is over... So I tell you the truth about the Battle for Britain:
- Even the Spitfire was outperformed by the Bf-109E
- The American P-38 was faster but lacked maneuverability
- The Hurricane II twin-boomer, inspired by the P-38, has been an improvement over the classical Hurricane and P-38
- The Hurricane III pusher, mass-produced in secrecy, was the true winner that saved UK and the World!
(This is true: it was 100% clear in my dream) ;)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Hurri2_o.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 11, 2014, 02:35:44 AM
In 1943, the bubble Hurricane IIB and Hurricane IIIB were the best piston-fighters ever...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Hurri2_p.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 13, 2014, 02:23:06 AM
Compared to the Daunltless, the Dauntless-II had a more powerful engine and a bubble canopy:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Twin-Dauntless_y_zps64a0f450.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 13, 2014, 05:24:35 PM
As readers of History books, you probably don't understand why the very classical Douglas SBD Dauntless won the tremendous victory of the Midway battle. Well, what historians did not know is the decisive use of the very much improved SBD-25Z Dauntless-II-II:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_Z.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on November 13, 2014, 05:32:20 PM
While doing SBD configurations.  Might I suggest-request applying your skill to SBDJ Dauntless II

http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2747.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=2747.0)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 14, 2014, 01:11:30 AM
You are very right: while the Douglas SBD-25Z was the secret winner of the Midway Battle, the Finsrin SBDJ-2 was the secret winner of the Leyte Battle, 2 years later:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_aa.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on November 14, 2014, 04:27:35 AM
Right on;  thanks, thatz a splendid rendering :)
SBDJ and SBDJ-2 served well before Navy went to pure jets.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on November 14, 2014, 10:01:22 AM
Great improvements to the Dauntless ... but I love the twin-boomed Hurricanes!  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 14, 2014, 03:37:20 PM
Thanks to all!

SBDJ and SBDJ-2 served well before Navy went to pure jets.
Uh? I thought it was still stop secret... The SBDK and SBDK-2 were the winners of the Okinawa Battle and that was why the Finsrin factory in Auburn was awarded the Medal of Honnour:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Twin-Dauntless_ab.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 15, 2014, 01:27:16 AM
You probably know the reason of the W shape of the Corsair wing: having a short (solid) undercarriage even with the giant propeller. This was cured differently on the F4U10 with smaller contraprops:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_F4U_06_zpsb31fabc4.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 15, 2014, 07:07:36 PM
Of course, both versions have been zwillinged into Twin-Corsairs, the F4U10Z being best for 2 reasons:
- less different parts (no need of propeller in the other direction)
- fuselages closer (less asymmetry if one engine fails):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_F4U_07.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on November 16, 2014, 03:05:10 AM
I like.  Maybe do as nightfighter with one crew member being radar operator.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 16, 2014, 03:04:12 PM
Yes, you are very right: with a Vought licence, the GTX factory in Australia built the F4U10N night fighter (the most successful asymmetric airplane ever!):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_F4U_08.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 18, 2014, 01:12:56 AM
On the opposite direction came the F4U14: 2 engines but only one pilot (with less drag than a P-38 or Mosquito):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_F4U_09.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on November 18, 2014, 04:03:22 PM
Very nice Tophe! Matbe I draw it someday. :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on November 18, 2014, 08:21:01 PM
some of these designs should really be built  :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 24, 2014, 12:13:10 AM
Thanks!

Was the P-56U a twin-fuselage plane or a twin-pod flying-wing?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_XP-56_zzc.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 02, 2015, 11:33:14 PM
Contrary to the Arado Ar-340, the Ar-340-II was a fighter:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_AR340R_b.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on January 03, 2015, 09:06:12 PM
Love the Arado!  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on January 04, 2015, 05:45:52 AM
Me too ... although that straight-winged Twin Corsair is also very tasty!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 17, 2015, 07:00:16 PM
Thanks!

Well, when Fw-190D pilots met the first Mistangs in the sky, they reported that their own radial ugly radiator was not necessary and the Focke-Wulf engineers proposed the Fw-190E with a belly scoop:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Fab_Fw190Z_e_zpsb89b9e86.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 17, 2015, 07:14:49 PM
As the Mustangs were still winning in the air beauty contests, Focke-Wulf designed the Fw-190E2 with a more streamlined nose:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Fab_Fw190Z_f_zpsa8062ea3.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 17, 2015, 07:27:54 PM
Of course, the final result was the twin-plane Fw-190EZ, otherwise I would not be much interested...  ;)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Fab_Fw190Z_g.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 18, 2015, 03:28:02 AM
Not far from reality - the Fw-190C had a belly intake for the turbocharger:

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/23/Fw_190_C_V18_Seite.JPG/1920px-Fw_190_C_V18_Seite.JPG)
(http://fw190.hobbyvista.com/v18.jpg)
(http://forum.valka.cz/attachments/121/Fw_190_C-0.jpg)

No where near as streamlines/attractive as your though.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 18, 2015, 02:05:19 PM
Thanks for this historical expertise, while I was crazily dreaming with my "air beauty contests" in the early 1940s...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 18, 2015, 06:41:34 PM
Not far from reality - the Fw-190C had a belly intake for the turbocharger:
No where near as streamlines/attractive as your though.
You are right, GTX, the best cooling may have been this: in-line liquid-cooled engine + radial-air-radiator + belly intake for the supercharger, and this was the principle of the North-GTXan P-51W Mustooling (thanks to your grandfather)...:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51B_cx.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 21, 2015, 02:41:18 AM
The PP-51B & 51D Mustangtang used a Packard Tandem-Merlin V-3300 engine:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51B_db.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 22, 2015, 01:01:10 PM
For the Army (no more for the Navy), the Mitsubishi A6M Zero became the Mitsubishi-Kawasaki Ki-0, with an in-line engine:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/r_A6m_Zero_aa_zpspkrgouwe.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 22, 2015, 01:18:37 PM
For Army+Navy joint operations was designed the A6Ki-0, but the design was never finished, both services requiring the lead on flying commands:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_ab.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 26, 2015, 02:29:49 AM
To avoid lethal battles between Army and Navy pilots was designed the A6Ki-0R Rimôto remotely piloted fighter... but there was a battle between Army and Navy remote-controllers...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_ac.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 01, 2015, 12:21:29 AM
The Japanese Civil War (Army vs Navy) was the actual reason why Japan lost WW2. Then, in September 1945 was designed the new airplane for Japan, now allied to USA against USSR. General MacArthur said this should be the A6P51 and Admiral Nimitz (still living on this planet) replied: not at all! this must be the A6F4! they kill each other and USSR won WW3, in 1952... :D
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_ad.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on February 01, 2015, 12:56:40 AM
 
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51B_cx.JPG)
[/quote]

Love the Pusher-Zeroes and the P-51W is outstanding!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 01, 2015, 05:50:32 PM
Thanks!
Now the famous Mirage 5-5-5, the advertisement said this was "the Real Mirage III, the very-delta fighter", but nobody ordered (except the French government with taxes we had to pay not to go in jail...):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/r_Mirage5_zzv_zpsplzfjyhu.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 04, 2015, 03:17:55 AM
After the crash of the Mirage 5-5-5 (with the rear internal wings turned liquid by the main flame) killing the test pilot and the two test engineers, the French government ordered an improved prototype : the Mirage 5-5-5B below. This one failed to take off and broke at the end of the runway, killing no one (yes, this was an improvement, congratulations!) ;) :icon_ninja:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_Mirage5_zzw_zpspp6sb24l.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: JP Vieira on February 08, 2015, 05:16:26 PM
Always inspiring
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 08, 2015, 11:44:07 PM
Thanks a lot!

Now a famous piece of History: as the Heinkel 111Z made Germany win the invasion of the terrorist UK, 1945, and Japan win the invasion of the terrorist USA, 1946, Heinkel proposed the peaceful He 555 tugging He 444s in 1947:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Fab_He111zz_j.JPG)
 :icon_fsm: ;) :icon_music:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: arc3371 on February 08, 2015, 11:59:52 PM
Someone needs to build the He 555!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Cliffy B on February 09, 2015, 07:58:20 AM
Someone needs to build the He 555!

I concur!!!!  8)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 12, 2015, 01:29:37 PM
Thanks a lot! If the He-555 kit 1/72 is someday on the market, I will buy 2 copies, to build a 32-engined Mistel He-555M:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Fab_He111zz_k.JPG)
PS. There are more canopies than required for the pilot, but many mecanicians were in the plane, I don't know precisely the reason why. ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 15, 2015, 03:24:13 AM
The Heinkel He-666 was somehow similar to the He-111Z but opposite also: many fuselages and few engines:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Fab_He111zz_l.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: The Big Gimper on February 15, 2015, 04:52:14 AM
Now this I like.   :)

Put a jet engine between the two fuselages.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 15, 2015, 03:38:09 PM
Yes, of course: everyone knows the thousands of Big Gimper He-666BG built in England and USA from September 1945 to 1954:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Fab_He111zzm.JPG)
(Thanks!) ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: The Big Gimper on February 15, 2015, 09:46:13 PM
Thank you Tophe.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 16, 2015, 12:24:25 AM
Thanks to you, Big Gimper, for having been the right man at the right place at the right time (with a time travel machine)
As far as I am concerned, I failed to get a single order with my tandem derivative He-666BGZ:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Fab_He111zzn.JPG)
 :icon_fsm: :icon_music: ;) :D :icon_ninja:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 23, 2015, 01:14:09 AM
The use of atomic bombs against Japan has not been a good idea: with the accute nuclear rays, a mutation occured on Japanese aviators, and they did not need propellers anymore, nor much lifting area, nor fuel, nor runway. And with their A6M00 (and A6M00Z) they did win WW2 in one single week.
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_ae.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 23, 2015, 02:39:41 AM
No, let us be serious: WW2 did last till 1981 with the virus bombardment of California, and there is still a complete need of propellers (mental power and turbojets are science-fiction). The A6MM and A6MM-Z were serious airplanes, 1945:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_af.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 24, 2015, 03:43:05 PM
Ups! Sorry, I misselected the planet: here is Earth Nr.3, it seems, so there was a need of lifting area remaining:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_ag.JPG)
Simply these A6M1000 and A6M1000Z destroyed the B-29 fleet, then destroyed Guam and Hawai, and after the invasion of USA, President Truman surrendered without condition. After the Nuremberyama world trial he was condemned to self hara kiri (blade painful suicide) for the terrorist mass murders of Tokyo, Hiroshima, Nagazaki and the US people was sent back to Europe (that fell in misery forever) except the Native Americans of course, that got the second UNO veto right (after Japan). This planet Nr.3 is better maybe than the other ones. :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 27, 2015, 01:24:57 PM
No: of course I was badly joking, daydreaming: we are not here on Earth Nr.1 nor 2 nor 3 but Earth Number Zero!
And here is the very famous photograph of the final day of the last war ever (1946, April 1st): transporting the many candidates for the kamikaze heroic Peace, the A6MF mother-plane is dropping the A6MB flying bomb and its 4 nuclear J-bombs (that killed all life in America, terrorist North and approving South) before the carrier crash-landed heroically to deposit the radioactive & bacterial load that made America a place where life cannot survive for the forhcoming million years. This providing gently eternal peace to the World...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_ah.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 27, 2015, 02:01:45 PM
Quote
And here is the very famous photograph of the final day of the last war ever (1946, April 1st): transporting the many candidates for the kamikaze heroic Peace, the A6MF mother-plane is dropping the A6MB flying bomb and its 4 nuclear J-bombs (that killed all life in America, terrorist North and approving South) before the carrier crash-landed heroically to deposit the radioactive & bacterial load that made America a place where life cannot survive for the forhcoming million years.

Uh, my very Young son disagrees:
- But Daddy, how can a bacterial threat be if there is no life: bacteria is life!
Poor child, still unaware of the elementary propaganda knowledge: the Basiyusu Zeroii strain is not a living bacteria but a sleeping spore (of Basiyusu tokyoensis), and these flying spores (seen below on microscopy zoomed x1,000,000) are and will be forever transported by the atmospheric winds on any living organism, transforming from spore into living form to kill the host and then die itself. So a temporary-life may happen but dying immediatly without living actually. This is the miracle of our Mitsubishi military-biolaboratory!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_ai.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 02, 2015, 01:10:15 AM
No, let us be serious: History is not a matter of joke. :icon_crap:
WW2 did end in 1945 actually.
First, on April 1st 1945, the Mistsubishi A6M163 broke the sound barrier (pilot Chuk Yeagoyama), accelerating and accelerating again up to Mach 1.05 ...
But the American President still refused the negociated peace, answering "we have for you 2 big surprises: a little boy and a fat man, hehehe".
Then in August 1945 (with the help of my grandfather the spy Chris Miller), the A6M164 twin-rocket prototype intercepted a bomb falling on Hiroshima and transported it to fall on San Francisco, with 5 million casualties. Then the same prototype intercepted the bomb falling on Nagazaki and transported it to fall on Los Angeles. 10 million dead ones. The USA then surrendered without condition, and the white American people become slaves of the Black American ones (and of Native Americans). This is peace and justice! :)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_aj.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Vuk on March 03, 2015, 02:33:29 PM
The second one reminded me of this great cartoon!  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 03, 2015, 07:21:21 PM
Classic ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 04, 2015, 12:39:20 AM
Thanks! This is a new reason to be twin-boom, yes! ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 08, 2015, 12:30:19 PM
No, the tales above were fantasy. Now, let us speak about History, the true one, even if we are here in English lesson, disappeared languages department of University:
(translated from Chinese):
After the Nagazaki tremendous explosion, the Japanese emperor went very sadly to the radio and explained "Yes, I admit, our generals were very wrong conquering China, Indonesia, the Philippines, and we have been punished now, but Europeans had been exactly as wrong conquering America and the World, so they are going to be punished now, burning babies and all just as well. I tell solemnly A6M2012 Maya pilots and technicians, go!". Then from 2 Japanese secret submarines in the Pacific and Atlantic oceans took off these weird prototypes, bringing volcano super-activator loads in a no return mission, heroic. And the full Yellowstone continent did explode, destroying North America, and Iceland did explode, destroying Western Europe. The Pacific tsunami destroyed Japan also, and civilisation came back in China! Glory to the Mitsubishi A6M2012!"
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_aL.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 11, 2015, 01:33:43 PM
No, seriously: in January 1945, all Japanese shintoist priests gathered (in the small unknown Hiroshima town) to make a miracle, and a special A6M19 Zero was sent over the holy Fuji-Yama volcano fumes to get its strength. It came back transformed with a volcano on itself! This "airplane half-God" was sent to intercept the 1,000 bombers coming to destroy Tokyo and they were all destroyed! Then this heroic A6M19FY Fuji-Yamo was sent in missions over Washington State then (with its infinite range) over Washington DC, and it erupted over there, killing deliciously the evil babies and all, and Japan won the war! Thanks Gods!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_A6m_Zero_an.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 12, 2015, 02:26:53 AM
And here is the push-pull version of the Hirth Hi-24:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_Hi24j.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: arc3371 on March 12, 2015, 10:04:38 AM
I like the Hirth 24 !
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 14, 2015, 02:13:39 PM
Thanks Arc!

The second one reminded me of this great cartoon!  ;D
Thank you for this enrichment, that made me complete my site about the reasons to be a twin-boomer
http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/asym_dahu_aeroUK.htm (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/asym_dahu_aeroUK.htm)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/p_DaU_52_b_zpsnffpitru.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on March 17, 2015, 04:03:38 PM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 11, 2015, 02:44:16 AM
Thanks!
And here is the P-38X-2, a 4-engined version of the Lightning:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/r_P38eclairK_aee2_zpsavlxpaxx.jpg)
(as there was no budget for such a 4-engined fighter, it used two double V-1710 aka V-3420, and so it was ordered with Congress approval...)
But could it still have a nose wheel?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 11, 2015, 10:13:30 PM
A drag reduction change was tried, with a (warm) prone pilot above the starboard engines, then the USAAF decided not to continue with 4-engines and come back to only 2, and this was the P-38Sam, built in 38,038 copies, (Sam standing for Samysetric, but the nick-name was Uncle), that won WW2, being above all other fighters in dogfighting, with 'impossible' moves:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairK_aef_zpsxkninzyq.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 19, 2015, 01:15:19 AM
My (5-year old) son Jacky has invented a new way to make air-war: fancy clown disguise.
The strategy is this: a clown fixed face is adapted on a special nose of our fighters, they took off and the bad enemy planes (seeing them coming) are persuaded these are gentle clowns coming to play and have fun... then: "bang, you're dead!"...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P82-51C_bn.JPG)
(Daddy Tophe does not like kill playing, but little Jacky loves this - "this is not real, eh!") ???
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on April 19, 2015, 03:20:06 PM
Nice story Tophe! :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 26, 2015, 10:52:37 PM
Thanks lauhof!

A different strategy (but somehow similar) was used on the P-38Do (the story in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dora_the_Explorer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dora_the_Explorer) seems to be wrong, as the source airplane is dated 1940): this was a lovely camo, for passive defense against killers: who could shoot down such a tender little girl?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/r_P38eclairK_aet_zpsbq96bs1r.jpg)
my 5-year-old son jacky adds: " cé mois ki a fé sign jacky jemsey" (translated: "it's me that made it, signed jacky jemsey")
 8) :icon_fsm: :icon_swat: :icon_ninja: :icon_music: ;) :) :D >:D :icon_alabanza: :icon_killbill: :icon_crap:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 03, 2015, 02:41:57 AM
To export their push-pull to Italy, Dornier had to invent an intermediate between Do-335 and Do-335Z:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_DO635Z_aj.JPG)
 :icon_fsm: :icon_ninja: :icon_music: :icon_swat: :) ;) :D >:( 8) :o ::) >:D :icon_alabanza: :)) :icon_crap:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on May 03, 2015, 03:17:35 AM
Do like the Do-335Z :)
Another of your wana build in styrene drawings.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 03, 2015, 03:21:26 AM
Do like the Do-335Z :)
The 4-engined Do 635 (aka Do-335Z) was a true project, to protect the bomber of New York or something, and I prefer fantasy crazy dreams, as far as I am concerned. ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 03, 2015, 05:52:35 AM
And a trimotor is so much more Italian!  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 04, 2015, 02:38:45 AM
The P-61P Super-Black-Widow was a push-pull twin-fuselage fighter with 2 radar noses (for the new XZ technology, ahem: maybe this is still secret):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-61_p.JPG)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 14, 2015, 06:48:53 PM
Do you know the Thunderbolt main secret? The P-47 in service History starts with the classical P-47B, but the secret P-47As were top secret: both long range P-47A (or P-47Asy) and very long range P-47Az (or P-47Asy²) were built in 47,047 copies, yes, I swear it was true (last night in my dream):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-47z_azj.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 22, 2015, 12:21:26 AM
I still have a problem with the aesthetics of the regular P-47... I try to improve in unconventional way...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_P-47z_azk.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 24, 2015, 06:09:18 PM
from http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=5458.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=5458.0) :
according to the secret sources I have access to (every night, closing my eyes), this Republic fighter between P-43 and P-47 was simply the P-45 (officials speaking of "Bell P-45 Airacobra" to fool the spies)

Well, there are discrepant sources... Another secret projects was actually a Bell P-45A "Airacobra", as a missing link between P-39 and P-63 while different: pusher propellers, zwilling fuselages, port P-39-like tail/wing and starboard P-63-like tail/wing:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/r_cobra_y.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 28, 2015, 05:22:44 AM
I like it  :)  Your Bell P-45A would also be a good way to contrast conventional versus laminar-flow airfoils  ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 28, 2015, 11:44:09 AM
Thanks for this interpretation, providing a reason (apart from delirium...). Yes, and to test profiles without interference of air vortex from front propeller, the pusher layout was an obvious choice... :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 14, 2015, 02:07:09 AM
In 1944, the (top-secret) F-61 was not a renamed P-61 but a long-range reco plane:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_q.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on June 14, 2015, 02:37:27 AM
Very nice job, Tophe! 8)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 15, 2015, 12:11:58 AM
Thanks a lot, Lauhof.

Well, this is not the end of the F-61 history: in 1945, a project of F-61 reco squadron on top of Mount Everest was made (for flights over all China), and this required more power (F-61EEE, like Everest Extra Engines):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_r.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 17, 2015, 08:05:16 PM
In February 1945, inspired by the Japanese airmen, the USAAF founded the Kameekase Squadron, with Northrop K-61A Dark Widow, specially designed to prevent bailing out of pilots lacking bravery at last... (Oh, I do not like warbirds, sorry...) ???
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_s.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 18, 2015, 02:58:38 PM
There were a few problems remaining for the Kamicase general, and when Lockheed proposed the K-38A, he ordered the triplane K-38NT to "crush cowards", he said:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/P38eclairL_acx_zps2uvvhyck.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 18, 2015, 03:21:47 PM
The final K-38NT+ had a rear low tailplane for wheels (no need of catapult for take off), 6 engines total, and a reduced span for supersonic dive:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/P38eclairL_acz_zpsfd5m6csc.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 23, 2015, 02:31:59 PM
The K-38TT Trining (Tandem-Three-Engines Lightning) did the same with less engines: threatening pilots for them to do the job and die "properly"... (even if they refused to take off without parachute):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/P38eclairL_ado_zpsbz0fzfjx.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 23, 2015, 04:56:03 PM
Out of the Kameecase death squadron, a derivative was the P-38KK (P-38FF for France as KK cannot be sold there, KK pronounced as caca meaning sheat...):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/P38eclairL_adp_zpsslkcyksg.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 23, 2015, 06:12:54 PM
Still in the same family, the X-38A was the piston-racer (with no parachute to save weight) that reached Mach 1.01 at Reno 1951. This is still secret as the jet companies put the secret on it with billions $ reward (but I have not received my monthly payment so I say it all ??? ;) )...:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/P38eclairL_adq_zpstaylokaz.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 29, 2015, 06:55:43 PM
The French (Max Holste factory) double MH20 was coded Mh-20Z by the German RLM but it was then changed into MH-2020 (and MH-2020B), not imagining that a year 2020 could actually exist someday...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/mh20_v.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 30, 2015, 10:20:42 AM
Yes, the Me-163 was a (very efficient) interceptor, with high speed (swept wing, transonic) and propeller-less nose (dangerous for the opponents), but... what? a tailless rocket-plane??? :-\ No, let us be serious, this was in 1944 not in 2044!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/me163z_o.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 01, 2015, 02:19:38 AM
Oh, I do like that last one - would make a nice recreational plane.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 01, 2015, 11:37:45 AM
Oh, I do like that last one - would make a nice recreational plane.
Thanks GTX! and... with his time machine (set at +70), Willy Messerschmitt has heard what you said and proposed from Argentina, on July 1st, 1945, the Me-163M Menschen (for the people), without gun nose nor dangerous monotrace ski for landing:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/me163z_p.jpg)
I doubt Argentina will pay you $ billions Copyright, though, if this one is built in million copies...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on July 07, 2015, 06:40:42 AM
Oooo ... twin-boomed Komets! Very nice  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 18, 2015, 06:52:00 AM
Thanks!
And now something different: Mirage with short wing chord:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_zzx_zpstfdgicad.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 18, 2015, 06:52:50 AM
Thunder butterfly...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 21, 2015, 02:00:56 PM
The Dassault seller told the General: "look, the price of a double-delta is not double from the delta basis but just 50% more! and our triplex-delta now are not 3 times more expensive, 300% no! just 180%! Taxpayers will enjoy for sure!"
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_zzy_zps1wxzndca.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 21, 2015, 02:06:35 PM
"The 3-jet version of the triplex delta is of course a little more expensive, but cheap anyway: 270%! With 8% discount if you order more than 1,000 copies per year!"
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_zzz_zpsolyj0qt8.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 21, 2015, 03:04:56 PM
The next Mirage of mine is not a slanting view, sorry, but weird anyway...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Mirage5_aaaa.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on July 21, 2015, 04:05:39 PM
Tri-mirage is top!, Tophe! Nice work 8)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on July 22, 2015, 06:24:27 AM
The next Mirage of mine is not a slanting view, sorry, but weird anyway...
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Mirage5_aaaa.jpg[/url])

Now that's an extreme and unusual take on "variable geometry wings"!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 22, 2015, 01:10:33 PM
Thanks!

And now...;
Official announcement, by the French Government (today, April 2nd, 2017): “We deny completely, solemnly, that an ‘O-wing Mirage’ (absurd!) would have reached last week Mach 50 and disappeared in outer space. Flying saucers do not exist! The lunatic joker Tophe who drew this very bad joke yesterday will be sent to jail for having thus insulted the glorious memory of the late military pilot Chris Miller (certified Human!), who disappeared last week in an ocean crash near the Malaysian Airlines Triangle. Shame on this sinister Mr Tophe! (whose French nationality will be removed as punishment).”
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_aaab_zpslkwvmlmq.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 23, 2015, 09:52:16 PM
What?! Adding double-saucers, all witnesses reports would be confirmed?? No! The psychiatric squad must attack RIGHT NOW! And shoot! No prisoner! (in the War for Official Truth vs. Heresy!).
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/Mirage5_aaac_zpsjk7tbgea.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 23, 2015, 09:54:30 PM
 “Uh? According to new reports from merchant ships crossing the Channel? Javelin-like and Typhoon-II-like flying saucers from our side? No, impossible! Maybe the French government would ally with Extraterrestrial aliens or what BUT like Napoleon would NEVER use British technology! (except turbojet, and radar, and stealth, and…)”
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/Mirage5_aaad_zpsm9ofy6ee.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 23, 2015, 09:57:48 PM
"No! This Mirage 5W Waterloo is a step too far, far too far! Yes, officially, death penalty exists no more in France but a 12-bullet (or double-bazooka) suicide is common, for self-punishment of “intelligence with the enemy”! Liberty squad: action now! All together: fire!"
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/Mirage5_aaae_zpsioidxwpn.jpg)
(signed: Tophe, probably dead and burried now...)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Geist on July 31, 2015, 08:36:00 PM
W wing! Really interesting.
It could have a version with it positioned "under" the fuselage.
Very creative!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 01, 2015, 10:54:27 AM
Thanks!
So I have made this W-Geist= Weist version, while the W shape does not appear (that is why I used high wing at first), but a little starboard wing extension makes it all right (at first sight). Thanks again!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_aaaf_zpsbvkuvkyv.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Geist on August 01, 2015, 09:16:11 PM
Thanks!
So I have made this W-Geist= Weist version, while the W shape does not appear (that is why I used high wing at first), but a little starboard wing extension makes it all right (at first sight). Thanks again!
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_aaaf_zpsbvkuvkyv.jpg[/url])


Thanks a lot!!! ;) :)
By the way, weist (2nd/3rd person) in German comes from the verb weisen that means to point / point out or point at. Depends of the sentence
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 01, 2015, 11:36:04 PM
Thanks. And I was lucky I did not invent by mistake an insult meaning (in some language)... ??? :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Geist on August 02, 2015, 04:52:24 AM
 
Thanks. And I was lucky I did not invent by mistake an insult meaning (in some language)... ??? :)
;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 05, 2015, 02:08:16 AM
The Macchi C.205P was based on the Macchi bifusoliera, with a touch of Savoia SM-91 (or enemy P-38?):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/C205Z_b.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Logan Hartke on August 05, 2015, 02:29:59 AM
That one's simple, but really lovely.

Cheers,

Logan
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 05, 2015, 06:51:04 PM
Thanks a lot! :)
Any idea of further "improvement"/change? ???
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Logan Hartke on August 05, 2015, 11:21:10 PM
I like it as is, but if you want variants, you could go with a longer, sleeker nose.

Possible variants?
Glass nose for photo reconnaissance or aerial survey work.
Night fighter with German-style radar.
I thought it looked a lot like a mini-XC-120 Packplane, so you could go with a much smaller, sleeker detachable mail pod.
You could even do a really weird one with no center pod, but a cockpit integrated into the wing like the Savoia-Marchetti S.55 family.

The one I'd really like to see, though, is one with floats, like the related SM.87.

Cheers,

Logan
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 06, 2015, 10:48:56 AM
Thanks a lot for these great ideas! I may try to draw these during this week-end or next week.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 08, 2015, 11:29:46 PM
Possible variants?
Glass nose for photo reconnaissance or aerial survey work.
Night fighter with German-style radar.
I thought it looked a lot like a mini-XC-120 Packplane, so you could go with a much smaller, sleeker detachable mail pod.
You could even do a really weird one with no center pod, but a cockpit integrated into the wing like the Savoia-Marchetti S.55 family.
The first 4 ones, thanks!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/C205Z_d.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 09, 2015, 12:02:54 AM
I like it as is, but if you want variants, you could go with a longer, sleeker nose.
The one I'd really like to see, though, is one with floats, like the related SM.87.
With thanks again:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/C205Z_e.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on August 09, 2015, 02:46:00 PM
Hi Tophe! This one is really outstanding! Very nice job! :) :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 09, 2015, 02:34:20 AM
Thanks lauhof.

Well, you probably know that Gloster felt bad when De Havilland won the contract for the Vampire, my uncle ordering said "we prefer twin-boomers". So the Gloster design bureau worked hard and proposed a twin-engine twin-boomer: the Meteor-II.
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Meteor_e.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on September 09, 2015, 02:56:23 PM
I like it as is, but if you want variants, you could go with a longer, sleeker nose.
The one I'd really like to see, though, is one with floats, like the related SM.87.
With thanks again:

always nice with floats  ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: CiTrus90 on September 09, 2015, 07:37:09 PM
The Gloster twin boomer screams for becoming a tri-engined jet ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 10, 2015, 12:53:17 AM
Thanks ericr!

And thanks Citrus, you seem to know the top secret order for 40,000 Meteor-III (cancelled in May 1945):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Meteor_f.jpg)
 :icon_ninja:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 10, 2015, 01:30:06 PM
Of course, long before the Meteor-III, Gloster did design a single-jet twin-boomer but too late for the Vampire contract:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Meteor_g.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on September 10, 2015, 03:45:56 PM
Very nice One! 
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: CiTrus90 on September 10, 2015, 05:44:59 PM
 :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 14, 2015, 01:48:08 AM
Thanks!
Now the Gloster Meteorology had little in common with the classical Meteor: no more jet, no more twin-engine, no more fighter, no more military...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Meteor_h.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 16, 2015, 11:20:39 AM
The Pure-Delta Mirage 5 (in French: Pur Delta) was not named PD-5 because of pedophile possible accusations. So it became TD-5 True-Delta Mirage 5 (in French: Très Delta, meaning Very Delta):
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_aaag_zpsozuyb2ja.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 20, 2015, 01:39:55 AM
I have discovered a new twin-boom derivative of the Yak-15 (unbuilt Real project it seems), in the book Ryeaktivniye Perventzi SSSR. And I have added a variant of my own:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Yak15TB.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 26, 2015, 12:03:31 AM
In his topic http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=5284.90 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=5284.90) , CiTrus90 required a what-if proposal for the TFX jet-training program. But the Real World candidates are so normal/sad/boring, there is a need to change further. With the F-82TFX (using parts of existing Twin-Mustangs), the price is very low and the student feels like a Real pilot, in his own cockpit! (under control of a teacher elsewhere, distant)...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P82-51C3_dp.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: CiTrus90 on September 26, 2015, 03:16:53 AM
the student feels like a Real pilot, in his own cockpit! (under control of a teacher elsewhere, distant)...

This is probably the BEST IDEA EVER for a trainer aircraft.

If i were a top brass in the Air Force, i'd buy it :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 09, 2015, 01:08:18 PM
Thanks A LOT CiTrus90... ;)

Now, let us talk of the Spitfire after the Mk.24:
- of course there was the Twin-Spitfire Mk.25 but the separate cockpits were a problem
- the son of a Supermarine engineer played Scale-o-Rama game with a 1/48 canopy on the 1/72 basis, inventing the Mk.25 SOR
- then, this idea of big cockpit on the port side was built as Mk.25B:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Spitfire_zx.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 11, 2015, 12:09:03 AM
This saturday afternoon during my nap, I was on some planet reading a book, and I saw a surprising sentence: "the Supermatine Spitfire is the most famous of all 6-fin aircraft". I checked and this is all true: the Griffon-engined Mk.14 lacked lateral control (this is the famous source of increased-size fin on the Mk.22 then further on the Mk.24), but the first try was a triple fin (Mk.14T). And that improvement gave 6 fins on the Twin-Spitfire derivative (Mk.14TT). Well, this one was built in less than 10,000 copies but... I woke up, sorry I don't know the end of the story... :(
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Spitfire_zy.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 12, 2015, 12:08:43 PM
I was on some planet reading a book, and I saw a surprising sentence: "the Supermatine Spitfire is the most famous of all 6-fin aircraft".
Oh, sorry... this was a mistake of mine: on no planet in the Universe, the glorious name SupermaRine is called SupermaTine, this was a mistyping: 6 fins per plane, yes! but SupermaTine, no!
 ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 22, 2015, 12:25:51 PM
Official announcement, by the French Government (today, April 2nd, 2017): “We deny completely, solemnly, that an ‘O-wing Mirage’ (absurd!) would have reached last week Mach 50 and disappeared in outer space. Flying saucers do not exist!
([url]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_aaab_zpslkwvmlmq.jpg[/url])

Well, the O-wing Mirage above was not explaining at all the "Flying Saucers" observation by so many people in the 1960s. So: extraterrestrial? This is not sure, because the TriplO-Mirage secret project may have been actually built: Mach 6 at low altitude, silently, seen as perfect O from the ground... a very different technology, yes.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/2015/Mirage5_aaah_zpso7ftvzd0.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 24, 2015, 09:54:03 PM
I think the AP-61 Asymmetric Widow was the first asymmetric night-fighter (the AP-61Z Twin-Widow came later):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_t.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 27, 2015, 12:48:25 PM
After the J.21R jet-twin-boomer, SAAB engineers proposed a twin-engined version based on P-38 Lightning parts: J.38 with 3 versions J.38D, V and G. None of them were built like that but it was the basis for later J.35 Draken, J.37 Viggen, J.39 Gripen.
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairM_abq.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 30, 2015, 02:56:40 PM
Mitsubishi Ki-46-III and Tsuin-46 (Twin-46):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Ki-16-III_d.jpg)
The tremendous success of the Tsuin-46 is the true explanation of the Twin-Mustang order on the other side...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 30, 2015, 10:44:46 PM
Then came the Ki-46-IV and Ki-46-V twin-boomers:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Ki-16-III_e.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 31, 2015, 04:09:01 AM
Interesting.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 31, 2015, 01:33:57 PM
Thanks!
And you know... (this is a secret but I tell you): the Lightnings were jealous of the Ki-46-III beauty and tried to look like her (wearing P-38Ki-46, 47, 48 silhouettes):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairM_abx.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 04, 2015, 02:15:58 AM
A Northrop P-61V with V-1710 engines indead of radials:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_u.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 10, 2015, 01:14:12 PM
I found a surprizing P-38 bronze statue at http://www.zazzle.fr/p-38+portefeuilles (http://www.zazzle.fr/p-38+portefeuilles)
Here is it with airplane "derivatives":
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairM_acc.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on November 11, 2015, 02:43:55 AM
Prone piloted?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 11, 2015, 12:46:40 PM
A statue has no pilot, nor even flying ability... For the airplane derivatives, yes a prone pilot would have no problem while this is not the only possibility. For instance, a scaled up Lightning may have 2 seated pilots in a glazed nose like many helicopters and observers (Optica and others).
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 11, 2015, 03:59:01 PM
The prone-pilot Lightnings were less heavy:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairM_acd.jpg)
(Thanks for this idea!)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 23, 2015, 07:33:38 PM
With external tailplanes, the P-54X was less solid than the P-54A but, with a gun Inside the spinner for rear defense, it was safer in wartime flight.
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/XP54PP_ab.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on December 24, 2015, 04:04:13 AM
A Northrop P-61V with V-1710 engines indead of radials:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_u.jpg[/url])

V1710s might be a bit underpowered for that large an aircraft, how about fitting a pair of Chryler IV2220s (as flown on the XP-47H) instead?  You'd have to make cooling system provisions and, likely, need to do some shifting for weight and balance purposes, but it would make a most purposeful-looking aircraft.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 24, 2015, 12:54:42 PM
So here is the improved L-61 (L for EL-mayerle... ;) ):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_v.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 17, 2016, 02:20:35 AM
A streamlined radial engine was tested on a Zero Zwilling in 1945, it seems:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/a6m_Zero_ap.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on January 17, 2016, 06:18:59 AM
Hmmm, streamlined cowl on a Zero ... I like it!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 17, 2016, 06:34:16 AM
As an alternate, maybe do a Zero with a ducted spinner similar to the original Fw190:

(http://www.strijdbewijs.nl/birds/fw190/fw15.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 17, 2016, 02:45:51 PM
Thanks Apophenia!
And dear GTXishi, as soon as you said that (July 4th 1945, right?), a triplex Zero was built to test all:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/a6m_Zero_aq.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 31, 2016, 01:20:02 AM
In 1943, the Japanese captured an enemy P-38 (the Forked Devil) and tried its engine (A6M38 Zerning) or both engines (A6M38Kai), without success...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/a6m_Zero_as.jpg)
This is guaranteed true life History, maybe in another Universe than Reality, but true!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lauhof52 on January 31, 2016, 06:20:25 PM
So here is the improved L-61 (L for EL-mayerle... ;) ):
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_v.jpg[/url])


Really nice work, Tophe!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 14, 2016, 12:37:20 AM
Thanks!

And here is a Black-Widow with improvement: a little less solid but with a better rear post:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_w.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on February 14, 2016, 02:14:40 AM
Nice,,,  someone should build this in styrene !
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Kerick on February 14, 2016, 10:42:18 AM
Thanks!

And here is a Black-Widow with improvement: a little less solid but with a better rear post:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_w.jpg[/url])


Two engines on one side and fuselage/cockpit on the other? Is that possible?
Twice as many side gunners with a clear field of fire. Build an opposite handed version to fly on the other side of the bomber formation.
Tophe you are contagious! In a good way!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 14, 2016, 01:27:48 PM
Yes, good! Thanks! :-*
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_x.jpg)
Now, the name of kerick stands (in fire letters!) in the History of asymmetric aircraft... see at the end of my
http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Asymm_addition.htm (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Asymm_addition.htm)
 ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Kerick on February 14, 2016, 11:36:23 PM
That's an amazing list of aircraft! Thanks!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 15, 2016, 12:28:45 PM
Thanks to you, dreamer!
And here is the complete set, for best protection:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_y.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: The Big Gimper on February 16, 2016, 03:28:23 AM
Thanks!

And here is a Black-Widow with improvement: a little less solid but with a better rear post:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_w.jpg[/url])


Two engines on one side and fuselage/cockpit on the other? Is that possible?
Twice as many side gunners with a clear field of fire. Build an opposite handed version to fly on the other side of the bomber formation.
Tophe you are contagious! In a good way!


Hi Tophe: My tin foil hat is not working again.

Here is my P-61 + Do 335 hybrid. It is tentatively labelled the Tu-5 "Fusspot".

(http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n547/CF-101B/Modelling%202016/IMG_3170.jpg)
(http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n547/CF-101B/Modelling%202016/IMG_3172.jpg)
(http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n547/CF-101B/Modelling%202016/IMG_3176.jpg)
(http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n547/CF-101B/Modelling%202016/IMG_3174.jpg)

I have reversed the booms so I have the stabilizers on the outside. It's a pretty good fit. I need to sand the booms down to flatten them. And fix the fuselage between the wings. There is a jet engine in the tail. Missing are the jet intakes.

Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on February 16, 2016, 03:45:55 AM
Carl,,, you be doing great on this. :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: elmayerle on February 16, 2016, 09:19:09 AM
Looks beautiful, Carl, though obviously from an alternate universe where NATO had different naming rules; in ours pro-powered aircraft have single-syllable names.  If you were to follow that rule, may I suggest either "Fuss" or "Flaunt" as possible codenames?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Kerick on February 16, 2016, 11:28:22 AM
That looks crazy! I'll be watching!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Kerick on February 16, 2016, 11:37:38 AM
Thanks to you, dreamer!
And here is the complete set, for best protection:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_y.jpg[/url])


Thanks! Tell me how you make these drawings. they look cool.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 16, 2016, 03:56:21 PM
Here is my P-61 + Do 335 hybrid.
It's a pretty good fit.
It's wonderful, yes! :-* :-* :-*
It will even be marvelous when finished, I am very sure ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 16, 2016, 03:59:41 PM
Tell me how you make these drawings. they look cool.
I draw with Corel Draw vectorial drawing software (Home-X7 version now, 6 before), with a 3-view basis and trigonometrical transformations of mine (explained in my free book "Forked Ghosts"). It is easy and pleasant. If someone else likes the result, the fun is even double... ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: The Big Gimper on February 16, 2016, 06:30:54 PM
Looks beautiful, Carl, though obviously from an alternate universe where NATO had different naming rules; in ours pro-powered aircraft have single-syllable names.  If you were to follow that rule, may I suggest either "Fuss" or "Flaunt" as possible codenames?

Thanks Evan. I had not picked up on the single syllable naming convention. "Floozy" is another candidate.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 17, 2016, 12:37:48 AM
There is a jet engine in the tail. Missing are the jet intakes.
With a pusher radial or jet, I tried to fit an air intake:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_z.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: The Big Gimper on February 17, 2016, 12:55:51 AM
There is a jet engine in the tail. Missing are the jet intakes.
With a pusher radial or jet, I tried to fit an air intake:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_z.jpg[/url])


My intakes (2) will be on the side of the fuselage.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 17, 2016, 12:14:19 PM
You are right: it is better for the pilot's bailing out. (I am a dreamer, not an engineer)...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 17, 2016, 08:14:10 PM
Here is my P-61 + Do 335 hybrid.
There is a jet engine in the tail.

Before reading the "jet" word, your "P-61/Do-335 hybrid" words made me think of a Black Widow without lateral engines:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_aa.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: DFZ on February 17, 2016, 11:55:22 PM
That looks great, Tophe! Looks more German than American, IMHO.
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 18, 2016, 11:55:51 AM
A more Dornierish version was possible, of course:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P-61_ab.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 20, 2016, 09:41:14 PM
Another way would have been a hybrid Do-335 + Do-635 = Do-935 (aka Do-3335):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/DO635Z_al.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 22, 2016, 01:51:57 AM
In 1939, the Dunne Spitfire biplane flying wing was the best in the World as far as dogfighting was concerned:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Spitfire_aab.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 23, 2016, 12:12:15 AM
The Dunne Spitfire-II was even better:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Spitfire_aac.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: DFZ on February 23, 2016, 04:07:00 AM
Those could probably escape getting shot by simply looping over their opponents, right into their six, ready to shoot! ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 23, 2016, 01:12:23 PM
You are probably right, while... the Polikarpov I-15, Fiat CR-42, Gloster Gladiator, were not the very best fighters of WW2 but outdated, as if speed were more important than maneuverability...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 05, 2016, 10:44:53 PM
from http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=6126.30 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=6126.30) (about sexy ugly airplanes):
Tophe, thanks - I can see the first one cruising over Tahiti in the 1930s as an airliner.
Here are in Tahiti or Hawaii the Palm-38A, B, C. I think they are tailsitter VTOLs, because I have seen plam-trees before and all of them were vertical:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairM_aey.jpg)
The B and C with intermshing palms seem to be dangerous, but I like them ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 06, 2016, 02:10:01 PM
Standing, and without tail, this is far more possible:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairM_aez.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on March 08, 2016, 05:09:32 AM

aircraft palmtrees! excellent idea !!
I was just searching for ideas to use a number of kits fuselages I have,
remaining from using the wings with other stuff ...


Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 08, 2016, 12:45:44 PM
aircraft palmtrees! excellent idea !!
No! :( This was just a joke, I swear... Don't build actually aircraft-trees! Oh, Lord... (I am mad and guilty, don't get contaminated...) ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 13, 2016, 01:29:44 PM
I have found a weird twin-boom design, of 1929, by Eddie Rickenbacker, at
http://blog.modernmechanix.com/capt-rickenbackers-airplane-of-the-future/ (http://blog.modernmechanix.com/capt-rickenbackers-airplane-of-the-future/)
and I have imagined Lightning dérivatives of it:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 13, 2016, 11:31:02 PM
And, as doctors said that sitting is bad for the pilots' spine, aircraft were designed with pilots standing or lying (head first or feet first):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairN_aad.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Logan Hartke on March 26, 2016, 05:12:33 AM
Here's a twin-boomer for you, Tophe!

Beriev Be-32 design (http://www.ussr-airspace.com/index.php?main_page=document_general_info&cPath=28_39_38_108&products_id=2244)

Cheers,

Logan
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on March 26, 2016, 06:40:18 AM

nice twin boomer, with 4 engines : the outer ones are very close to the tip of the wings
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 26, 2016, 02:05:06 PM
Thanks Logan for the picture, and for the link explaining this is a 1965 project. I guess I will soon invent a 1945 derivative. Thanks again!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 26, 2016, 05:01:24 PM
Thanks Logan for the picture, and for the link explaining this is a 1965 project. I guess I will soon invent a 1945 derivative. Thanks again!
Here are the Lightning-cargos C-38B-32/33/34 (with improved rear access for loading/unloading)...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairN_aaq.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 06, 2016, 07:15:37 PM
The Zwilling XP-54 was fast...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/XP54PP_ac.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on April 07, 2016, 03:03:22 AM
I like!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 09, 2016, 05:31:12 PM
Thanks!
Of course, Lockheed made similar Twin-Lightnings, and more...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairN_abu.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 23, 2016, 01:05:46 PM
Thanks to the Big Gimper's invention of a F-20XL at http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=6257.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=6257.0)  ;)
here is a Mirage 5 XL:   :)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/Mirage5_aaai_zpsmnylvwsi.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on April 23, 2016, 02:08:04 PM
Liking P-54Z and Mirage 5 XL  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: The Big Gimper on April 23, 2016, 06:32:58 PM
The Mirage 5XL is awesome. Hmmm .... can it be built?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 24, 2016, 11:38:21 AM
Thanks!

For building the Mirage 5XL, well, this would be a hard work in scratch, only someone like the Big Gimper could do it!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ysi_maniac on April 24, 2016, 12:28:49 PM
The Mirage 5XL is awesome. Hmmm .... can it be built?

We can build anything, even the most sensible. ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 24, 2016, 01:37:52 PM
Uh, I know the famous wording "yes we can!" while... as far as I am concerned, I am unable to do it. The wiser would be to say "some of us can"... ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 04, 2016, 01:36:36 AM
The Dornier Do-118 was almost "triple-hull" (alas it was not designed, nor built of course):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on May 04, 2016, 01:46:05 AM
The Dornier Do-118 was almost "triple-hull" (alas it was not designed, nor built of course):

superb!!!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 09, 2016, 02:39:27 AM
Indeed! Great concept Tophe  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 14, 2016, 05:28:11 PM
Thanks!

The Half-asymmetric Bv-141Hs would have been test-beds for the fully asymmetric Bv-141:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 22, 2016, 10:33:58 PM
It seems the Asymmetric-Dakota C-47S was a derivative of the push-pull Twin-Dakota C-147P:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 23, 2016, 11:54:21 AM
Love the Twin-Dak  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 24, 2016, 02:26:34 AM
Thanks!

and here are the asymmetric Spitfire (Mk.61) and asymmetric Twin-Spitfire (Mk.122):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 24, 2016, 09:44:09 AM
Digging those asymmetric Spitfires  :)  Are those cockpit/nose sections from the Supermarine Attacker jet?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 24, 2016, 10:49:56 AM
Thanks!
Well, the cockpit is just the Spitfire Mk.22 one moved forward free of engine there now (not completely free though as military men love a free nose for something else than a pilot or wheel)...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 21, 2016, 11:58:43 PM
A P-47ZD Thunder-Yassin that I imagine bombing Deir Yassin... :(
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 07, 2016, 01:42:48 AM
Thanks to Lauhof52 wonderful profile and directions at http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=167.705 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=167.705)
here are my drawings of:
– P-38T : invention by Lauhof52 from the P-48 Pelican;
– Dust Tactics Allies P-48 Pelican : from Fantasy Flight Games ;
– P-48A and P-48B Tophican : derivatives of mine
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on July 12, 2016, 08:07:54 AM
Oooo ... I really like the P-48A model Tophican  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: DFZ on July 22, 2016, 09:37:20 PM
I'm still thinking about that Mirage 5XL... :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 07, 2016, 02:54:21 PM
Thanks!

And... I am almost sure: before the De Havilland Vampire design was finalized, a separate tails layout was considered, with less risk to burn the tailplane(s):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 17, 2016, 12:39:31 PM
The (secret) Mitsubishi A6M-A (that dropped the atomic bombs on Los Angeles then San Francisco, Sept.1945) was the true winner of the Pacific War:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 28, 2016, 02:57:11 AM
The Gotha Go-442TL was a scaled down Go-242 with 2 jet engines:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 01, 2016, 12:50:24 AM
Smaller than the Percival P.36, the P.360 had 2 engines instead of 6:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 04, 2016, 01:44:04 AM
The push-pull Double-Lightning Dou-38A gave birth to the Dou-38B pusher and the Dou-38C tractor. None was built alas.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 07, 2016, 12:59:19 AM
There was a single-engined single-seat version of the Twin-Mustang, yes! Where? Uh, in my mind, at least... :-\ :icon_crap:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 18, 2016, 02:51:35 AM
Lightning (and Twin-Lightnings) with engined nose(s):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 18, 2016, 04:21:10 PM
Other derivatives of nose-engined Lightnings:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 27, 2016, 12:54:34 PM
After the weird CBY-3 Loadmaster came the CBY-3Z Twin-Loadmaster and CBY-3ZA (Asymmetric) Half-Twin-Loadmaster:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 24, 2016, 12:37:41 AM
Where did the Lightning come from?
In fact, the first ones were made by Mother Nature 38 million years ago. Scientists called these molecules Lightolecula but this name is "modern", dated 1938.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 27, 2016, 07:19:55 PM
The He-111Dop-2 and Dop-3 were not zwilling but twin-boom:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on October 27, 2016, 11:37:51 PM
Niiice,me likey.  :)
What do you say about this?


Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 28, 2016, 03:06:04 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 29, 2016, 11:35:09 PM
What do you say about this?
I say that I love it! :-* Is this your creation?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on October 31, 2016, 10:40:11 PM
Yes, based on a drawing of the real plane found on the Internet few years ago,I found it recently while searching for something through my files.I thought you'll enjoy it.
 ;) :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 31, 2016, 11:08:36 PM
Thanks a lot! I have included it, with your name, on my collection site http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/twin_boom_whatif_1939_45.htm (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/twin_boom_whatif_1939_45.htm)
Thanks again!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 16, 2016, 12:32:40 AM
Here are 2 versions of Mitsubishi asymmetric double-half-Dinah...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Ki46-III_k.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 18, 2016, 02:27:45 PM
a diferent Dinah: single fuselage and symmetric all right, but... twin-boom and TT-tail...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on November 18, 2016, 05:45:36 PM
That's nice  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on November 19, 2016, 02:36:17 AM
I like. :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 19, 2016, 06:10:01 PM
Thanks!

And for the next ones, I would like to thank ericr's great topic http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=4100.0 (http://beyondthesprues.com/Forum/index.php?topic=4100.0) that inspired me very much...
The XFou-38, YFou-38, Fou-38A, Fou-38B were using the code Fou for Fourchette ("fork" in French while "fou" means crazy, mad). They are Lockheed Lightnings technically transformed to provide the Lord Above with a kitchen tool to eat giant potatoes, seriously...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_bz.jpg)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_ca.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on November 19, 2016, 06:27:21 PM
You been depicting a lot of inspiration lately which could be rendered in styrene - thanks  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on November 19, 2016, 07:45:57 PM
 :-* XFou-38 is brilliant
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: CiTrus90 on November 19, 2016, 10:50:39 PM
Giraffe-ish but nice :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on November 21, 2016, 01:49:24 AM
:-* XFou-38 is brilliant

yes! and it is very doable in plastic !!!

Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on November 21, 2016, 01:50:18 AM
Giraffe-ish but nice :)

and Giraffes are great  :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 25, 2016, 02:49:06 AM
Thanks a lot!
So... I go on and on... You know, the A-4F Syhawk with its hump was not the first dromedary airplane: the DDR-38A came before. The B version was more a camel, and the C (C-like-Camel) even featured 4 legs and teeth and no engine...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 27, 2016, 11:48:52 PM
The Spitfire Floatplanes (Floatfires?) are very famous from Real World Officials, but... top secret (or fantasy?) are the Spitfire Flying Boats (Spitfboats):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 10, 2016, 03:27:10 PM
As a revival of the Borel-Odier 1913 (see the magazine "Le Trait d'Union" 290 Nov-Dec2016), the BOd-38A was featuring spat-booms. So did the Bod-38B & C, in a twin-boom way, no more triplex-boom:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_ch.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on December 10, 2016, 11:15:01 PM
Wow these are fantastic, mon ami!

I really like the long fuselage versions you posted on Nov. 19th but of course, the spatted varieties are my favorites!

The third one is most pleasing to me and I think you may have invented tail boom spats!

This is the first time I've ever seen such sweet, streamlined spatted landing gear like this!
 
Very, very wonderful indeed!
 :-* :-* :-*
Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 11, 2016, 02:54:03 PM
Thanks a lot, so wonderful words...

In fact, my delirium may have been the first spat-boom airplanes, but similar occurred with float-boom seaplanes, like the Pierre Levasseur PL.200:
https://www.google.fr/search?q=levasseur+pl-500&biw=1455&bih=705&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwivlaf3wuvQAhWCTRoKHTmJBEgQsAQIGQ#tbm=isch&q=levasseur+pl-200 (https://www.google.fr/search?q=levasseur+pl-500&biw=1455&bih=705&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwivlaf3wuvQAhWCTRoKHTmJBEgQsAQIGQ#tbm=isch&q=levasseur+pl-200)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_ci.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 11, 2016, 03:45:31 PM
In fact, my delirium may have been the first spat-boom airplanes, but similar occurred with float-boom seaplanes, like the Pierre Levasseur PL.200:
[url]https://www.google.fr/search?q=levasseur+pl-[/url]
 ([url]https://www.google.fr/search?q=levasseur+pl-500&biw=1455&bih=705&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwivlaf3wuvQAhWCTRoKHTmJBEgQsAQIGQ#tbm=isch&q=levasseur+pl-200[/url])
In 1928 a Dornier push-pull model featured also float-booms, see http://speedbirds.forumactif.org/t51-les-concepts-allemand-pour-la-coupe-schneider (http://speedbirds.forumactif.org/t51-les-concepts-allemand-pour-la-coupe-schneider)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 14, 2016, 12:19:53 PM
Spat-planes are not my invention (I just applied them to a P-38 basis below): I found them in an Italian magazine of 1936.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on December 14, 2016, 07:34:31 PM
This design is especially nice, Tophe!

The biplane wings perfectly compliment that incredibly streamlined spatted landing gear!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 15, 2016, 01:11:37 AM
Thanks!
The (non-twin-boom) source of spat plane is at www.avia-it.com/act/biblioteca/periodici/PDF%20Riviste/Ala%20d%27Italia/L'ALA%20D'ITALIA%201936%2006.pdf (http://www.avia-it.com/act/biblioteca/periodici/PDF%20Riviste/Ala%20d%27Italia/L'ALA%20D'ITALIA%201936%2006.pdf)
page 41 of the magazine of 1936 = page 34/68 of the pdf file.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on December 15, 2016, 02:03:30 AM
That's some great research, mon ami!

I've never come across this design before. It reminds me of the famous DH Dragon Rapide but with much more streamlined landing gear!

Great find, Tophe! Thank you for posting!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 17, 2016, 02:10:32 AM
Thanks!

It reminds me of the famous DH Dragon Rapide

Ahem... the Dragon Rapide (as well as the Lightning Rapide below) has no "spats holding wings", this is less sexy... ;)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v670/Tophe2712/P38eclairQ_co_zps49napgof.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 18, 2016, 07:38:00 PM
Lightning quadricopters inspired by the Ehang-184:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_ct.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 06, 2017, 02:33:04 PM
The P-38 Lightning's nose was long for the nose-wheel mainly (I don't like guns), but with 2 noses, only one side needs this long nose, providing a new kind of asymmetry... (P-38ANNW-1 & -2):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_dc.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 13, 2017, 01:00:51 PM
The P-38LR had lots of room for fuel:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: tankmodeler on January 14, 2017, 03:46:52 AM
The P-38 Lightning's nose was long for the nose-wheel mainly (I don't like guns), but with 2 noses, only one side needs this long nose, providing a new kind of asymmetry... (P-38ANNW-1 & -2):
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_dc.jpg[/url])

What purpose does the asymmetric or double pod design serve?  Two pods like that, so close together, cause greatly increased drag so doing it needs some sort of reason.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: tankmodeler on January 14, 2017, 03:48:32 AM
The P-38LR had lots of room for fuel:
The rear landing gear really shouldn't be that far back the aircraft; would break the nose gear during landing rotation.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 14, 2017, 03:51:07 AM
What purpose does the asymmetric or double pod design serve?  Two pods like that, so close together, cause greatly increased drag so doing it needs some sort of reason.

Does it need a reason beyond artistic aesthetics?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 14, 2017, 03:47:44 PM
The P-38LR had lots of room for fuel:
The rear landing gear really shouldn't be that far back the aircraft; would break the nose gear during landing rotation.
why was the SE-100 built then ? I think it can work, maybe this is not the best, but there is probably a balance to decide. :)


What purpose does the asymmetric or double pod design serve?  Two pods like that, so close together, cause greatly increased drag so doing it needs some sort of reason.
Does it need a reason beyond artistic aesthetics?
Thanks GTX. Anyway, I can invent a little reason: the second nose (cockpit-less) is holding the front landing gear, without mixing this with holding cockpit. Maybe the boss of the design bureau would refuse it immediately (without ever building it, without proposing it to customer) but a bad student in design could have proposed it to the design team, this is enough for me ;)

Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: tankmodeler on January 17, 2017, 05:11:42 AM
why was the SE-100 built then ? I think it can work, maybe this is not the best, but there is probably a balance to decide. :)
To be honest, it's sometime hard to understand why the French aircraft designers of the 20s and 30s did anything as they made an awful lot of really bad mistakes (frequently resulting in appallingly ugly aircraft). In this case it appears that the intent was to reduce landing gear weight. However, if you look at the SE 100, you'll see that the nose gear is enormous. In order to accommodate the wheels in the tail and to reduce the amount the nose drops after landing, the fuselage is also swept downward to place the tailplane and wheels closer to the ground without needing landing gear legs at all. What you don't see is that the tail structure has had to be beefed up to take the loads considerably more than otherwise.

There's a reason other aircraft didn't copy this arrangement. It's overly heavy, if somewhat simpler, mechanically.

What purpose does the asymmetric or double pod design serve?  Two pods like that, so close together, cause greatly increased drag so doing it needs some sort of reason.
Does it need a reason beyond artistic aesthetics?

To me it does because Tophe is drawing airplanes and airplanes come with a body of knowledge and physics that define certain aspects of their shape and function. There are a couple of sayings in the aircraft design world, one is "form follows function" and the other is "if it looks right it is right". Regarding the first, drawing something where the form violates that body out knowledge without some functional justification pushes the design aesthetically into the "unattractive" regime. Pushed too far and it no longer "looks right" and so isn't right. It jars against the senses of what looks right and, again, becomes unattractive.

I realise we're discussing (arguing) matters of taste here. I'm by no means unimaginative or unwilling to take aesthetic leaps, but for me (again, I stress for me) if one is going to use aircraft elements as purely aesthetic elements, why bother retaining any of the forms of physical reality? Why have the wings horizontal? Why have the wheels on the bottom? If it's pure art, why be limited to any of the strictures of reality? However if you are limiting yourself to even most of the structures of real life, then you also start to become affected by the aesthetics and physics of real life, in which case things need some sort of internally coherent rationale for their existence. And, if they speak reasonably to that rationale become able to be appreciated for their aesthetics.

In other words, if one insists on drawing something that looks like an airplane one leaves oneself open to the design being critiqued as an airplane and not as cubist or surrealist art. Make it obviously art and the airplane critiques would fall away and the pure aesthetics become the reason for viewing, not the airplane-ness.

Paul
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Volkodav on January 17, 2017, 05:31:11 PM
At least the wheels have the correct number of spokes and there is not a dodgy old style Tamiya track in sight.  ;)

Keep up the good work Tophe, your work never fails to bring a smile to my face.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 18, 2017, 02:11:10 AM
Thanks a lot VolkoDav!

But, sorry, I will be serious now, even over serious. Today at my lab (microbiological lab), we received the new bacteria threatening the World, having killed already 6 billion human beings, and more soon... this was a Gram positive bug, with a shape of... ahem, a "twin-boom" thingy... (CIP means Collection Institut Pasteur, or maybe Cargo Intelligent Pursuit). ??? >:D
(the view below is enlarged by a 1,000,000 factor)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: jcf on January 18, 2017, 10:01:19 AM
 ;D  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: jcf on January 18, 2017, 10:22:43 AM
why was the SE-100 built then ? I think it can work, maybe this is not the best, but there is probably a balance to decide. :)
To be honest, it's sometime hard to understand why the French aircraft designers of the 20s and 30s did anything as they made an awful lot of really bad mistakes (frequently resulting in appallingly ugly aircraft). In this case it appears that the intent was to reduce landing gear weight. However, if you look at the SE 100, you'll see that the nose gear is enormous. In order to accommodate the wheels in the tail and to reduce the amount the nose drops after landing, the fuselage is also swept downward to place the tailplane and wheels closer to the ground without needing landing gear legs at all. What you don't see is that the tail structure has had to be beefed up to take the loads considerably more than otherwise.

There's a reason other aircraft didn't copy this arrangement. It's overly heavy, if somewhat simpler, mechanically.

What purpose does the asymmetric or double pod design serve?  Two pods like that, so close together, cause greatly increased drag so doing it needs some sort of reason.
Does it need a reason beyond artistic aesthetics?

To me it does because Tophe is drawing airplanes and airplanes come with a body of knowledge and physics that define certain aspects of their shape and function. There are a couple of sayings in the aircraft design world, one is "form follows function" and the other is "if it looks right it is right". Regarding the first, drawing something where the form violates that body out knowledge without some functional justification pushes the design aesthetically into the "unattractive" regime. Pushed too far and it no longer "looks right" and so isn't right. It jars against the senses of what looks right and, again, becomes unattractive.

I realise we're discussing (arguing) matters of taste here. I'm by no means unimaginative or unwilling to take aesthetic leaps, but for me (again, I stress for me) if one is going to use aircraft elements as purely aesthetic elements, why bother retaining any of the forms of physical reality? Why have the wings horizontal? Why have the wheels on the bottom? If it's pure art, why be limited to any of the strictures of reality? However if you are limiting yourself to even most of the structures of real life, then you also start to become affected by the aesthetics and physics of real life, in which case things need some sort of internally coherent rationale for their existence. And, if they speak reasonably to that rationale become able to be appreciated for their aesthetics.

In other words, if one insists on drawing something that looks like an airplane one leaves oneself open to the design being critiqued as an airplane and not as cubist or surrealist art. Make it obviously art and the airplane critiques would fall away and the pure aesthetics become the reason for viewing, not the airplane-ness.

Paul

Nobody else is critiquing anything, you're the only person making an issue out of his whimsy.

BTW 'form follows function', an expression coined in 1896, comes from modernist architecture and industrial design, not aircraft design. Also, the other hoary expression, as occasionally used in an aircraft context, isn't "if it looks right it is right", rather it is stated as "if it looks right, it'll fly right". Anyhow, while 'form follows function' is an actual design maxim, and often used in opposition to pre-existing aesthetic standards, particularly those of pre-20th century architecture and design, the latter expression is not.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 19, 2017, 12:44:23 AM
It seems the word "art" may be inappropriate, I prefer "fantasy", "fun", I do not pretend to reach "objective beauty".
I do like transforming a little an aircraft into something impossible, or obviously wrong (to be rejected, not built and flown at all).
The argument "if I draw an airplane, I accept to be criticized if this is a bad airplane for customers" is completely wrong: I am not at all a professional engineer taking money from customers, coming after pleasant advertisement, not at all. I am a lab-tech in microbiology, just playing (in the evening) in inventing crazy shapes inspired by airplanes. If Walt Disney draws a mouse that speaks, will you criticize him because mouses are real animal and real mouses don't speak? please shut up and let the dreamers dream. if you don't like this, feel free to follow your own way, but don't come here to criticize. My son is 7 years old and I learn to him "be gentle and the others may be gentle with you, if you are bad with the others they will be angry and so they will be bad with you, this is a bad calculation for you". You should complain about your father, having not learned you life properly, killermodeler.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Kerick on January 19, 2017, 07:33:57 AM
Build what you want to build, draw what you want to draw!
This is all about having fun so do it the way you like!
Speaking for myself, if I like something I try to say something positive and encouraging. If I don't like it, I just let it pass.
Tophe, I love your imagination! Keep doing what you do so well.....
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 19, 2017, 11:19:55 AM
Thanks a lot kerick.
I feel almost like you. The only little point to add is that I do like the opinion of our engineer elmayerle: he may smile gently about a crazy delirium of us then add that of course it cannot work because of this and this technical reasons. That is not criticizing severely (meaning "stupid, bad"!) but showing why engineers don't use such a recipe, which is thus simply pleasant delirium like science-fiction, or fantasy without even science.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: taiidantomcat on January 20, 2017, 05:28:37 AM

To me it does because Tophe is drawing airplanes and airplanes come with a body of knowledge and physics that define certain aspects of their shape and function. There are a couple of sayings in the aircraft design world, one is "form follows function" and the other is "if it looks right it is right". Regarding the first, drawing something where the form violates that body out knowledge without some functional justification pushes the design aesthetically into the "unattractive" regime. Pushed too far and it no longer "looks right" and so isn't right. It jars against the senses of what looks right and, again, becomes unattractive.





There is no engineering or scientific "rule" about "looks right is right" as looks are utterly subjective. its nothing more than an aphorism.  The F4U corsair doesn't "look right" it only "looks right" because the design is known. Lots of things that don't look right are right. All the Guppy planes, Helicopters, etc in fact SLUFs and BUFFs, F-4s, are "proudly" ugly and not right looking.

(http://armored-column.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/a10-fb-cover.jpg)

The poster child of doesn't look right, but is right.


Looks right/is right is often a HINDSIGHT judgement as well.


Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Kerick on January 20, 2017, 11:22:12 AM
IIRC the comment from a general when he first saw the F-4 Phantom was that it looked like some one had stepped on its nose and kicked it in the butt!

There is quite a difference between engineers and artists, thank heaven!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 20, 2017, 11:58:44 AM
I am not an engineer and I do not want at all to seduce a general: I am simply a (childish) dreamer and a (naive) pacifist.

PS. Sorry for my imperfect English, it seems I mixed "learn" and "teach", that are the same word in my language ("apprendre")
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 20, 2017, 01:48:33 PM
As an example: today I have drawn 3 new Lightnings, and I do not pretend at all they are very good, to be built and flown and ordered and operated, no they are completely crazy and of course will (would) be rejected, I am just having fun drawing them. If that makes you smile I am happy, but if you don't like just go elsewhere, no need to shout that I am stupid, no I am a dreamer only...
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_dw.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 21, 2017, 07:00:38 PM
1975, France: before being accused to have illegally copied the General Dynamics F-16 into the Mirage F1.6, Dassault Aviation made a complaint towards General Dynamics, for having illegally copied their Mirage F1.6 project... who was right? ;) (Dassault according to the French judge, G.D. according to the American one...)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 22, 2017, 05:54:53 PM
The trial lasted till 1976, when another issue occurred at the tribunal: a complaint against Aerospatiale and UK, "guilty" to have copied the twin-engined Mirage-1980 with their "Concorde"... ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on January 27, 2017, 09:45:15 AM
Nice! Makes me think of the single-engined BAC 221/Fairey Delta make-over  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 28, 2017, 11:51:18 PM
Thanks!

Was the Spat-Vampire the very first jet-plane with spats?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/DH100-106_h.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 12, 2017, 10:52:39 PM
The DB-610 powered Fokker "D-23 II" of 1945 did not need 2 separate engines anymore:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/D23_II.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on February 13, 2017, 02:32:18 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on February 13, 2017, 10:44:18 AM
Lovely! Your D-23 II is a great blend of push-pull Fokker D-XXIII and de Schelde S.21  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 20, 2017, 05:12:03 PM
Thanks!
And did you know that the farmer Airtruk was a derivative of the P-38? Here are the missing links:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on February 20, 2017, 05:38:59 PM
Now I know  ;D  I especially like the biplane P-38 Airtruk  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 26, 2017, 07:10:50 PM
Thanks!
And here are designs to refuse (by the boss of the design bureau, on April 1st) for sure: P-38ESM, P-38WI, P-38AP (Et Si Jamais = French words for And If Ever, What If, Almost Possible):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on February 26, 2017, 07:37:38 PM
The ''Almost Possible'' version is on my taste...definitely!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on February 27, 2017, 03:22:02 AM
The AP version looks a bit like this one that I did ages ago:

(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/P38RTop.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on February 27, 2017, 03:28:44 AM
Heeeey I forgot this one!Awesome!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on February 27, 2017, 07:04:27 AM
The AP version looks a bit like this one that I did ages ago:

Shades of the Airspeed  AS.31  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 06, 2017, 01:55:24 AM
Thanks! Years ago, I drew a P-38AS-31 (below left):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairQ_at.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Kerick on March 06, 2017, 01:12:17 PM
The AP version looks a bit like this one that I did ages ago:

([url]http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e68/GTwiner/More%20Creations/P38RTop.jpg[/url])


Cut the two out side booms off and it looks a little retro Naboo!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 07, 2017, 12:29:08 AM
Cut the two out side booms off and it looks a little retro Naboo!
Like this? Thanks!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on March 07, 2017, 05:23:18 AM
 ;D looks very good
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Kerick on March 07, 2017, 08:27:44 AM
Take the first image, remove the center engine and blend the center pod into the wing and it would be perfect.
Oh, and make it very shiny!!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 07, 2017, 01:26:12 PM
Thanks AXOR!

Like this, Kerick?:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 15, 2017, 01:19:55 PM
These Lightnings L-3800/3801/3802 prove that the Lockheed TriStar, later, was not a copy of the Douglas DC-10:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 15, 2017, 08:13:44 PM
The L-3803 was an airliner:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 16, 2017, 03:37:37 AM
Another jet-Lightning was smaller/different, and built by VFW-Fokker (VFW-338):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 17, 2017, 01:24:23 AM
Another combination of Jet-Lightning:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on March 17, 2017, 01:42:00 AM
Now you just need a version with the L1011's tail jet-intake 'S' bend  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 17, 2017, 02:23:46 PM
Thanks! Here are the Lockheed-Apophenia L-3811, 3812, 3813!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 17, 2017, 03:07:22 PM
The L-3813 won all the contracts in America, with the "great" advantage that rich passengers have not to suffer the bad smell of poor passengers... :( ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 24, 2017, 01:53:19 AM
There were also single-jet Lightnings:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairR_as.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 25, 2017, 03:55:21 PM
The RF-13 Reco-Fortress was the best fortress for observation:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on March 26, 2017, 03:12:20 AM
Interesting
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on March 29, 2017, 01:49:55 PM
The RF-13 Reco-Fortress was the best fortress for observation:

Nice - like to build this one.  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 30, 2017, 01:34:37 AM
Building it as scale model? Interesting... but... to have the same tail area, I have used a 70% ratio (square root of 2, divided by 2, equals abour 70%. So twice the square of it gives the same as the source, and mixing 144th/72nd does not fit: 50%, 72nd/48th makes 67% maybe acceptable but I fear there is no 1/48 kit for the B-29...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on March 30, 2017, 03:01:41 PM
Those are informed comments. :)
What I would check out is starting with 1/72 B-29.
Besides 1/144 B-29; measured two box scale kits at approx 1/130 and 1/120.  See if one of those fits/looks close enough for styrene imagineering.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 04, 2017, 12:27:00 PM
Do you want me to draw an 1/72 + 1/125 combination? This is rather easy. Just confirm and I will (someday, maybe not immediately).
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on April 04, 2017, 12:33:06 PM
Thanks.  Please do when convenient.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 05, 2017, 12:31:02 AM
I found time to do it today, at last: :)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/B29z_ab.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 09, 2017, 02:47:47 PM
The RF-13C had internal booms and non-reduced tailplanes (because not doubled):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 09, 2017, 11:50:14 PM
But, as far as I am concerned, I prefer the asymmetric RF-13D:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 15, 2017, 02:40:53 PM
Where did the Lockheed P-38 come from? A tailless fighter design, it seems, years before the Northrop XP-56:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on April 15, 2017, 03:01:46 PM
Appreciate B-29 based recon configurations.
Makes building one more plausible.
Thanks
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 15, 2017, 09:14:15 PM
Thanks to you...
If you have other ideas about a double-tail B-29, maybe I could illustrate this.

In the meantime, I go on with my Lightning delirium: here are parasol-wing Lightnings (the Floaty GB is finished so I post this here)...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 15, 2017, 09:42:25 PM
If you have other ideas about a double-tail B-29, maybe I could illustrate this.
Ahem... by "double-tail", I was not meaning double-fin single-tail (Bf-110-like) but twin-tail-boom or twin-fuselage...
Even if a twin-fin design may be doubled too:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 18, 2017, 01:47:39 PM
IEEP-38A, B, C: Lightnings with "Internal Engines External Propellers":
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 24, 2017, 05:30:40 PM
This Foto-Fortress could be built 1/144 with sprues I think:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 26, 2017, 05:30:37 PM
The Lockheed L-381/382/383 were civilian Lightnings, with no need of high speed nor weapons in the nose(s):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 29, 2017, 04:03:35 PM
There were Lightning cargos too:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairR_ce.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on April 29, 2017, 04:05:46 PM
Hearing the word "Lightning car-go", customers required a "Lightning car" (flying car), and a P-38 was transformed into this:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on April 30, 2017, 03:31:29 AM
I like those cargo Lightnings  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 05, 2017, 12:48:19 PM
Thanks!
And here are Lightnings with extra booms:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairR_cm.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 08, 2017, 01:58:07 AM
Completed into twin-boom or else twin-engined way:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 20, 2017, 11:30:01 PM
Two Tandem-Twin-Lightnings:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairR_cx.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 26, 2017, 12:03:38 AM
Before the SAAB J.21R (reaktor), a J.21J (jet) could have been designed:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/J21h.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: The Big Gimper on May 26, 2017, 12:35:29 AM
Before the SAAB J.21R (reaktor), a J.21J (jet) could have been designed:
([url]http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/J21h.jpg[/url])


I like this design. Something to consider in building in 3D.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 26, 2017, 01:39:58 AM
Thanks! And with 2 pusher turboprops:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 26, 2017, 01:59:58 AM
Very nice! Another possible J 21 variant might be retaining the J 21A's DB 605A pusher but adding your two outer wing turbojets.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 26, 2017, 12:02:37 PM
Yes, we can!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on May 26, 2017, 06:52:50 PM
J-21 ramjet,cool idea!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 27, 2017, 03:46:06 AM
How about a four seat (2+2) civilian version?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 27, 2017, 10:44:45 AM
Yes! Thanks!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 28, 2017, 03:04:24 AM
Looking good - maybe modify it back to a piston engine pusher without the wing engines.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on May 29, 2017, 01:50:35 AM
Thanks again!:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on May 29, 2017, 02:05:55 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on May 30, 2017, 02:48:14 AM
Very clever! I love how you've moved the Daimler engine to the nose on the transport pusher  :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on June 11, 2017, 11:57:35 PM
Thanks!

Now more serious (historically): the Suomi-Lightning was perfect for the Finland forest landscape, in summer colour or winter colour, and even for Christmas day:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairR_ee.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on June 12, 2017, 12:06:38 AM
(http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/21.gif)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on June 12, 2017, 01:33:14 AM

very ecological  ;D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 01, 2017, 08:44:29 PM
 ;)

And Secretprojects is saying a two-seat P-38 trainer, coded T-38, was considered then cancelled.
Let me imagine the XT-38, YT-38, ZT-38:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairS_af.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on July 02, 2017, 02:18:51 AM
 :)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 09, 2017, 01:00:32 PM
Thanks!

The Burnelli/CCF CBY-3 Loadmaster may have been the best twin-engined cargo ever! but... just a 2-engine proposal failed to convince many customers, so a single-engine version and a 3-engined version were added:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/cby3_g2.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on July 11, 2017, 02:50:02 AM
Love the CCF CBY-3 variants  :)  How about a Loadmaster with twin engines mounted on top of the vertical tails (and an extra nose- loading door)?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 11, 2017, 11:23:09 AM
Thanks Apophenia!
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/cby3_m2.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on July 25, 2017, 11:12:47 AM
For weight centering reasons, the CBY-3.4 was modified, using pylons
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/cby3_aa.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on August 19, 2017, 12:48:56 PM
To demonstrate his lifting fuselage layout was the best, Eng. Burnelli proposed to build a normal CBadY-3, to compare and judge objectively:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 03, 2017, 05:13:08 PM
The Burnelli layout was sometimes called "flying wing" and not to be classified among twin-boomers, some "improvement" was necessary:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on September 10, 2017, 01:34:02 PM
In 1939, the Fokker G.1 was seen as the best fighter in the World, but... too expensive, so a single-engined version, using the same manufacturing tools (so: asymmetric...), was proposed:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on September 12, 2017, 05:45:23 AM
Like that lop-sided Fokker  :D
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 10, 2017, 11:00:15 PM
Thanks!
And do you know the twin-tail-boom Mirage? (TT-tail):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Mirage5_aaao.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 11, 2017, 04:23:42 PM
I have downloaded the 2,753 pictures on my Photobucket account, and I have started building a new site with them:
http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/miraj_&.htm (http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/miraj_&.htm)
I have included new ones also, not going on PhotoBucket anymore, the twin-boom Mirage of yesterday, and a modified Twin-Kfir today. For this one, I would like to add the source, but Google does not find it anymore. It seems this is the picture that inspired Italeri box art but without Serial Nr on the fin.
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 12, 2017, 11:00:59 AM
A slightly modified "Mirage-bipoutre" (twin-boom Mirage):
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Mirage5_aaap.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: finsrin on October 12, 2017, 11:06:15 AM
Mirage 5 Bip2 and CBY-3.5 are particularly interesting concepts with styrene build potential  :smiley:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 12, 2017, 12:40:34 PM
Thanks! And here is another twin-boom Mirage: with separate tails "à-la-He111Z":
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: john_matthews129 on October 13, 2017, 10:48:48 PM
Of your two Mirage concepts, I really like the BIP2 best.  Finsrin's right, it would make for a really interesting modification to a styrene Mirage model.  Nice work!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 21, 2017, 11:48:33 AM
Thanks!

When appeared the YF-107 Ultra-Sabre (after the F-100 Super-Sabre, after the F-86 Sabre), Dassault engineers proposed the Ultra-Mirage 507 (after the Super-Mirage 500, after the Mirage 5):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on October 21, 2017, 04:23:04 PM
Looks a little bit weird but interesting,I also like Mirage 5 Bip'
 :smiley:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 21, 2017, 06:06:48 PM
Thanks Alex!

the Ultra-Mirage 507 (after the Super-Mirage 500, after the Mirage 5):
I forgot: did you know the Mirage-500?
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Mirage5_aaas.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 21, 2017, 06:23:53 PM
And the final design was the Top-Mirage 508:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: ericr on October 21, 2017, 07:27:49 PM

wah !

this one seems quite buildable !

(and, if I remember well, I do have 3 Mirages in my stash somewhere ...  :o )
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on October 22, 2017, 05:32:39 AM
Lovely...the last one is quite impressive !  :smiley:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Empty Handed on October 22, 2017, 05:26:38 PM
Thought provoking ideas here. I particularly like the Ultra-Mirage with the dorsal intake!
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 23, 2017, 02:12:21 AM
Lovely...the last one is quite impressive !  :smiley:

Agreed
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on October 23, 2017, 02:13:32 AM
Thanks!

When appeared the YF-107 Ultra-Sabre (after the F-100 Super-Sabre, after the F-86 Sabre), Dassault engineers proposed the Ultra-Mirage 507 (after the Super-Mirage 500, after the Mirage 5):

Give it 3 engines and call it a "Viper" ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 25, 2017, 12:26:06 AM
When appeared the YF-107 Ultra-Sabre (after the F-100 Super-Sabre, after the F-86 Sabre), Dassault engineers proposed the Ultra-Mirage 507 (after the Super-Mirage 500, after the Mirage 5):

Give it 3 engines and call it a "Viper" ;)
Uh, 3 engines with some above? I try... ;)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/Mirage5_aaav.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 27, 2017, 01:38:12 PM
For the transsonic (not supersonic) version of the Mirage 5, no need of afterburner nor axial turbojet: the DH-100 Vampire gave better ideas, and with a discount on the copyright, this gave the Mirage 5-100:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on October 27, 2017, 05:16:43 PM
That's nice  :smiley:

A small modification to improve fins structure .

Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 27, 2017, 06:41:02 PM
Very good :-*
Thanks for this improvement! :smiley:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: john_matthews129 on October 30, 2017, 12:49:18 PM
And the final design was the Top-Mirage 508:

Definitely my favorite. 
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on October 31, 2017, 01:26:31 PM
Thanks!
And I tell you a secret: the Mirage 508 was just the first of a family, with long range zwilling and short-range asymmetric:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on November 22, 2017, 02:14:11 AM
The Mirage-furtif was using American technology, it seems:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 01, 2017, 02:42:19 AM
A little different from the XP-54 and YF-54, the F-54A was canard and slightly asymmetric:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on December 02, 2017, 03:18:09 AM
I like. :smiley:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 05, 2017, 03:34:48 AM
Thanks!

Now Intermeshing-Propellers Double-Lightnings and Asymmetric-Lightnings:
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairT_ac.jpg)
(http://www.kristofmeunier.fr/P38eclairT_ad.jpg)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on December 05, 2017, 08:16:58 AM
Great stuff ... love your 4-engined versions  :-*
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 19, 2017, 02:39:29 AM
Thanks apophenia!

Now, more serious: the Mirage with double nose was a trainer: two cockpits with two radars sharing the same engine (low cost supersonic training):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on December 19, 2017, 07:47:56 AM
Hmmm ... how about a Double-Nez 2 with wider cockpit spacing and the jet intake between the noses?
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on December 19, 2017, 02:11:19 PM
Thanks! Here she is:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: apophenia on December 20, 2017, 07:37:31 AM
Love it! And the pilots can use sign language to communicate is the intercom fails  ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 02, 2018, 01:32:41 AM
Thanks!

And between the De Havilland DH-100 Vampire and the DH-110 Vixen was the DH-100/110 Vampxen, a Vampire with test of double engine and swept wing:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: lippischh on January 02, 2018, 04:47:42 AM
It would be really interesting if one could write some code to shuffle these configurations around.

Choose an aircraft, then run the code to generate multiple crazy configurations out of them. That would be fun !  :))
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on January 12, 2018, 01:43:56 PM
Thanks for this idea, for some future...

In the meantime, I have made the drawing of the MiG-3 according to my usual angle. I plan to build a 1/72 MiG-3 that I got for Christmas from Unicraft models and, before that, I may play with the drawing, imagining Zwilling MiG-3Z:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: GTX_Admin on January 13, 2018, 04:19:05 AM
 :smiley:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 05, 2018, 12:28:57 AM
Thanks!
And after the failure of the XP-55 (Ascender), and the order of Zwilling P-55A, B, C, D (Twin-Ascender), the next version was the push-pull P-55E-4, with 4 engines:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on February 05, 2018, 12:38:40 AM
Well,that's nice....a jet version would fit perfectly in ''Allies 46 GB'' ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 12, 2018, 01:16:16 PM
Thanks, I followed your suggestion.
And now a fighter before 1946, the tandem-piston-engined Boulton-Paul P.99B:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: AXOR on February 12, 2018, 06:21:44 PM
I like it,especially the long nose version...it reminds me of Vultee XP-54.
 :smiley:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 13, 2018, 03:09:20 PM
Thanks!
The top one was the P.99 "real" project.
Below was the P.99B fantasy of mine :-\ ;)
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on February 14, 2018, 01:04:39 AM
There were derivatives of both the P.99 and P-38: BP.38A, B, Z. But this was in a foreign country (named MyDreams):
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 05, 2018, 01:07:03 AM
The different versions of Boeing 368 being rejected, a mix (between 2 of them) was tried, but rejected also:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 20, 2018, 02:33:28 PM
4-engined Lightnings of different kinds:
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 24, 2018, 02:01:53 PM
A mysterious historian, X.Tauf, pretends this is the true genesis of the P-38 Lightning:
- first a single-boom plane
- then a vertical zwilling, with intermeshing propellers
- then a vertical twin-boom biplane
(- then a horizontal twin-boom monoplane)
Who knows? Maybe this is the secret truth...
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Brian da Basher on March 25, 2018, 09:02:39 PM
Great stuff, mon ami!

I especially like the second one with two P-38s stacked on top of each other like that.

Most delightful, Tophe!

Brian da Basher
Title: Re: Tophe's slanting views
Post by: Tophe on March 26, 2018, 04:24:49 PM
Thanks!
Then I have invented "delta booms"... :-\ ??? ;)